FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
» Video Reviews

» Linux Archive

Linux-archive is a website aiming to archive linux email lists and to make them easily accessible for linux users/developers.


» Sponsor

» Partners

» Sponsor

Go Back   Linux Archive > Ubuntu > Ubuntu User

 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
 
Old 11-23-2011, 06:26 PM
Udvarias Ur
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

I have been wondering.



1. I've read on
this list that clean installs of Ubuntu 11.10 work better the
upgrades from 11.04.



If I do such a 'clean' installation of 11.10 will it preserve all
the software added and the configuration I done? or will it
reformat the hard disk thereby erasing all that I've done?



2. Though so far a I have few complaints about Ubuntu, should I
decide to switch to Debian can I install Debian over Ubuntu such
that Debian does not reformat the hard disk
thereby erasing all that I've done?



3. Can I rearrange the partitions on my hard disk so that I can
install another OS? i.e. create a triple boot system? If so,
how?


--
Udvarias Ur

This letter was generated and sent from Thunderbird on Ubuntu Linux.



--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-23-2011, 08:03 PM
Colin Law
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

On 23 November 2011 19:26, Udvarias Ur <udvarias1@gmail.com> wrote:
> I have been wondering.
>
> 1. I've read on this list that clean installs of Ubuntu 11.10 work better
> the upgrades from 11.04.

Sometimes upgrades can be a problem. Of course the worst case is that
you need to start again with a clean install so all you have lost in
this case is some time.

>
> If I do such a 'clean' installation of 11.10 will it preserve all the
> software added and the configuration I done? or will it reformat the hard
> disk thereby erasing all that I've done?

To some extent that is up to you. If you tell it to reformat then it
will do that and you will lose everything done before. If you have a
separate home partition then you can keep that so no user data will be
lost. I suspect you have not got a separate partition in which case
if you go down the "something else" route when it asks about how you
want to install, and you tell it to install over the previous version
and do *not* tell it to format that partition then it will again leave
the home folder as it is, so you will not lose user data.

In either case, when you re-install rather than upgrade, you will
still need to re-install any apps that are not installed by default.

>
> 2. Though so far a I have few complaints about Ubuntu, should I decide to
> switch to Debian can I install Debian over Ubuntu such that Debian does not
> reformat the hard disk thereby erasing all that I've done?

Pass on this one.

>
> 3. Can I rearrange the partitions on my hard disk so that I can install
> another OS? i.e. create a triple boot system? If so, how?

Yes, boot off the live CD and run the partition manager (gparted) to
shrink a partition and create a new one, then install into that
partition.

Of course before doing any of this make sure that your backups are
fully up to date and double check that you can actually recover data
off it if you need to. Even if you are going a route that will
supposedly keep your data things can go wrong at any time. Tripping
over the power lead in the middle of moving partitions about is a good
one to try.

Colin

--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-24-2011, 04:45 AM
Rigved Rakshit
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

2. Though so far a I have few complaints about Ubuntu, should I
decide to switch to Debian can I install Debian over Ubuntu such
that Debian does not reformat the hard disk
thereby erasing all that I've done?

Do you mean convert your current Ubuntu install into Debian without formatting? No, you cannot do this. While installing Debian, you could tell the partition manager to leave you Ubuntu partition unformatted and install Debian to another partition. This way, you will still have you Ubuntu partition data. But you will have to install all the non-default software that you want in Debian.



Best Regards,
Rigved Rakshit

--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-24-2011, 04:23 PM
Ralph Puncher
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

On 11-11-23 04:03 PM, Colin Law wrote:

On 23 November 2011 19:26, Udvarias Ur <udvarias1@gmail.com> wrote:


I have been wondering.

1. I've read on this list that clean installs of Ubuntu 11.10 work better
the upgrades from 11.04.



Sometimes upgrades can be a problem. Of course the worst case is that
you need to start again with a clean install so all you have lost in
this case is some time.




If I do such a 'clean' installation of 11.10 will it preserve all the
software added and the configuration I done? or will it reformat the hard
disk thereby erasing all that I've done?



To some extent that is up to you. If you tell it to reformat then it
will do that and you will lose everything done before. If you have a
separate home partition then you can keep that so no user data will be
lost. I suspect you have not got a separate partition in which case
if you go down the "something else" route when it asks about how you
want to install, and you tell it to install over the previous version
and do *not* tell it to format that partition then it will again leave
the home folder as it is, so you will not lose user data.

In either case, when you re-install rather than upgrade, you will
still need to re-install any apps that are not installed by default.


See:

http://www.ubuntugeek.com/howto-reinstall-all-of-currently-installed-packages-in-fresh-ubuntu-install.html



to re-install all previously installed software.






2. Though so far a I have few complaints about Ubuntu, should I decide to
switch to Debian can I install Debian over Ubuntu such that Debian does not
reformat the hard disk thereby erasing all that I've done?



Pass on this one.




3. Can I rearrange the partitions on my hard disk so that I can install
another OS? i.e. create a triple boot system? If so, how?



Yes, boot off the live CD and run the partition manager (gparted) to
shrink a partition and create a new one, then install into that
partition.

Of course before doing any of this make sure that your backups are
fully up to date and double check that you can actually recover data
off it if you need to. Even if you are going a route that will
supposedly keep your data things can go wrong at any time. Tripping
over the power lead in the middle of moving partitions about is a good
one to try.

Colin







--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-24-2011, 05:59 PM
Liam Proven
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

On 23 November 2011 19:26, Udvarias Ur <udvarias1@gmail.com> wrote:
> I have been wondering.
>
> 1. I've read on this list that clean installs of Ubuntu 11.10 work better
> the upgrades from 11.04.
>
> If I do such a 'clean' installation of 11.10 will it preserve all the
> software added and the configuration I done? or will it reformat the hard
> disk thereby erasing all that I've done?

You will lose all your software and customisations. If you did not
make a separate /home partition, you will have to trust the
installation program to leave that alone and rewrite the rest, so you
will keep your documents, wallpaper and so on, but not programs or
system configuration.

> 2. Though so far a I have few complaints about Ubuntu, should I decide to
> switch to Debian

The punctuation is ambiguous. I am going to treat this as 2 questions.

So, to answer #1, no, don't switch to Debian. It's less friendly,
rather more old fashioned and does not include useful things that
Ubuntu does. It also does not have a relatively friendly, welcoming
support community like Ubuntu. If you have to ask, you don't want it.

> can I install Debian over Ubuntu such that Debian does not
> reformat the hard disk thereby erasing all that I've done?

No.

> 3. Can I rearrange the partitions on my hard disk so that I can install
> another OS? i.e. create a triple boot system?

Yes, certainly.

> If so, how?

Frankly, I'm afraid, if you have to ask, at this stage it is too
complicated for you.

--
Liam Proven • Info & profile: http://www.google.com/profiles/lproven
Email: lproven@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lproven@gmail.com
Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419
AIM/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • MSN: lproven@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508

--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-25-2011, 10:11 PM
Robert Holtzman
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 06:59:44PM +0000, Liam Proven wrote:

.........snip.........

> So, to answer #1, no, don't switch to Debian. It's less friendly,
> rather more old fashioned and does not include useful things that
> Ubuntu does. It also does not have a relatively friendly, welcoming
> support community like Ubuntu. If you have to ask, you don't want it.

First, Debian is no more or less "friendly" than Ubuntu, Ubuntu being an
outgrowth of Debian...and Debian's default Gnome 2.30.2 desktop is more
like Windows than Ubuntu's Unity or Gnome 3.

Other than some proprietary drivers, what useful things does Debian lack
that Ubuntu doesn't? The only thing I had to install was
flashplugin-nonfree. Squeeze (Debian 6.x) worked for me out of the box.

The Debian support community is as welcoming as is Ubuntu's and about as
populous. As far as it's being friendly, check the debian-users archive
and read the recent (current?) "Debian: A noob query" thread. The only
thing I find lacking in the Debian-users list is the entertainment
factor this list provides.

.......snip.......


--
Bob Holtzman
If you think you're getting free lunch,
check the price of the beer.
Key ID: 8D549279
--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-27-2011, 12:23 PM
Liam Proven
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

On 25 November 2011 23:11, Robert Holtzman <holtzm@cox.net> wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 06:59:44PM +0000, Liam Proven wrote:
>
> * * * * .........snip.........
>
>> So, to answer #1, no, don't switch to Debian. It's less friendly,
>> rather more old fashioned and does not include useful things that
>> Ubuntu does. It also does not have a relatively friendly, welcoming
>> support community like Ubuntu. If you have to ask, you don't want it.
>
> First, Debian is no more or less "friendly" than Ubuntu, Ubuntu being an
> outgrowth of Debian...

The point for Ubuntu's creation being that building a working desktop
out of Debian was too hard. It is much better now, but it's still not
as simple.

> and Debian's default Gnome 2.30.2 desktop is more
> like Windows than Ubuntu's Unity or Gnome 3.

And this is an /advantage/, is it?

> Other than some proprietary drivers, what useful things does Debian lack
> that Ubuntu doesn't? The only thing I had to install was
> flashplugin-nonfree.

Proprietary graphics-card drivers, proprietary wireless card drivers,
or a tool to install them?
Actual known named Mozilla apps, as opposed to renamed ones with the
icons changed?

> Squeeze (Debian 6.x) worked for me out of the box.

Debian 6 won't recognise any of the PCMCIA *Ethernet* cards on my old
Thinkpad, let alone Wifi. It doesn't work with /wired/ Ethernet cards.
I had to get a USB Ethernet adaptor in the end. The 3rd or 4th one I
tried (I forget) worked. None of the others.

> The Debian support community is as welcoming as is Ubuntu's and about as
> populous.

It must have changed dramatically in recent years, then.

> As far as it's being friendly, check the debian-users archive
> and read the recent (current?) "Debian: A noob query" thread. The only
> thing I find lacking in the Debian-users list is the entertainment
> factor this list provides.

I will!

--
Liam Proven • Info & profile: http://www.google.com/profiles/lproven
Email: lproven@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lproven@gmail.com
Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419
AIM/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • MSN: lproven@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508

--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-27-2011, 01:38 PM
Art Edwards
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

On 11/27/2011 06:23 AM, Liam Proven wrote:
> On 25 November 2011 23:11, Robert Holtzman <holtzm@cox.net> wrote:
>> On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 06:59:44PM +0000, Liam Proven wrote:
>>
>> .........snip.........
>>
>>> So, to answer #1, no, don't switch to Debian. It's less friendly,
>>> rather more old fashioned and does not include useful things that
>>> Ubuntu does. It also does not have a relatively friendly, welcoming
>>> support community like Ubuntu. If you have to ask, you don't want it.
>> First, Debian is no more or less "friendly" than Ubuntu, Ubuntu being an
>> outgrowth of Debian...
> The point for Ubuntu's creation being that building a working desktop
> out of Debian was too hard. It is much better now, but it's still not
> as simple.
>
>> and Debian's default Gnome 2.30.2 desktop is more
>> like Windows than Ubuntu's Unity or Gnome 3.
> And this is an /advantage/, is it?
>
>> Other than some proprietary drivers, what useful things does Debian lack
>> that Ubuntu doesn't? The only thing I had to install was
>> flashplugin-nonfree.
> Proprietary graphics-card drivers, proprietary wireless card drivers,
> or a tool to install them?
> Actual known named Mozilla apps, as opposed to renamed ones with the
> icons changed?
>
>> Squeeze (Debian 6.x) worked for me out of the box.
> Debian 6 won't recognise any of the PCMCIA *Ethernet* cards on my old
> Thinkpad, let alone Wifi. It doesn't work with /wired/ Ethernet cards.
> I had to get a USB Ethernet adaptor in the end. The 3rd or 4th one I
> tried (I forget) worked. None of the others.
>
>> The Debian support community is as welcoming as is Ubuntu's and about as
>> populous.
> It must have changed dramatically in recent years, then.
>
>> As far as it's being friendly, check the debian-users archive
>> and read the recent (current?) "Debian: A noob query" thread. The only
>> thing I find lacking in the Debian-users list is the entertainment
>> factor this list provides.
> I will!
>
I have to say that I spent many years using debian, and I was mostly
happy. The proprietary drivers was a significant issue, but I don't know
how that is now. The users list was just about as useful as ubuntu's. In
fact, it seems that the ubuntu lists used the debian lists as a model.

Art Edwards

--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-27-2011, 07:33 PM
Robert Holtzman
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

On Sun, Nov 27, 2011 at 01:23:01PM +0000, Liam Proven wrote:
> On 25 November 2011 23:11, Robert Holtzman <holtzm@cox.net> wrote:
> > On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 06:59:44PM +0000, Liam Proven wrote:
> >
> > * * * * .........snip.........
> >
> >> So, to answer #1, no, don't switch to Debian. It's less friendly,
> >> rather more old fashioned and does not include useful things that
> >> Ubuntu does. It also does not have a relatively friendly, welcoming
> >> support community like Ubuntu. If you have to ask, you don't want it.
> >
> > First, Debian is no more or less "friendly" than Ubuntu, Ubuntu being an
> > outgrowth of Debian...
>
> The point for Ubuntu's creation being that building a working desktop
> out of Debian was too hard. It is much better now, but it's still not
> as simple.

Not sure what building you're referring to. The squeeze installation
installed the Gnome desktop. It was fully functional at that point.

>
> > and Debian's default Gnome 2.30.2 desktop is more
> > like Windows than Ubuntu's Unity or Gnome 3.
>
> And this is an /advantage/, is it?

It can make the transition easier for a windows user. Other than that,
no.

>
> > Other than some proprietary drivers, what useful things does Debian lack
> > that Ubuntu doesn't? The only thing I had to install was
> > flashplugin-nonfree.
>
> Proprietary graphics-card drivers, proprietary wireless card drivers,
> or a tool to install them?

That's what I just said.

> Actual known named Mozilla apps, as opposed to renamed ones with the
> icons changed?

That's certainly not a show stopper.

>
> > Squeeze (Debian 6.x) worked for me out of the box.
>
> Debian 6 won't recognise any of the PCMCIA *Ethernet* cards on my old
> Thinkpad, let alone Wifi. It doesn't work with /wired/ Ethernet cards.
> I had to get a USB Ethernet adaptor in the end. The 3rd or 4th one I
> tried (I forget) worked. None of the others.

Not to be snide, that's your problem. Probably hardware. I had no
problems with wifi or ethernet.

>
> > The Debian support community is as welcoming as is Ubuntu's and about as
> > populous.
>
> It must have changed dramatically in recent years, then.
>
> > As far as it's being friendly, check the debian-users archive
> > and read the recent (current?) "Debian: A noob query" thread. The only
> > thing I find lacking in the Debian-users list is the entertainment
> > factor this list provides.
>
> I will!

Now for the snide part. You might do a little research before firing up
the FUD machine.

--
Bob Holtzman
If you think you're getting free lunch,
check the price of the beer.
Key ID: 8D549279
--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 
Old 11-28-2011, 09:25 PM
Liam Proven
 
Default 3 questions about new installations & updates

On 27 November 2011 20:33, Robert Holtzman <holtzm@cox.net> wrote:
> On Sun, Nov 27, 2011 at 01:23:01PM +0000, Liam Proven wrote:
>> On 25 November 2011 23:11, Robert Holtzman <holtzm@cox.net> wrote:
>> > On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 06:59:44PM +0000, Liam Proven wrote:
>> >
>> > * * * * .........snip.........
>> >
>> >> So, to answer #1, no, don't switch to Debian. It's less friendly,
>> >> rather more old fashioned and does not include useful things that
>> >> Ubuntu does. It also does not have a relatively friendly, welcoming
>> >> support community like Ubuntu. If you have to ask, you don't want it.
>> >
>> > First, Debian is no more or less "friendly" than Ubuntu, Ubuntu being an
>> > outgrowth of Debian...
>>
>> The point for Ubuntu's creation being that building a working desktop
>> out of Debian was too hard. It is much better now, but it's still not
>> as simple.
>
> Not sure what building you're referring to. The squeeze installation
> installed the Gnome desktop. It was fully functional at that point.

Erm, one of us is missing something here. Debian "Squeeze", i.e., v6,
came out in February. Ubuntu shipped in October 2004 when Debian was
on "Woody", v3, and was a *lot* more primitive than now.

Yes, *now* it's quite easy to install a standard desktop using Debian
- but it's had 5 or 6 years to catch up with Ubuntu by the time
Squeeze came out.

>> > and Debian's default Gnome 2.30.2 desktop is more
>> > like Windows than Ubuntu's Unity or Gnome 3.
>>
>> And this is an /advantage/, is it?
>
> It can make the transition easier for a windows user. Other than that,
> no.
>
>>
>> > Other than some proprietary drivers, what useful things does Debian lack
>> > that Ubuntu doesn't? The only thing I had to install was
>> > flashplugin-nonfree.
>>
>> Proprietary graphics-card drivers, proprietary wireless card drivers,
>> or a tool to install them?
>
> That's what I just said.

True enough, but without working networking, you can't install at all
from a "netinst" CD - you need a whole CD set or the DVD. And once
it's installed, without networking, you can't update or install new
packages - such as the additional drivers you need to get online.

>> Actual known named Mozilla apps, as opposed to renamed ones with the
>> icons changed?
>
> That's certainly not a show stopper.

No, it's not, but it's not very newbie-friendly. I get confused
between Iceweasel and Iceape and Icedove and so on myself!

>> > Squeeze (Debian 6.x) worked for me out of the box.
>>
>> Debian 6 won't recognise any of the PCMCIA *Ethernet* cards on my old
>> Thinkpad, let alone Wifi. It doesn't work with /wired/ Ethernet cards.
>> I had to get a USB Ethernet adaptor in the end. The 3rd or 4th one I
>> tried (I forget) worked. None of the others.
>
> Not to be snide, that's your problem. Probably hardware. I had no
> problems with wifi or ethernet.

Well, good for you! But it /is/ a problem and it's a biggie for
newbies. I read of enough people having problems with Ubuntu,
*especially* wireless connectivity; Debian is worse.

>> > The Debian support community is as welcoming as is Ubuntu's and about as
>> > populous.
>>
>> It must have changed dramatically in recent years, then.
>>
>> > As far as it's being friendly, check the debian-users archive
>> > and read the recent (current?) "Debian: A noob query" thread. The only
>> > thing I find lacking in the Debian-users list is the entertainment
>> > factor this list provides.
>>
>> I will!
>
> Now for the snide part. You might do a little research before firing up
> the FUD machine.

I didn't mean to spread FUD, honestly. I have been fiddling with
Debian myself since the late 1990s. I can get a useful server install
out of it, but I find it hard work to get a full, updated, current
desktop. I've lost count of the number of installs I've broken by
fiddling. I honestly don't think it's ready for nontechnical beginners
yet unless they get very lucky with their hardware.

For the sake of comparison, with my Simplicity Computers hat on, I
currently have 3 models of new hardware that neither Ubuntu nor Mint
will install and completely function on - 1 MSI notebook & 2 Asus
all-in-one touchscreens. In the past, as of the Ubuntu 10.04
generation, we've had to do custom tweaks to enable proper graphics
function, Java, Ethernet, WLAN and webcams, including shipping our own
custom-built kernels.

And that is on a base OS that makes a point of including binary drivers.

--
Liam Proven • Info & profile: http://www.google.com/profiles/lproven
Email: lproven@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lproven@gmail.com
Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419
AIM/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • MSN: lproven@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508

--
ubuntu-users mailing list
ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users
 

Thread Tools




All times are GMT. The time now is 11:25 PM.

VBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO ©2007, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright 2007 - 2008, www.linux-archive.org