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Old 01-08-2010, 09:17 PM
"J. Anthony Limon"
 
Default Proposal: Remove NetworkManager for WICD, perhaps after Lucid?

Network Manager is a tricky topic so I'll try to make this as unbiased
as possible.

WICD offers a solid replacement to NetworkManager while keeping almost
all the features. The only thing I can think of that would keep someone
from switching outright is that Network Manager has built-in VPN
support. After a poll of some sort we could then decide if we also
needed to ship a VPN client by default.

Also, since the next release is LTS it might make sense to wait to make
the switch as going from NetworkManager to WICD is as easy as apt-get
--purge autremove networkmanager

- J

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Old 01-08-2010, 09:53 PM
Steve Dodier
 
Default Proposal: Remove NetworkManager for WICD, perhaps after Lucid?

2010/1/8 J. Anthony Limon <j@flippo.net>

Network Manager is a tricky topic so I'll try to make this as unbiased

as possible.



WICD offers a solid replacement to NetworkManager while keeping almost

all the features. The only thing I can think of that would keep someone

from switching outright is that Network Manager has built-in VPN

support. After a poll of some sort we could then decide if we also

needed to ship a VPN client by default.



Also, since the next release is LTS it might make sense to wait to make

the switch as going from NetworkManager to WICD is as easy as apt-get

--purge autremove networkmanager



- J

Despite the fact that I'm myself using wicd in one of my computers, there is a slight difference between wicd and networkmanager that we may not forget: the quality of the GUI.

I've rarely seen an app with a GUI as unwelcoming and badly designed as wicd, even though it has a great backend. I think nm does the job in 99% of the cases, so switching to something that is harder to learn and use is not, in my opinion, a good idea at all for an end-user distribution.

*
--
Steve Dodier
Student at École Nationale Supérieure d'Ingénieurs de Bourges
Free Software Developer
OpenPGP : 1B6B1670

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Old 01-08-2010, 09:58 PM
"J. Anthony Limon"
 
Default Proposal: Remove NetworkManager for WICD, perhaps after Lucid?

On Fri, 8 Jan 2010 23:53:59 +0100
Steve Dodier <sidnioulz@gmail.com> wrote:

> 2010/1/8 J. Anthony Limon <j@flippo.net>
>
> > Network Manager is a tricky topic so I'll try to make this as
> > unbiased as possible.
> >
> > WICD offers a solid replacement to NetworkManager while keeping
> > almost all the features. The only thing I can think of that would
> > keep someone from switching outright is that Network Manager has
> > built-in VPN support. After a poll of some sort we could then
> > decide if we also needed to ship a VPN client by default.
> >
> > Also, since the next release is LTS it might make sense to wait to
> > make the switch as going from NetworkManager to WICD is as easy as
> > apt-get --purge autremove networkmanager
> >
> > - J
>
>
>
> Despite the fact that I'm myself using wicd in one of my computers,
> there is a slight difference between wicd and networkmanager that we
> may not forget: the quality of the GUI.
>
> I've rarely seen an app with a GUI as unwelcoming and badly designed
> as wicd, even though it has a great backend. I think nm does the job
> in 99% of the cases, so switching to something that is harder to
> learn and use is not, in my opinion, a good idea at all for an
> end-user distribution.
>

While I will agree it's not as "pretty" as some apps, it's entirely
user friendly. As soon as you open it, it greets you with a list of
available networks and button that says CONNECT. Also, 2.0 should have
a new GUI, which if we're going to let NM remain in Lucid should
provide perfect timing.

- J

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Old 01-08-2010, 10:14 PM
"Cody A.W. Somerville"
 
Default Proposal: Remove NetworkManager for WICD, perhaps after Lucid?

Hello,

On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 5:17 PM, J. Anthony Limon <j@flippo.net> wrote:


Network Manager is a tricky topic so I'll try to make this as unbiased

as possible.



WICD offers a solid replacement to NetworkManager while keeping almost

all the features. The only thing I can think of that would keep someone

from switching outright is that Network Manager has built-in VPN

support. After a poll of some sort we could then decide if we also

needed to ship a VPN client by default.

What problem are you trying to solve?

Cheers,

--
Cody A.W. Somerville
Software Systems Release Engineer
Foundations Team


Custom Engineering Solutions Group
Canonical OEM Services
Phone: +1-781-850-2087
Cell: +1-613-401-5141
Email: cody.somerville@canonical.com

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Old 01-09-2010, 03:04 PM
Vincent
 
Default Proposal: Remove NetworkManager for WICD, perhaps after Lucid?

On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 11:58 PM, J. Anthony Limon <j@flippo.net> wrote:


On Fri, 8 Jan 2010 23:53:59 +0100

Steve Dodier <sidnioulz@gmail.com> wrote:



> 2010/1/8 J. Anthony Limon <j@flippo.net>

>

> > Network Manager is a tricky topic so I'll try to make this as

> > unbiased as possible.

> >

> > WICD offers a solid replacement to NetworkManager while keeping

> > almost all the features. The only thing I can think of that would

> > keep someone from switching outright is that Network Manager has

> > built-in VPN support. After a poll of some sort we could then

> > decide if we also needed to ship a VPN client by default.

> >

> > Also, since the next release is LTS it might make sense to wait to

> > make the switch as going from NetworkManager to WICD is as easy as

> > apt-get --purge autremove networkmanager

> >

> > - J

>

>

>

> Despite the fact that I'm myself using wicd in one of my computers,

> there is a slight difference between wicd and networkmanager that we

> may not forget: the quality of the GUI.

>

> I've rarely seen an app with a GUI as unwelcoming and badly designed

> as wicd, even though it has a great backend. I think nm does the job

> in 99% of the cases, so switching to something that is harder to

> learn and use is not, in my opinion, a good idea at all for an

> end-user distribution.

>



While I will agree it's not as "pretty" as some apps, it's entirely

user friendly. As soon as you open it, it greets you with a list of

available networks and button that says CONNECT. Also, 2.0 should have

a new GUI, which if we're going to let NM remain in Lucid should

provide perfect timing.



Cody's question is of course extremely important, but I also have another remark: user interface consistency is also important. Most, if not all, of Xubuntu's applications try to follow GNOME's Human Interface Guidelines, which mostly not only results in a user friendly but also consistent UI. AFAIK wicd (currently) does not do this.


*
- J

--
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Old 01-09-2010, 05:22 PM
"J. Anthony Limon"
 
Default Proposal: Remove NetworkManager for WICD, perhaps after Lucid?

On Sat, 9 Jan 2010 17:04:10 +0100
Vincent <mailinglists@vinnl.nl> wrote:

> On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 11:58 PM, J. Anthony Limon <j@flippo.net>
> wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 8 Jan 2010 23:53:59 +0100
> > Steve Dodier <sidnioulz@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > 2010/1/8 J. Anthony Limon <j@flippo.net>
> > >
> > > > Network Manager is a tricky topic so I'll try to make this as
> > > > unbiased as possible.
> > > >
> > > > WICD offers a solid replacement to NetworkManager while keeping
> > > > almost all the features. The only thing I can think of that
> > > > would keep someone from switching outright is that Network
> > > > Manager has built-in VPN support. After a poll of some sort we
> > > > could then decide if we also needed to ship a VPN client by
> > > > default.
> > > >
> > > > Also, since the next release is LTS it might make sense to wait
> > > > to make the switch as going from NetworkManager to WICD is as
> > > > easy as apt-get --purge autremove networkmanager
> > > >
> > > > - J
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Despite the fact that I'm myself using wicd in one of my
> > > computers, there is a slight difference between wicd and
> > > networkmanager that we may not forget: the quality of the GUI.
> > >
> > > I've rarely seen an app with a GUI as unwelcoming and badly
> > > designed as wicd, even though it has a great backend. I think nm
> > > does the job in 99% of the cases, so switching to something that
> > > is harder to learn and use is not, in my opinion, a good idea at
> > > all for an end-user distribution.
> > >
> >
> > While I will agree it's not as "pretty" as some apps, it's entirely
> > user friendly. As soon as you open it, it greets you with a list of
> > available networks and button that says CONNECT. Also, 2.0 should
> > have a new GUI, which if we're going to let NM remain in Lucid
> > should provide perfect timing.
> >
> >
> Cody's question is of course extremely important, but I also have
> another remark: user interface consistency is also important. Most,
> if not all, of Xubuntu's applications try to follow GNOME's Human
> Interface Guidelines, which mostly not only results in a user
> friendly but also consistent UI. AFAIK wicd (currently) does not do
> this.
>
>
> > - J
> >
>
>


I've never really seen the GNOME HIG as being very relevant, but I
guess that's me. Most of the apps I've got installed would probably
make them puke (Claws, Chrome, etc) but I use them for the fact they
work better, not have a prettier GUI.

- J

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