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Old 09-25-2012, 07:06 AM
Neal Murphy
 
Default Installation

On Tuesday, September 25, 2012 02:26:11 AM Chris Bannister wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 04:12:31PM +0000, Camaleón wrote:
> > Okay, I agree the user does not need to hold a MS in Computer Science as
> > a previous requirement for installing an OS and managing a computer.
>
> But an MS in Astronomy (Astrophysics?) won't help you build a telescope
> either. Remember, a computer is to Computer Science as a telescope is to
> Astronomy.

Thinking on this, a computer is to Computer Science as a computer is to
Astrophysics. In fact, computers have become the basic tools of many
disciplines: entertainment, automotive design and operation, mechanical
engineering, civil engineering, electronic engineering, astrophysics, several
aspects of medicine, law enforcement, civil governance, navigation, and
subterranean resource exploration to name a few. CS professionals are the
'tool & die' makers of the virtual world.

System installation should be as automated as is possible. In fact, the
installer should ask as few questions as possible. One such question might be,
"Where are you?" Suitable answers might be the person's
city/village/state/county/country, zip/postal code, lat/lon, or something like
"near Lyons, France". Combining the answer and the answer's language with the
automatically-obtained IP address should allow the installer to deduce correct
settings for many of the questions currently asked. But that's a lot to ask, I
guess.


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Old 09-25-2012, 07:25 AM
"Weaver"
 
Default Installation

On Mon, September 24, 2012 10:33 pm, Chris Bannister wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 02:15:23PM -0700, Weaver wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, September 17, 2012 8:11 am, Chris Bannister wrote:
>> >
>> > Unless you submit it against d-i as a patch, there *is* no onward. If
>> it
>> > gets rejected, there should be an explanation as to why.
>> >
>> > Patches are still being accepted against d-i, but hurry.
>>
>> Done!
>
> Ummm, can't see it. What is the bugnumber?

Joined the list and emailed it in.

Tried bug-report but it wouldn't accept terms like 'installer'
installation' etc., with a continuous feedback of 'no such package', so I
tried 'Other', which appeared to be the only open option, and that wasn't
accepted either, so I just went to the debian-boot list, which is
apparently who handle it.

No reaction, as the usual noise element was taking up space and probably
enough of a distraction for it to slip through unnoticed.
Regards,

Weaver.
>
> --
> "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people
> who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the
> oppressing." --- Malcolm X
>
>
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>


--
"It is the duty of the patriot to protect his country from its government."
-- Thomas Paine

Registered Linux User: 554515



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Old 09-25-2012, 08:13 AM
Ralf Mardorf
 
Default Installation

On Tue, 2012-09-25 at 18:38 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote:
> Tell that to Mr Balmer, but don't stand too close.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S30WdoEHCH4&feature=related



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Old 09-25-2012, 12:18 PM
John Hasler
 
Default Installation

lee writes:
> I've bought something, so I can sell it. I haven't signed any
> contract whatsoever that says that I can't sell it. That's all there
> is to it.

That is the law here in the USA as well, though Microsoft et al. seem
to have convinced some that it isn't.
--
John Hasler


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Old 09-25-2012, 12:26 PM
John Hasler
 
Default Installation

lee writes:
> You are talking about some law that involves "copies" without
> explaining what a "copy" is.

Under USA copyright law a "copy" is a tangible object which embodies a
"work" (an intangible). Subject to some limitations, the creation of
"copies" is the exclusive right of the owner of the copyright (an
intangible right) in the work. Copyright law gives the owner of the
copyright in a work no control over the disposition of copies once they
have been created: they are ordinary chattel property just like apples
or hammers.
--
John Hasler


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Old 09-25-2012, 01:02 PM
The Wanderer
 
Default Installation

On 09/25/2012 03:25 AM, Weaver wrote:


On Mon, September 24, 2012 10:33 pm, Chris Bannister wrote:


On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 02:15:23PM -0700, Weaver wrote:


On Mon, September 17, 2012 8:11 am, Chris Bannister wrote:



Patches are still being accepted against d-i, but hurry.


Done!


Ummm, can't see it. What is the bugnumber?


Joined the list and emailed it in.

Tried bug-report but it wouldn't accept terms like 'installer' installation'
etc., with a continuous feedback of 'no such package', so I tried 'Other',
which appeared to be the only open option, and that wasn't accepted either,
so I just went to the debian-boot list, which is apparently who handle it.


Did you try the 'debian-installer' package? (That being what 'd-i' is short
for.)

--
The Wanderer

Warning: Simply because I argue an issue does not mean I agree with any
side of it.

Every time you let somebody set a limit they start moving it.
- LiveJournal user antonia_tiger


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Old 09-25-2012, 01:02 PM
The Wanderer
 
Default Installation

On 09/25/2012 02:56 AM, Chris Bannister wrote:


On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 06:33:02PM +0200, lee wrote:


They even have begun to use different keys to get into the BIOS quite some
time ago.


Really? Have you got a source for that allegation?


http://www.mydigitallife.info/comprehensive-list-of-how-key-to-press-to-access-bios-for-various-oem-and-computer-systems/
http://www.cpucare.net/Hardware/BIOS/Access_BIOS.htm
http://michaelstevenstech.com/bios_manufacturer.htm
http://www.computerhope.com/issues/ch000192.htmhttp://pcsupport.about.com/od/fixtheproblem/a/biosaccess_pc.htm

All from the first page of Google hits for 'BIOS key'. Not all of them support
the "quite some time ago" part of the claim (though at least one indicates that
the nonuniformity dates back as far as the early '90s), but they all support the
proposition that there is considerable variation in what keys are used.

Off the top of my head, I've personally seen computers where the "key you press
during POST to enter the BIOS" is Esc, Del, F2, and F12 - only ever one per
computer, and usually consistent per BIOS model, but not beyond that. I'm sure
there are others; I vaguely recall I may have seen one where it was Tab.

As I believe has been pointed out, however, this is by now rather offtopic...

--
The Wanderer

Warning: Simply because I argue an issue does not mean I agree with any
side of it.

Every time you let somebody set a limit they start moving it.
- LiveJournal user antonia_tiger


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Old 09-25-2012, 01:03 PM
Celejar
 
Default Installation

On Tue, 25 Sep 2012 00:28:58 +0200
lee <lee@yun.yagibdah.de> wrote:

> Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> writes:
>
> > On Sun, 23 Sep 2012 22:52:38 +0200
> > lee <lee@yun.yagibdah.de> wrote:
> >>
> >> [shrugs] I don't know about that and I don't care. If someone would
> >> buy it, it's not up to me what they do with it.
> >
> > I'm not sure if you're expressing your personal morality here, or your
> > understanding of the law. If the latter, you are wrong, at least as a
> > matter of US law (although you state in a different post that "American
> > law doesn't apply here", whatever that means).
>
> It means that American law doesn't apply here. Perhaps you are in
> America and it applies to you --- I'm not, so it doesn't apply to me.

Fair enough.

> I've bought something, so I can sell it. I haven't signed any contract
> whatsoever that says that I can't sell it. That's all there is to it.

Well, you're subject to the laws of whatever jurisdiction you're in ...

Celejar


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Old 09-25-2012, 01:05 PM
Celejar
 
Default Installation

On Tue, 25 Sep 2012 07:18:25 -0500
John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> wrote:

> lee writes:
> > I've bought something, so I can sell it. I haven't signed any
> > contract whatsoever that says that I can't sell it. That's all there
> > is to it.
>
> That is the law here in the USA as well, though Microsoft et al. seem
> to have convinced some that it isn't.

No, that is *not* the law here in the US, as I documented in an earlier
email in this thread to which I have not yet seen a response from you.

Celejar


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Old 09-25-2012, 01:20 PM
Celejar
 
Default Installation

On Tue, 25 Sep 2012 00:41:04 +0200
lee <lee@yun.yagibdah.de> wrote:

> Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> writes:
>
> > On Mon, 24 Sep 2012 15:24:22 +0200
> > lee <lee@yun.yagibdah.de> wrote:
> >
> >> Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> writes:
> >>
> >> > You do not cite any sources for your various assertions, and I believe
> >> > you are incorrect as a matter of US law.
> >>
> >> American law doesn't apply here. Letting that aside: What is a copy?
> >> When you duplicate software, you get an identical duplicate which is
> >> indistinguishable from other duplicates of the same software.
> >
> > Are you raising some sort of philosophical objection to the law, or
> > actually explaining what you think the law is?
>
> I'm merely asking a question and suggest that there isn't really such a
> thing as a copy or an original in the classical sense in many cases.
> You are talking about some law that involves "copies" without explaining
> what a "copy" is.

In this context, any problem with the definition of "copy" is
irrelevant; you cannot legally (under US law) transfer *any* version of
the software, "original" or "copy", to anyone else without the
copyright holder's permission, as you have not purchased the software
but merely licensed it.

Celejar


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