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Old 12-03-2011, 02:02 PM
"compdoc"
 
Default Getting started the hard way with RAID

>Are your 9650se controllers for PCI-e?

Yes. Wonderful controllers. You can often find them for good prices on ebay.

They come in 1x and 4x and 8x PCI-e versions. I often insert them into the 16x slot that’s normally used for the video card, since my servers have onboard video.

Care with the 2-port version - I have one sitting here with a broken sata connector. I'm going to have to find a way to solder a new connector to it.




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Old 12-03-2011, 02:16 PM
Marius Gedminas
 
Default Getting started the hard way with RAID

On Fri, Dec 02, 2011 at 09:44:28AM -0800, Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 2, 2011 at 1:30 AM, Marius Gedminas <marius@pov.lt> wrote:
> > On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 06:56:30PM -0800, Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
> >> I'm in the late stages of recovering a broken system. *The original
> >> had a hardware raid controller managing a mirror set that contained
> >> some stuff that was not backed up. Fortunately, one reason it wasn't
> >> backed up is that it wasn't really vital. *Nevertheless, I'd like to
> >> get at that stuff.
> >>
> >> The hard part is that I no longer have that RAID controller, just the
> >> two drives. *The controller was a 64-bit PCI card, and the new mobo
> >> cannot handle it.
> >
> > Have you googled for the model and manufacturer of that RAID controller?
>
> Not yet, but I will. It was a 3ware 9550SX controller.

$ dmraid -l
asr : Adaptec HostRAID ASR (0,1,10)
ddf1 : SNIA DDF1 (0,1,4,5,linear)
hpt37x : Highpoint HPT37X (S,0,1,10,01)
hpt45x : Highpoint HPT45X (S,0,1,10)
isw : Intel Software RAID (0,1,5,01)
jmicron : JMicron ATARAID (S,0,1)
lsi : LSI Logic MegaRAID (0,1,10)
nvidia : NVidia RAID (S,0,1,10,5)
pdc : Promise FastTrack (S,0,1,10)
sil : Silicon Image(tm) Medley(tm) (0,1,10)
via : VIA Software RAID (S,0,1,10)
dos : DOS partitions on SW RAIDs

No 3ware here. A quick Google seems to confirm that dmraid is mostly
for fakeraid devices, while 3ware is a real hardware RAID controller.

(I'm not sure what the difference is -- so the RAID logic runs on an
embedded CPU on the daughter card instead of your main CPU, which makes
performance better, but why would that have any impact on on-disk
metadata formats?)

Looks like you may need to buy a 3ware RAID card if you want to recover
your data.

Marius Gedminas
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Old 12-03-2011, 02:29 PM
Avi Greenbury
 
Default Getting started the hard way with RAID

Marius Gedminas wrote:
> (I'm not sure what the difference is -- so the RAID logic runs on an
> embedded CPU on the daughter card instead of your main CPU, which
> makes performance better, but why would that have any impact on
> on-disk metadata formats?)

It need not affect the metadata much, but it would affect the
effort put in to rescuing from it - few people use FakeRaid because
it's the worst of both software and hardware raid, so there's perhaps
less requirement to rescue from problems with it than there is true
hardware raid.


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Old 12-03-2011, 04:46 PM
"Kevin O'Gorman"
 
Default Getting started the hard way with RAID

On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 7:16 AM, Marius Gedminas <marius@pov.lt> wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 02, 2011 at 09:44:28AM -0800, Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
>> On Fri, Dec 2, 2011 at 1:30 AM, Marius Gedminas <marius@pov.lt> wrote:
>> > On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 06:56:30PM -0800, Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
>> >> I'm in the late stages of recovering a broken system. *The original
>> >> had a hardware raid controller managing a mirror set that contained
>> >> some stuff that was not backed up. Fortunately, one reason it wasn't
>> >> backed up is that it wasn't really vital. *Nevertheless, I'd like to
>> >> get at that stuff.
>> >>
>> >> The hard part is that I no longer have that RAID controller, just the
>> >> two drives. *The controller was a 64-bit PCI card, and the new mobo
>> >> cannot handle it.
>> >
>> > Have you googled for the model and manufacturer of that RAID controller?
>>
>> Not yet, but I will. *It was a 3ware 9550SX controller.
>
> $ dmraid -l
> asr * * : Adaptec HostRAID ASR (0,1,10)
> ddf1 * *: SNIA DDF1 (0,1,4,5,linear)
> hpt37x *: Highpoint HPT37X (S,0,1,10,01)
> hpt45x *: Highpoint HPT45X (S,0,1,10)
> isw * * : Intel Software RAID (0,1,5,01)
> jmicron : JMicron ATARAID (S,0,1)
> lsi * * : LSI Logic MegaRAID (0,1,10)
> nvidia *: NVidia RAID (S,0,1,10,5)
> pdc * * : Promise FastTrack (S,0,1,10)
> sil * * : Silicon Image(tm) Medley(tm) (0,1,10)
> via * * : VIA Software RAID (S,0,1,10)
> dos * * : DOS partitions on SW RAIDs
>
> No 3ware here. *A quick Google seems to confirm that dmraid is mostly
> for fakeraid devices, while 3ware is a real hardware RAID controller.
>
> (I'm not sure what the difference is -- so the RAID logic runs on an
> embedded CPU on the daughter card instead of your main CPU, which makes
> performance better, but why would that have any impact on on-disk
> metadata formats?)
>
> Looks like you may need to buy a 3ware RAID card if you want to recover
> your data.

Maybe not. I just worked up the courage to try dmraid. So far, I've
only tried discovery, but it's promising:
root@treat:~# dmraid -r
/dev/sdd: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
/dev/sdb: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
root@treat:~#

That's exactly the two disks that had the mirror halves, and the size
is convincing. I don't understand everything it's showing, and I
haven't had the courage to actually turn it on yet....


> Marius Gedminas
> --
> #define QUESTION ((bb) || !(bb)) /* Shakespeare */

Damn, that's funny!



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Old 12-03-2011, 06:26 PM
"Kevin O'Gorman"
 
Default Getting started the hard way with RAID

On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 9:46 AM, Kevin O'Gorman <kogorman@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 7:16 AM, Marius Gedminas <marius@pov.lt> wrote:
>> On Fri, Dec 02, 2011 at 09:44:28AM -0800, Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
>>> On Fri, Dec 2, 2011 at 1:30 AM, Marius Gedminas <marius@pov.lt> wrote:
>>> > On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 06:56:30PM -0800, Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
>>> >> I'm in the late stages of recovering a broken system. *The original
>>> >> had a hardware raid controller managing a mirror set that contained
>>> >> some stuff that was not backed up. Fortunately, one reason it wasn't
>>> >> backed up is that it wasn't really vital. *Nevertheless, I'd like to
>>> >> get at that stuff.
>>> >>
>>> >> The hard part is that I no longer have that RAID controller, just the
>>> >> two drives. *The controller was a 64-bit PCI card, and the new mobo
>>> >> cannot handle it.
>>> >
>>> > Have you googled for the model and manufacturer of that RAID controller?
>>>
>>> Not yet, but I will. *It was a 3ware 9550SX controller.
>>
>> $ dmraid -l
>> asr * * : Adaptec HostRAID ASR (0,1,10)
>> ddf1 * *: SNIA DDF1 (0,1,4,5,linear)
>> hpt37x *: Highpoint HPT37X (S,0,1,10,01)
>> hpt45x *: Highpoint HPT45X (S,0,1,10)
>> isw * * : Intel Software RAID (0,1,5,01)
>> jmicron : JMicron ATARAID (S,0,1)
>> lsi * * : LSI Logic MegaRAID (0,1,10)
>> nvidia *: NVidia RAID (S,0,1,10,5)
>> pdc * * : Promise FastTrack (S,0,1,10)
>> sil * * : Silicon Image(tm) Medley(tm) (0,1,10)
>> via * * : VIA Software RAID (S,0,1,10)
>> dos * * : DOS partitions on SW RAIDs
>>
>> No 3ware here. *A quick Google seems to confirm that dmraid is mostly
>> for fakeraid devices, while 3ware is a real hardware RAID controller.
>>
>> (I'm not sure what the difference is -- so the RAID logic runs on an
>> embedded CPU on the daughter card instead of your main CPU, which makes
>> performance better, but why would that have any impact on on-disk
>> metadata formats?)
>>
>> Looks like you may need to buy a 3ware RAID card if you want to recover
>> your data.
>
> Maybe not. *I just worked up the courage to try dmraid. *So far, I've
> only tried discovery, but it's promising:
> root@treat:~# dmraid -r
> /dev/sdd: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
> /dev/sdb: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
> root@treat:~#
>
> That's exactly the two disks that had the mirror halves, and the size
> is convincing. *I don't understand everything it's showing, and I
> haven't had the courage to actually turn it on yet....

With a little more courage, I tried and failed.

root@treat:~/work# dmraid -r
/dev/sdd: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
/dev/sdb: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
root@treat:~/work# dmraid -ay
ERROR: ddf1: wrong # of devices in RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" [2/1] on /dev/sdd
ERROR: ddf1: wrong # of devices in RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" [2/1] on /dev/sdb
RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" was not activated
root@treat:~/work#

In fact, I find the man page for dmraid very confusing and have been
unable to get any other commands to even try...

For instance, to display data "dmraid -r" works and so does "dmraid
-rc", but further embellishments fail.
-- root@treat:~/work# dmraid -r --display_columns=ser
*ERR*
*ERR*
root@treat:~/work# dmraid -r --display_columns=d
*ERR*
*ERR*
root@treat:~/work#

And so it goes. I'll be looking for other documentation as soon as I
finish figuring out ufw enough so that I can have a firewall and a web
page at the same time. It appears to me that the man pages for the
more advanced stuff were not meant for human consumption...

Kevin O'Gorman, PhD

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Old 12-03-2011, 11:08 PM
Marius Gedminas
 
Default Getting started the hard way with RAID

On Sat, Dec 03, 2011 at 11:26:44AM -0800, Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 9:46 AM, Kevin O'Gorman <kogorman@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I just worked up the courage to try dmraid. *So far, I've
> > only tried discovery, but it's promising:
> > root@treat:~# dmraid -r
> > /dev/sdd: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
> > /dev/sdb: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0

Neat! But why isn't 3ware mentioned in dmraid's README then? Google
gives me the impression 3ware is a big name in the hardware RAID
business.

> > That's exactly the two disks that had the mirror halves, and the size
> > is convincing. *I don't understand everything it's showing, and I
> > haven't had the courage to actually turn it on yet....
>
> With a little more courage, I tried and failed.
>
> root@treat:~/work# dmraid -r
> /dev/sdd: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
> /dev/sdb: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
> root@treat:~/work# dmraid -ay
> ERROR: ddf1: wrong # of devices in RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" [2/1] on /dev/sdd
> ERROR: ddf1: wrong # of devices in RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" [2/1] on /dev/sdb
> RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" was not activated

Oh

> In fact, I find the man page for dmraid very confusing and have been
> unable to get any other commands to even try...
>
> For instance, to display data "dmraid -r" works and so does "dmraid
> -rc", but further embellishments fail.
> -- root@treat:~/work# dmraid -r --display_columns=ser
> *ERR*
> *ERR*

Now I've never used dmraid in my life, but seeing the extreme weirdness
of the command syntax (why --display_columns and not
--display-columns?), and given that the syntax in the man page

[-c|--display_columns][FIELD[,FIELD...]]...

so maybe you're not supposed to use a '=' sign? There are examples
that use -c and don't separate it from the field list, e.g.

dmraid -r --sep : -cpath:size

> And so it goes. I'll be looking for other documentation as soon as I
> finish figuring out ufw enough so that I can have a firewall and a web
> page at the same time. It appears to me that the man pages for the
> more advanced stuff were not meant for human consumption...

The dmraid manual page is, I think, the worst manual page I've ever
seen.

It could be worse: at least it exists...

Marius Gedminas
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(in 1986 computer crashes were something out of the ordinary. Win95 anyone?)
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Old 12-04-2011, 05:17 PM
"Kevin O'Gorman"
 
Default Getting started the hard way with RAID

On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 4:08 PM, Marius Gedminas <marius@pov.lt> wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 03, 2011 at 11:26:44AM -0800, Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
>> On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 9:46 AM, Kevin O'Gorman <kogorman@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > I just worked up the courage to try dmraid. *So far, I've
>> > only tried discovery, but it's promising:
>> > root@treat:~# dmraid -r
>> > /dev/sdd: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
>> > /dev/sdb: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
>
> Neat! *But why isn't 3ware mentioned in dmraid's README then? *Google
> gives me the impression 3ware is a big name in the hardware RAID
> business.

It probably isn't supported. See below.

>> > That's exactly the two disks that had the mirror halves, and the size
>> > is convincing. *I don't understand everything it's showing, and I
>> > haven't had the courage to actually turn it on yet....
>>
>> With a little more courage, I tried and failed.
>>
>> * root@treat:~/work# dmraid -r
>> * /dev/sdd: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
>> * /dev/sdb: ddf1, ".ddf1_disks", GROUP, ok, 976494592 sectors, data@ 0
>> * root@treat:~/work# dmraid -ay
>> * ERROR: ddf1: wrong # of devices in RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" [2/1] on /dev/sdd
>> * ERROR: ddf1: wrong # of devices in RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" [2/1] on /dev/sdb
>> * RAID set "ddf1_SimpleVol" was not activated
>
> Oh

Actually, the size does not stand up to scrutiny. Apparently, 3ware
marks the drive as having raid info in a way that looks like one of
the standards, but isn't really.

Fdisk reports sdb has 500107862016 bytes, or 976,768,002 sectors. It's
geometry is set to 60801 cylinders, 255 heads and 63 sectors, or
976,768,065 sectors. It has two non-RAID partitions totalling
16,771,860 sectors. So dmraid is showing a size so large that it has
to overlap the non-RAID paritions, and is clearly wrong. I take it
that the volume is marked RAID in a way that looks a little like a
supported format but isn't.

>
>> In fact, I find the man page for dmraid very confusing and have been
>> unable to get any other commands to even try...

[snip]

>
> The dmraid manual page is, I think, the worst manual page I've ever
> seen.

Agreed, but it no longer matters because I'm convinced dmraid won't
help me. Since the mirror set comprises a complete volume that I
formatted with fdisk, I'm going to write some programs/scripts to scan
for a partition table. If the controller didn't mess with the actual
volume image, I can copy it wholesale to a spare drive I have and
mount that drive in the normal way. Maybe.

> It could be worse: at least it exists...

Grump grumble. Damning with faint praise. Grumble.

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