I intend download software from developer's site (I guess this is what you call from upstream), compile and install it.It is somewhat a XSERVER from scratch but instead of starting from Linux from scratch I want to start from a ubuntu server console.

Valter



2012/2/13 David C. Curtis <dave.c.curtis@gmail.com>

On 12-02-13 03:29 PM, Valter Nogueira wrote:


Every time I think about X, windows managers, desktop environments and soon

I get nuts.



So, my intention is start from ubuntu server (non-gui) and install X and

windows managers from the sources.




Could you explain what mean 'installing from sources'?



Starting with just the base install and adding whatever non-meta-packages you wish?



Actually compiling Ubuntu source packages?



Compiling and installing from upstream?



It would also be helpful to understand what you are attempting to achieve in the end.



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have you installed X from the sources or from a Ubuntu repository?
Valter




2012/2/13 Liam Proven <lproven@gmail.com>

On 13 February 2012 20:29, Valter Nogueira <valter@fastway.com.br> wrote:

> Every time I think about X, windows managers, desktop environments and soon

> I get nuts.

>

> So, my intention is start from ubuntu server (non-gui) and install X and

> windows managers from the sources.

>

> Does someone have some tip or advice?



Not really. I've done it - it's not all that hard, not if you're just

using packages from the repositories.



I built a WindowMaker system that way - it was fine.



Things to know:



* most WMs don't seem to depend on X directly, which seems odd to me

* the default X install includes twm, I believe, so you can use X

without a separate WM

* if you want graphical login, you'll need a desktop manager as well,

e.g. xdm or wdm.



I did it in this order:



[1] install base system

[2] install X, get it working

[3] install WM

[4] install DM



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2012/2/13 David C. Curtis<dave.c.curtis@gmail.com>


On 12-02-13 03:29 PM, Valter Nogueira wrote:


Every time I think about X, windows managers, desktop environments and
soon
I get nuts.

So, my intention is start from ubuntu server (non-gui) and install X and
windows managers from the sources.



Could you explain what mean 'installing from sources'?

Starting with just the base install and adding whatever non-meta-packages
you wish?

Actually compiling Ubuntu source packages?

Compiling and installing from upstream?

It would also be helpful to understand what you are attempting to achieve
in the end.

--


On 12-02-13 07:53 PM, Valter Nogueira wrote:

I intend download software from developer's site (I guess this is

> what you call from upstream), compile and install it.


It is somewhat a XSERVER from scratch but instead of starting from Linux
from scratch I want to start from a ubuntu server console.

Valter


First, please bottom post on the list.

Second, you haven't really said what your end goal is.

I would only compile it myself if I found that the Ubuntu package didn't
support my particular set up, or I wanted to teach my self how to
compile some complex stuff. Not worth the headache if there is no
pressing need.


If your goal is to achieve a working desktop with one of the other
DE/WMs that doesn't come in a meta-package, Liam has covered that.


I had good results for years with a base install (from the alternate CD)
and putting the LXDE (not Lubuntu) on top. Using either xdm or gdm and
choosing my own light weight apps. If this is what you are aiming for
it's not that hard.




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My goal is understanding the way X stack works.
So, I am considering download X from x.org, compile and install it - read some parts of source code, tweak with others parts.

After doing so, repeating the task with some WM and toolkits.
I am looking for websites, books and tips about these subjects

Thanks,
Valter

2012/2/14 David C. Curtis <dave.c.curtis@gmail.com>


2012/2/13 David C. Curtis<dave.c.curtis@gmail.com>




On 12-02-13 03:29 PM, Valter Nogueira wrote:




Every time I think about X, windows managers, desktop environments and

soon

I get nuts.



So, my intention is start from ubuntu server (non-gui) and install X and

windows managers from the sources.






Could you explain what mean 'installing from sources'?



Starting with just the base install and adding whatever non-meta-packages

you wish?



Actually compiling Ubuntu source packages?



Compiling and installing from upstream?



It would also be helpful to understand what you are attempting to achieve

in the end.



--




On 12-02-13 07:53 PM, Valter Nogueira wrote:


I intend download software from developer's site (I guess this is


> what you call from upstream), compile and install it.




It is somewhat a XSERVER from scratch but instead of starting from Linux

from scratch I want to start from a ubuntu server console.



Valter




First, please bottom post on the list.



Second, you haven't really said what your end goal is.



I would only compile it myself if I found that the Ubuntu package didn't support my particular set up, or I wanted to teach my self how to compile some complex stuff. Not worth the headache if there is no pressing need.




If your goal is to achieve a working desktop with one of the other DE/WMs that doesn't come in a meta-package, Liam has covered that.



I had good results for years with a base install (from the alternate CD) and putting the LXDE (not Lubuntu) on top. Using either xdm or gdm and choosing my own light weight apps. If this is what you are aiming for it's not that hard.








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On 14 February 2012 00:54, Valter Nogueira <valter@fastway.com.br> wrote:
> have you installed X from the sources or from a Ubuntu repository?

Just from the repos. I will go out of my way to avoid compiling from
source if at all possible. I was using Linux actively 15 years ago and
have no wish at all to go back to those days.

If you want to build stuff from scratch, I don't think Ubuntu is the
distro to start on. Partly, it's not its aim; partly there's no real
point; partly it's too easy; and partly because you won't be able to
install Ubuntu packages onto the result as the lower-level
dependencies will be missing.

Gentoo is the obvious one, or perhaps Arch or even Slackware. Or
abandon Linux altogether and try FreeBSD. All these are more
source-oriented, AIUI.


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I don't want to use the resulting machine to work or in production.
It is just for research - after all what is the point of having free access to source code and never understand it.

I will consider gentoo.
thanks
Valter
2012/2/14 Liam Proven <lproven@gmail.com>

On 14 February 2012 00:54, Valter Nogueira <valter@fastway.com.br> wrote:


> have you installed X from the sources or from a Ubuntu repository?



Just from the repos. I will go out of my way to avoid compiling from

source if at all possible. I was using Linux actively 15 years ago and

have no wish at all to go back to those days.



If you want to build stuff from scratch, I don't think Ubuntu is the

distro to start on. Partly, it's not its aim; partly there's no real

point; partly it's too easy; and partly because you won't be able to

install Ubuntu packages onto the result as the lower-level

dependencies will be missing.



Gentoo is the obvious one, or perhaps Arch or even Slackware. Or

abandon Linux altogether and try FreeBSD. All these are more

source-oriented, AIUI.





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On Tue, 2012-02-14 at 08:24 -0200, Valter Nogueira wrote:
> My goal is understanding the way X stack works.
>
>
> So, I am considering download X from x.org, compile and install it -
> read some parts of source code, tweak with others parts.
>
>
> After doing so, repeating the task with some WM and toolkits.
>
>
> I am looking for websites, books and tips about these subjects
>
> Thanks,
>
>
First install a nice prebuilt flashy easy to use ubuntu/fedora desktop.
Then install "virtualbox". Then istall either "gentoo" or
freebsd/openbsd into it. Gentoo and these bsd's are built with
"distributing software as sources" idea. I would go for BSD's, only
because of their elegant "port" system. They have very clean
minimalistic and rather easy "building from sources" system than
mainstream linux distros. Popular Linux distros have a "binary package
management system" at its core. Like debs or rpms. building from sources
is always a pain in these. You will always get frustrated about
dependencies, ENVs, PATHs, LD_CONFIGs etc. most pain is the upgrading a
source install. BSD's have a very nice system of upgrading using cvsup.
for binary package distribution system, linux works like a charm. But it
realy sucks if you want hack "ls.c" . which i regularly do in freebsd.
Linux is my "Work machine". but when i wanna play, i would go BSD for
sure.
>
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On 14 February 2012 19:28, Arif Hossain <etothepowerpi@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
> First install a nice prebuilt flashy easy to use ubuntu/fedora desktop.
> Then install "virtualbox". Then istall either "gentoo" or
> freebsd/openbsd into it. Gentoo and these bsd's are built with
> "distributing software as sources" idea. I would go for BSD's, only
> because of their elegant "port" system. They have very clean
> minimalistic and rather easy "building from sources" system than
> mainstream linux distros. Popular Linux distros have a "binary package
> management system" at its core. Like debs or rpms. building from sources
> is always a pain in these. You will always get frustrated about
> dependencies, ENVs, PATHs, LD_CONFIGs etc. most pain is the upgrading a
> source install. BSD's have a very nice system of upgrading using cvsup.
> for binary package distribution system, linux works like a charm. But it
> realy sucks if you want hack "ls.c" . which i regularly do in freebsd.
> Linux is my "Work machine". but when i wanna play, i would go BSD for
> sure.

This looks like good advice to me and is pretty much what I wanted to
say, only with more and better technical authority. :¬)

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I will use VirtualBox for sure. You tip about BSD is very important and I will try it to.
thanks,
Valter






2012/2/14 Liam Proven <lproven@gmail.com>

On 14 February 2012 19:28, Arif Hossain <etothepowerpi@hotmail.com> wrote:

>>

> First install a nice prebuilt flashy easy to use ubuntu/fedora desktop.

> Then install "virtualbox". Then istall either "gentoo" or

> freebsd/openbsd into it. Gentoo and these bsd's are built with

> "distributing software as sources" idea. I would go for BSD's, only

> because of their elegant "port" system. They have very clean

> minimalistic and rather easy "building from sources" system than

> mainstream linux distros. Popular Linux distros have a "binary package

> management system" at its core. Like debs or rpms. building from sources

> is always a pain in these. You will always get frustrated about

> dependencies, ENVs, PATHs, LD_CONFIGs etc. most pain is the upgrading a

> source install. BSD's have a very nice system of upgrading using cvsup.

> for binary package distribution system, linux works like a charm. But it

> realy sucks if you want hack "ls.c" . which i regularly do in freebsd.

> Linux is my "Work machine". but when i wanna play, i would go BSD for

> sure.



This looks like good advice to me and is pretty much what I wanted to

say, only with more and better technical authority. :¬)



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