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Benedek Imre 09-07-2012 12:10 AM

Settings rationalization
 
Hi Guys,

I've been looking at the Settings Manager and I've found there are quite a few illogical things - it could be better organised and rationalized.

Let's see what I'm talking about:

1. If I'd like to set something about appearance, I have to open 3(!) items: Appearance, Desktop and Window manager.

2. Window Manager has 2 Settings Manager items: 'Window Manager' and 'Window Manager Tweaks'. Personally I don't like Tweaks, just because it sounds a bit 'hacker' style. But it's not the point, it's more important that Window Manager and Tweaks has more tabs, which do not belong here I think. (Details later.)

3. Keyboard and mouse: in conjunction with them there are more options which placed in 3(!) different places: 'Keyboard' and 'Mouse & Touchpad', 'Window Manager' (Window Shortcuts) and 'Removable Drives and Media' (Input Devices).

4. Finally there are some possibility for rationalization in 'Workspaces' and 'Preferred Applications' also.

Proposed solutions:

1. Join 'Appeareance' , 'Desktop' and Style tab of 'Window Manager'.
See the mockups:
http://ubuntuone.com/1GU13dVx561JuKanBQgZL4
http://ubuntuone.com/5F9Egs5l2jgIVSU8wOLesT
http://ubuntuone.com/0hwFfuQzveb8sAO4aHP7rC
http://ubuntuone.com/3ygBEgTXWhCKp22uBgFvQS

2. Join 'Window Manager' and 'Window Manager Tweaks'.
- Remember the Style tab went to 'Appearances'.
- Window Shortcuts should go to 'Input Devices' (see later).
- Workspaces tab should go to 'Workspaces' (see later).
See the mockup:
http://ubuntuone.com/5hJfXo73kHjjjI3qQzLJfQ

3. Maybe we should create a new item called 'Input Devices' which contains the adjustments for Keyboard, Mouse, Touchpad and Tablets together. (Something like this works well in KDE.)
- Window Shortcuts should come here from 'Window Manager' to Keyboard section.
(I think everything what belong to the keyboard (especially shortcuts) should be placed here.)
- The content of Input Devices tab of 'Removable Drives and Media' should come here to the appropriate section.
See the mockups:
http://ubuntuone.com/4cx55j2PFj4aZjzyYJlTc1
http://ubuntuone.com/2YdlA7g5lrHLyoqkAJ2Uej

4. Workspaces: remember the content of Workspaces tab of 'Window Manager Tweaks' came here.
I think it's unnecessary to use tabs in 'Preferred Applications' because those 4 settings can be placed together.
See the mockups:
http://ubuntuone.com/7C61jcllXeuSJZI0Cn7Cfs
http://ubuntuone.com/1aDa57A5dGAgrV588FP0GV

The Settings Manager could look like this:
http://ubuntuone.com/0RKrcRqegB6o3Z372lwtEe

I think with these changes we could get a better organised, consequently built Settings Manager.
Notice: I did not want to redesign, but only reorganise the Settings Manager.
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Simon Steinbeiß 09-07-2012 12:42 AM

Settings rationalization
 
Hey Imre,

[I'm CC'ing Stephan, because he already started to work on implementing much of what you suggest here a while ago. Unfortunately it wasn't done by the time Xfce4.10 was released.]

On Fri, 7 Sep 2012 02:10:37 +0200
Benedek Imre <nucleo@indamail.hu> wrote:

> I've been looking at the Settings Manager and I've found there are quite a few illogical things - it could be better organised and rationalized.

+1

> 1. If I'd like to set something about appearance, I have to open 3(!) items: Appearance, Desktop and Window manager.

I'm not sure I fully agree. Although the desktop influences the "appearance", it is kinda different from the icons, gtk-themes and window-manager themes. Also: following your logic would also imply that the mouse-theme goes here and I'm not sure that'd be a good choice...
I mostly agree with the rest of the changes, especially having both gtk-theme and window-manager-theme in one tab could be useful.
Theoretically (some of) the desktop-settings could also go into the display-settings, especially setting the wallpaper (which would make setting different wallpapers for multiple displays more intuitive.

> 2. Window Manager has 2 Settings Manager items: 'Window Manager' and 'Window Manager Tweaks'. Personally I don't like Tweaks, just because it sounds a bit 'hacker' style. But it's not the point, it's more important that Window Manager and Tweaks has more tabs, which do not belong here I think. (Details later.)

+1 (although I don't care if "tweaks" sounds hacky, not even sure it does)

> 3. Keyboard and mouse: in conjunction with them there are more options which placed in 3(!) different places: 'Keyboard' and 'Mouse &amp; Touchpad', 'Window Manager' (Window Shortcuts) and 'Removable Drives and Media' (Input Devices).

One problem of merging that is that the stuff from "Removable Drives and Media" comes from thunar-volman, but I guess that's still solvable. Other than that +1.

> 4. Workspaces: remember the content of Workspaces tab of 'Window Manager Tweaks' came here.
> I think it's unnecessary to use tabs in 'Preferred Applications' because those 4 settings can be placed together.
> See the mockups:
> http://ubuntuone.com/7C61jcllXeuSJZI0Cn7Cfs
> http://ubuntuone.com/1aDa57A5dGAgrV588FP0GV

Makes some sense, I guess. The "Preferred Apps" could get a more space-saving layout, then the 4 items wouldn't have to go into a grid, but a simple list.

> I think with these changes we could get a better organised, consequently built Settings Manager.
> Notice: I did not want to redesign, but only reorganise the Settings Manager.

Nice work! I'd wanna wait for Stephan's response, because I don't want to start a re-iteration of discussions that already went on in the xfce-development mailing-list, but that mailing-list would be the right place to post stuff like this. Generally speaking "we" (as in: the Xubuntu team) always try to fix things upstream instead of patching things ourselves (which results in a delta that we have to maintain by ourselves and less goodness for all other Xfce distros/users).
Let's hope we'll see this in Xfce 4.12 :)

Simon

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Benedek Imre 09-07-2012 09:29 PM

Settings rationalization
 
Hi Simon,

Thank You for your remarks.

I'm thinking about 'Appearance' and 'Desktop'. You're right, not everything belongs to appearance what I placed there.
I have problems with two parts:
- Default Desktop Icons has partial relationship with appearance ('Show Thumbnails' and 'Single click to...' checkboxes too).
- Desktop Menu and Window List Menu has partial relationship with appearance (they influences how the Desktop works instead of how it appears).

I'm absolutely sure Background tab should go to 'Appearance' instead of 'Display', because 'Display' is for hardware settings (i think in every OS) and the desktop wallpaper definitely belongs to appearance.

The question is does it really worth to keep 'Desktop' settings item only for the 2 tabs above (Desktop Icons and Menus)? Or we could place 'Customize the look and behavior of your desktop' description under the title of Appearance.
See the mockup:
http://ubuntuone.com/5XTuAUES2xHNQP8qcG6Kmp

Notice: See 'Desktop Icons Appearance' and 'Default Desktop Icons' labels.


-- Eredeti üzenet --
Feladó: Simon Steinbeiß <simon.steinbeiss@elfenbeinturm.at>Címzett: <xubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com>Elküldve: 2012. szeptember 7. 2:42Tárgy : Re: Settings rationalization

Hey Imre,

[I'm CC'ing Stephan, because he already started to work on implementing much of what you suggest here a while ago. Unfortunately it wasn't done by the time Xfce4.10 was released.]

On Fri, 7 Sep 2012 02:10:37 +0200
Benedek Imre <nucleo@indamail.hu> wrote:

> I've been looking at the Settings Manager and I've found there are quite a few illogical things - it could be better organised and rationalized.

+1

> 1. If I'd like to set something about appearance, I have to open 3(!) items: Appearance, Desktop and Window manager.

I'm not sure I fully agree. Although the desktop influences the "appearance", it is kinda different from the icons, gtk-themes and window-manager themes. Also: following your logic would also imply that the mouse-theme goes here and I'm not sure that'd be a good choice...
I mostly agree with the rest of the changes, especially having both gtk-theme and window-manager-theme in one tab could be useful.
Theoretically (some of) the desktop-settings could also go into the display-settings, especially setting the wallpaper (which would make setting different wallpapers for multiple displays more intuitive.

> 2. Window Manager has 2 Settings Manager items: 'Window Manager' and 'Window Manager Tweaks'. Personally I don't like Tweaks, just because it sounds a bit 'hacker' style. But it's not the point, it's more important that Window Manager and Tweaks has more tabs, which do not belong here I think. (Details later.)

+1 (although I don't care if "tweaks" sounds hacky, not even sure it does)

> 3. Keyboard and mouse: in conjunction with them there are more options which placed in 3(!) different places: 'Keyboard' and 'Mouse & Touchpad', 'Window Manager' (Window Shortcuts) and 'Removable Drives and Media' (Input Devices).

One problem of merging that is that the stuff from "Removable Drives and Media" comes from thunar-volman, but I guess that's still solvable. Other than that +1.

> 4. Workspaces: remember the content of Workspaces tab of 'Window Manager Tweaks' came here.
> I think it's unnecessary to use tabs in 'Preferred Applications' because those 4 settings can be placed together.
> See the mockups:
> http://ubuntuone.com/7C61jcllXeuSJZI0Cn7Cfs
> http://ubuntuone.com/1aDa57A5dGAgrV588FP0GV

Makes some sense, I guess. The "Preferred Apps" could get a more space-saving layout, then the 4 items wouldn't have to go into a grid, but a simple list.

> I think with these changes we could get a better organised, consequently built Settings Manager.
> Notice: I did not want to redesign, but only reorganise the Settings Manager.

Nice work! I'd wanna wait for Stephan's response, because I don't want to start a re-iteration of discussions that already went on in the xfce-development mailing-list, but that mailing-list would be the right place to post stuff like this. Generally speaking "we" (as in: the Xubuntu team) always try to fix things upstream instead of patching things ourselves (which results in a delta that we have to maintain by ourselves and less goodness for all other Xfce distros/users).
Let's hope we'll see this in Xfce 4.12 :)

Simon

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Benedek Imre 09-07-2012 09:33 PM

Settings rationalization
 
Sorry, I mistyped something. The exact description I suggested is 'Customize the look and behavior of your desktop'.
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