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Old 04-23-2008, 02:07 PM
Chris G
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

I have a new ubuntu server 7.10 installation used as a NAS system in
my garage. It has a 500Gb external USB drive connected to it.

Something is preventing the external USB drive from going into sleep
mode, i.e. something is accessing the USB drive at intervals such that
it thinks it shouldn't power down. Previously when I used the network
drive via its ethernet interface (not from the ubuntu server system)
it did go into sleep mode.

The ubuntu server installation was done without the USB drive even
connected so there's nothing apart from backups on the external drive.

Can anyone suggest what might be keeping the USB drive awake and/or
ways of diagnosing what's keeping it awake?

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Old 04-23-2008, 02:17 PM
David Vincent
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Chris G wrote:
> I have a new ubuntu server 7.10 installation used as a NAS system in
> my garage. It has a 500Gb external USB drive connected to it.
>
> Something is preventing the external USB drive from going into sleep
> mode, i.e. something is accessing the USB drive at intervals such that
> it thinks it shouldn't power down. Previously when I used the network
> drive via its ethernet interface (not from the ubuntu server system)
> it did go into sleep mode.
>
> The ubuntu server installation was done without the USB drive even
> connected so there's nothing apart from backups on the external drive.
>
> Can anyone suggest what might be keeping the USB drive awake and/or
> ways of diagnosing what's keeping it awake?

Since it is shared, is anything accessing that share? Maybe something
trying to index it?

You used a server edition so trackerd shouldn't be a problem, how about
updatedb? What is being shared there? Is something on a client machine
re-indexing your music collection?

Just some thoughts.

- -d


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Old 04-23-2008, 02:46 PM
Chris G
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 07:17:47AM -0700, David Vincent wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Chris G wrote:
> > I have a new ubuntu server 7.10 installation used as a NAS system in
> > my garage. It has a 500Gb external USB drive connected to it.
> >
> > Something is preventing the external USB drive from going into sleep
> > mode, i.e. something is accessing the USB drive at intervals such that
> > it thinks it shouldn't power down. Previously when I used the network
> > drive via its ethernet interface (not from the ubuntu server system)
> > it did go into sleep mode.
> >
> > The ubuntu server installation was done without the USB drive even
> > connected so there's nothing apart from backups on the external drive.
> >
> > Can anyone suggest what might be keeping the USB drive awake and/or
> > ways of diagnosing what's keeping it awake?
>
> Since it is shared, is anything accessing that share? Maybe something
> trying to index it?
>
Not that I can think of, it's just a backup with a cron job backing up
to it in the small hours.

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Old 04-23-2008, 03:52 PM
Chris G
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 05:45:02PM +0200, Nils Kassube wrote:
> Chris G wrote:
> > On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 07:17:47AM -0700, David Vincent wrote:
> > > Chris G wrote:
> > > > I have a new ubuntu server 7.10 installation used as a NAS system
> > > > in my garage. It has a 500Gb external USB drive connected to it.
> > > >
> > > > Something is preventing the external USB drive from going into
> > > > sleep mode, i.e. something is accessing the USB drive at intervals
> > > > such that it thinks it shouldn't power down. Previously when I
> > > > used the network drive via its ethernet interface (not from the
> > > > ubuntu server system) it did go into sleep mode.
> > >
> > > Since it is shared, is anything accessing that share? Maybe
> > > something trying to index it?
> >
> > Not that I can think of, it's just a backup with a cron job backing up
> > to it in the small hours.
>
> If it is just a cron job you could mount the disk before doing the backup
> and umount it afterwards. Then there should be nothing accessing the
> drive while there is no backup running.
>
Now there's a bit of lateral thinking! :-)

Yes, a good idea, it's *slightly* more involved than that because the
backups run on my desktop machine using the ubuntu-server (with its
USB drive) as a NAS system. However it shouldn't be at all difficult
to mount and unmount the USB drive using ssh before and after running
the backups.

To test if it goes to sleep I can simply umount the USB drive
'manually' and check if it does power down after a while.

Thank you!

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Old 04-23-2008, 05:48 PM
Karl Larsen
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

Chris G wrote:
> I have a new ubuntu server 7.10 installation used as a NAS system in
> my garage. It has a 500Gb external USB drive connected to it.
>
> Something is preventing the external USB drive from going into sleep
> mode, i.e. something is accessing the USB drive at intervals such that
> it thinks it shouldn't power down. Previously when I used the network
> drive via its ethernet interface (not from the ubuntu server system)
> it did go into sleep mode.
>
> The ubuntu server installation was done without the USB drive even
> connected so there's nothing apart from backups on the external drive.
>
> Can anyone suggest what might be keeping the USB drive awake and/or
> ways of diagnosing what's keeping it awake?
>
>
I have a hard drive that I connect to my Ubuntu using a USB cable. I
works fine and I reach it at /media/disk/. What keeps it running is a
power supply. The HD will run until I turn it off with a switch.

So I don't understand your problem :-)

Karl


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Old 04-23-2008, 06:09 PM
Bart Silverstrim
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

Karl Larsen wrote:

> I have a hard drive that I connect to my Ubuntu using a USB cable. I
> works fine and I reach it at /media/disk/. What keeps it running is a
> power supply. The HD will run until I turn it off with a switch.
>
> So I don't understand your problem :-)

The drive should be powering down when it's not in use for an extended
period of time. It saves wear on the bearings, minimizes power usage,
helps a little with cooling, and extends the life of the drive.

When it is sleeping it can be re-accessed (from something as simple as
an "ls" listing) and will wake up again. You know it was sleeping because
a) it spins up audibly
b) there is a pause between you issuing the command and the drive waking
up and your command beginning

If it doesn't spin down, your power save features are disabled, the
drive doesn't support power saving (unlikely but possible, I suppose) or
you have something periodically accessing the drive so it is staying
"awake" and ready for quicker access.

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Old 04-23-2008, 06:30 PM
NoOp
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

On 04/23/2008 07:07 AM, Chris G wrote:
> I have a new ubuntu server 7.10 installation used as a NAS system in
> my garage. It has a 500Gb external USB drive connected to it.
>
> Something is preventing the external USB drive from going into sleep
> mode, i.e. something is accessing the USB drive at intervals such that
> it thinks it shouldn't power down. Previously when I used the network
> drive via its ethernet interface (not from the ubuntu server system)
> it did go into sleep mode.
>
> The ubuntu server installation was done without the USB drive even
> connected so there's nothing apart from backups on the external drive.
>
> Can anyone suggest what might be keeping the USB drive awake and/or
> ways of diagnosing what's keeping it awake?
>

There have been considerable problems with USB
suspend/resume/autosuspend/ehci_hcd, see:

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.22/+bug/88746
[start around the Feb 08 postings unless you're bored :-)]
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sane-backends/+bug/85488

The jist of those were to turn off autosuspend, so perhaps that is what
has happened on your drive?

This might help:

<http://www.nabble.com/USB-Problems-with-Ubuntu---workaround-to12123128.html>
<quote>
>> - a sysfs attribute has been added to USB devices that allows turning
>> off the USB autosuspend feature on a per-device basis. This attribute
>> can be found under /sys/bus/usb/devices/*/power/level.
>>
>> By doing echo on > /sys/bus/usb/devices/<device id>/power/level, it is
>> possible to disable the USB autosuspend feature (and wake the scanner
>> up if it's suspended).
>>
>> By doing echo suspend > /sys/bus/usb/devices/<device id>/power/level,
>> it is possible to force a device into suspend mode (and it won't be
>> waken up automatically).
>>
>> By doing echo auto > /sys/bus/usb/devices/<device id>/power/level, the
>> default behaviour of automatically suspending the device can be
>> restored.

[Note: I know the last is in reference to scanners, but you
enable/disable by device_id, so you should be able to use it for your
hard drive as well.]

http://lwn.net/Articles/253587/
[Documentation for USB power management]



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Old 04-23-2008, 06:35 PM
Karl Larsen
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

Bart Silverstrim wrote:
> Karl Larsen wrote:
>
>
>> I have a hard drive that I connect to my Ubuntu using a USB cable. I
>> works fine and I reach it at /media/disk/. What keeps it running is a
>> power supply. The HD will run until I turn it off with a switch.
>>
>> So I don't understand your problem :-)
>>
>
> The drive should be powering down when it's not in use for an extended
> period of time.
I am an Electrical Engineer and thus are simple minded. A box full
of timers and relays to turn on and off 12 volts when needed will be
expensive and not mass produced.

So please tell us what make and model controller your using with
your VERY special external Hard Drive.

Karl



> It saves wear on the bearings, minimizes power usage,
> helps a little with cooling, and extends the life of the drive.
>
> When it is sleeping it can be re-accessed (from something as simple as
> an "ls" listing) and will wake up again. You know it was sleeping because
> a) it spins up audibly
> b) there is a pause between you issuing the command and the drive waking
> up and your command beginning
>
> If it doesn't spin down, your power save features are disabled, the
> drive doesn't support power saving (unlikely but possible, I suppose) or
> you have something periodically accessing the drive so it is staying
> "awake" and ready for quicker access.
>
>


--

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Linux User
#450462 http://counter.li.org.
PGP 4208 4D6E 595F 22B9 FF1C ECB6 4A3C 2C54 FE23 53A7


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Old 04-23-2008, 07:51 PM
Gerald Dachs
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

Am Wed, 23 Apr 2008 12:35:50 -0600
schrieb Karl Larsen <k5di@zianet.com>:
> > The drive should be powering down when it's not in use for an
> > extended period of time.

This is true.

> I am an Electrical Engineer and thus are simple minded. A box
> full of timers and relays to turn on and off 12 volts when needed
> will be expensive and not mass produced.

True again.

> So please tell us what make and model controller your using with
> your VERY special external Hard Drive.

There is nothing special about his drive. Every internal or external
drive can do this already for years. The drives don't need relays.
They control the voltage of the spin motors anyway, so it is easy
for them switch them completely off. The timers are made in software
and are running on the computer to which the drives are attached.

Karl, you sucks.

Gerald

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Old 04-23-2008, 07:53 PM
Bart Silverstrim
 
Default ubuntu-server 7.10, what might be preventing my USB drive from sleeping?

Karl Larsen wrote:
> Bart Silverstrim wrote:
>> Karl Larsen wrote:
>>
>>
>>> I have a hard drive that I connect to my Ubuntu using a USB cable. I
>>> works fine and I reach it at /media/disk/. What keeps it running is a
>>> power supply. The HD will run until I turn it off with a switch.
>>>
>>> So I don't understand your problem :-)
>>>
>> The drive should be powering down when it's not in use for an extended
>> period of time.
> I am an Electrical Engineer and thus are simple minded. A box full
> of timers and relays to turn on and off 12 volts when needed will be
> expensive and not mass produced.
>
> So please tell us what make and model controller your using with
> your VERY special external Hard Drive.

What are you talking about? Your reply makes it sound like I'm making
this stuff up. Maybe I'm completely misinterpreting what you're
posting, but from the tone I don't think I'm going to spend time looking
up resources for you...

If you really don't know what I'm talking about with hard drives
spinning down to save power, use google or try "man hdparm" and look for
more information on -C, -B, -S, -y, -Y, and -Z flags.

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