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Old 05-24-2011, 05:34 PM
NoOp
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On 05/24/2011 04:00 AM, A. Kromic wrote:
> I have a problem of CPU frequency scaling not working with kernels newer
> than 2.6.32-24 (which I already discussed here a while ago). The bug is
> reported here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/706089
>
> The problem is, this problem seems to be ignored (nobody reacted at all
> to fix this, something that perhaps deserves further comments); one of
> the reasons could be that most people _have_no_idea_ what frequency
> their CPU is running at! Therefore, probably there aren't enough reports
> for anyone to investigate this...
>
> So I'm asking people with Core2/Centrino Duo laptops if they could check
> the frequency their CPU is running at. At the bug tracker, there is one
> reply from an AMD Turion64 user to have the same problem, so perhaps
> users of such machines could give it a try...
>
> How to check it? One way is from the console, simply do:cat
> /proc/cpuinfo. Within the results should be something like this:
...

Working (not the same cpu) for me on 2.6.35-29-generic:

vendor_id : GenuineIntel
cpu family : 6
model : 23
model name : Pentium(R) Dual-Core CPU T4300 @ 2.10GHz
stepping : 10
cpu MHz : 1200.000

and

vendor_id : GenuineIntel
cpu family : 6
model : 23
model name : Pentium(R) Dual-Core CPU T4300 @ 2.10GHz
stepping : 10
cpu MHz : 2100.000

$ uname -a
Linux . 2.6.35-29-generic #51-Ubuntu SMP Fri Apr 15 17:12:35 UTC 2011
x86_64 GNU/Linux

Same with Natty. Your initial posts indicated that you had battery/power
issues.
<http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.linux.ubuntu.user/233787>
Is that still the case? Maybe these will help?
<http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/How_to_make_use_of_Dynamic_Frequency_Scaling>
<http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Problem_with_CPU_frequency_scaling>

You mention in your bug report "works perfectly with kernels up to
2.6.32-24". But your last post: "Still not working with latest release
kernels: 2.6.32-32 (Lucid)". So I'm confused - with which kernel *is*
cpu scaling currently working on your machine?






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Old 05-24-2011, 06:17 PM
"A. Kromic"
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On 05/24/2011 07:34 PM, NoOp wrote:
>
> Same with Natty. Your initial posts indicated that you had battery/power
> issues.

No, someone suggested that might be the problem, and I allowed that
possibility then since I had the battery removed at the time. But when I
tried working with battery inserted, absolutely nothing changed; so I
eliminated that possibility.

> You mention in your bug report "works perfectly with kernels up to
> 2.6.32-24". But your last post: "Still not working with latest release
> kernels: 2.6.32-32 (Lucid)". So I'm confused - with which kernel *is*
> cpu scaling currently working on your machine?
>
>
What I meant is this: my system's CPU scaling has worked and still works
perfectly with all old kernels up to 2.6.32-24, with any kernel newer
than that it doesn't work at all. I can reproduce it anytime, either
chosing a kernel from GRUB, or by booting a live CD. Another fact
perhaps worth noting is that it doesn't matter if it is a 32- or 64-bit
Ubuntu - I've checked with both, and again the problem depends just on
the kernel version.

I don't quite get what the problem is, it seems it's quite rare. However
so far, I couldn't find anything else but the kernel to blame, per the
above mentioned fact. No amount of tinkering with other software (like
acpi, cpu frequency managers etc.) not hardware (battery, BIOS options)
showed any difference at all...

And thanks again to everybody who tested!

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however, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.


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Old 05-24-2011, 06:58 PM
Ioannis Vranos
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 9:17 PM, A. Kromic <akromic@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 05/24/2011 07:34 PM, NoOp wrote:
>>
>> Same with Natty. Your initial posts indicated that you had battery/power
>> issues.
>
> No, someone suggested that might be the problem, and I allowed that
> possibility then since I had the battery removed at the time. But when I
> tried working with battery inserted, absolutely nothing changed; so I
> eliminated that possibility.
>
>> You mention in your bug report "works perfectly with kernels up to
>> 2.6.32-24". But your last post: "Still not working with latest release
>> kernels: 2.6.32-32 (Lucid)". So I'm confused - with which kernel *is*
>> cpu scaling currently working on your machine?
>>
>>
> What I meant is this: my system's CPU scaling has worked and still works
> perfectly with all old kernels up to 2.6.32-24, with any kernel newer
> than that it doesn't work at all. I can reproduce it anytime, either
> chosing a kernel from GRUB, or by booting a live CD. Another fact
> perhaps worth noting is that it doesn't matter if it is a 32- or 64-bit
> Ubuntu - I've checked with both, and again the problem depends just on
> the kernel version.
>
> I don't quite get what the problem is, it seems it's quite rare. However
> so far, I couldn't find anything else but the kernel to blame, per the
> above mentioned fact. No amount of tinkering with other software (like
> acpi, cpu frequency managers etc.) not hardware (battery, BIOS options)
> showed any difference at all...
>
> And thanks again to everybody who tested!


Did you try running cpuburn in open terminals, as many as your CPU cores?



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Old 05-24-2011, 07:12 PM
"A. Kromic"
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On 05/24/2011 08:58 PM, Ioannis Vranos wrote:
>
> Did you try running cpuburn in open terminals, as many as your CPU cores?
>
>
>
No, I've long ago noticed that CPU never goes above lowest speed at full
load even with the most aggressive governor, and believe me I've tried
doing quite a bit of testing since I discovered this. However, that
particular test doesn't matter since the CPU should change frequency
when set explicitly (instead of being handled automatically by the
governor) which it doesn't. The problem isn't the _automatic_ scaling,
but scaling in general doesn't work at all...

I think I've also tried at some time writing directly to /sys interfaces
which should always work, but no luck...

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however, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.


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Old 05-24-2011, 07:18 PM
Ioannis Vranos
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 10:12 PM, A. Kromic <akromic@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 05/24/2011 08:58 PM, Ioannis Vranos wrote:
>>
>> Did you try running cpuburn in open terminals, as many as your CPU cores?
>>
>>
>>
> No, I've long ago noticed that CPU never goes above lowest speed at full
> load even with the most aggressive governor, and believe me I've tried
> doing quite a bit of testing since I discovered this. However, that
> particular test doesn't matter since the CPU should change frequency
> when set explicitly (instead of being handled automatically by the
> governor) which it doesn't. The problem isn't the _automatic_ scaling,
> but scaling in general doesn't work at all...
>
> I think I've also tried at some time writing directly to /sys interfaces
> which should always work, but no luck...


However my system is an Intel Core 2 Duo, and it scales OK with
cpuburn, from 800 MHz to 2.5 GHz (both Cores with 2 cpuburns).

Also I noticed than when I changed the profile in "CPU frequency
scaling monitor" GNOME applet, to "Performance", only one Core
switched to 2.5 GHz, the other one remained in 800 MHz.



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Old 05-24-2011, 08:23 PM
Hakan Koseoglu
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On 24 May 2011 20:12, A. Kromic <akromic@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 05/24/2011 08:58 PM, Ioannis Vranos wrote:
> > Did you try running cpuburn in open terminals, as many as your CPU cores?
> No, I've long ago noticed that CPU never goes above lowest speed at full
So you refuse to test a simple scenario but it works for the rest of
all... Simply run as many copies of cpuburn and then check the
/proc/cpuinfo.

I didn't even have cpufrequtils installed on this natty. Anyway,
let's try this.

What's the output of cpufreq-info?

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Old 05-24-2011, 08:28 PM
Hakan Koseoglu
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On 24 May 2011 20:12, A. Kromic <akromic@gmail.com> wrote:
> No, I've long ago noticed that CPU never goes above lowest speed at full
> load even with the most aggressive governor, and believe me I've tried
Are you absolutely sure you haven't fiddled with your BIOS settings?
Dell laptops have an option regarding the CPU speed governor support.

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Old 05-25-2011, 02:19 AM
Rashkae
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On 05/24/2011 02:17 PM, A. Kromic wrote:


What I meant is this: my system's CPU scaling has worked and still works
perfectly with all old kernels up to 2.6.32-24, with any kernel newer
than that it doesn't work at all. I can reproduce it anytime, either
chosing a kernel from GRUB, or by booting a live CD. Another fact
perhaps worth noting is that it doesn't matter if it is a 32- or 64-bit
Ubuntu - I've checked with both, and again the problem depends just on
the kernel version.

I don't quite get what the problem is, it seems it's quite rare. However
so far, I couldn't find anything else but the kernel to blame, per the
above mentioned fact. No amount of tinkering with other software (like
acpi, cpu frequency managers etc.) not hardware (battery, BIOS options)
showed any difference at all...

And thanks again to everybody who tested!


Keep in mind that this problem is obviously not very widespread, and the
people who can actually work on this kind of low level bug probably
don't read Ubuntu list. (heck, Ubuntu devs can't even figure out how
floppy works.)


Since no one has stepped up here with suggestions to your particular
situation, I wold suggest the following (if within your comfort zone of
technical skills.)


Download and build the latest vanilla kernel from source, see if you can
replicate the problem with that.


If it's already fixed with the new kernel, then just use that until
Ubuntu catches up with that kernel version.


If the bug persists, report it, as well as any details of your hardware
to the lkml.


I trust that once a bug of this nature is detailed on lkml, it will be
worked on and patched very quickly, at which point, you can update the
Ubuntu bug report with the patch that fixes the issue.





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Old 05-25-2011, 02:43 PM
"A. Kromic"
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On 05/24/2011 10:23 PM, Hakan Koseoglu wrote:
>
> So you refuse to test a simple scenario but it works for the rest of
> all... Simply run as many copies of cpuburn and then check the
> /proc/cpuinfo.
>
I refuse to do futile tests. I'm an IT pro, didn't start with computers
and linux yesterday, and most certainly won't blindly try every
suggestion for which I know how it works and why it's not rellevant for
me. NHF.


> Are you absolutely sure you haven't fiddled with your BIOS settings?
> Dell laptops have an option regarding the CPU speed governor support.
>
No, I'm not sure - I've already said I've tried fiddling with
everything, including the BIOS settings. I also said I know what I'm
doing, and follow a rule of sanity - after testing it's an imperative to
revert everything to the previous state. NHF again. And FYI, if you
disable frequency scaling in BIOS, it doesn't care which kernel version
(or OS) you have - it simply doesn't work then.

I believe I'm at least competent enough to identify this problem as a
kernel or hardware bug, and not a result of my own stupidity

--
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-
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however, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.


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Old 05-25-2011, 03:05 PM
"A. Kromic"
 
Default CPU frequency scaling problem - laptop users, please check this

On 05/25/2011 04:19 AM, Rashkae wrote:
> On 05/24/2011 02:17 PM, A. Kromic wrote:
>>
>> What I meant is this: my system's CPU scaling has worked and still works
>> perfectly with all old kernels up to 2.6.32-24, with any kernel newer
>> than that it doesn't work at all. I can reproduce it anytime, either
>> chosing a kernel from GRUB, or by booting a live CD. Another fact
>> perhaps worth noting is that it doesn't matter if it is a 32- or 64-bit
>> Ubuntu - I've checked with both, and again the problem depends just on
>> the kernel version.
>>
>> I don't quite get what the problem is, it seems it's quite rare. However
>> so far, I couldn't find anything else but the kernel to blame, per the
>> above mentioned fact. No amount of tinkering with other software (like
>> acpi, cpu frequency managers etc.) not hardware (battery, BIOS options)
>> showed any difference at all...
>>
>> And thanks again to everybody who tested!
>
> Keep in mind that this problem is obviously not very widespread, and
> the people who can actually work on this kind of low level bug
> probably don't read Ubuntu list. (heck, Ubuntu devs can't even figure
> out how floppy works.)
>
> Since no one has stepped up here with suggestions to your particular
> situation, I wold suggest the following (if within your comfort zone
> of technical skills.)
>
> Download and build the latest vanilla kernel from source, see if you
> can replicate the problem with that.
>
> If it's already fixed with the new kernel, then just use that until
> Ubuntu catches up with that kernel version.
>
> If the bug persists, report it, as well as any details of your
> hardware to the lkml.
>
> I trust that once a bug of this nature is detailed on lkml, it will be
> worked on and patched very quickly, at which point, you can update the
> Ubuntu bug report with the patch that fixes the issue.
>
>
>
>

I guess you are right and I've already feared this might be my only
solution

The comfort zone... Considering the technical skills, yes, I've already
built numerous customized and patched kernels, but there is another
comfort zone issue that currently bothers me - not having much time
myself lately, and also the fact that this laptop is my main production
machine and I don't like to play with its OS more than necessary... I've
already accepted to stay at a LTS version and I guess I don't mind very
much staying with an older kernel too.

The main reason why I care about this problem is that I'd love to
reinstall this "production" machine's OS because it's not very
productive anymore. One reason is that I've constantly upgraded its OS
since I've first installed 8.04 on it, and that together with other
factors, made this machine quite slow. The other issue I'm having is
that I've installed a 64-bit OS (for "geek factor" - because it has a
64-bit CPU :P ), but I'm not satisfied with how it works. 64-bit appears
to eat too much RAM and in general after years of use, I think it needs
4G of RAM to use comfortably, and some compatibility issues made me
think that it's not a perfect choice for a laptop/desktop especially in
this class (I must admit everything works much better in 64-bit than it
did when I first installed Ubuntu on this machine).

So, my wish was to clean install a 32-bit Ubuntu (Maverick, then Natty)
to work more comfortably, but neither of them sets my CPU to the full
frequency! A source of much grief, I must admit

So I guess I don't have much choice. Either will I continue using (or
make a clean install of) Lucid with an older kernel, or I'll try to deal
with this bug upstream... I think I'll have to make time for the latter...

Thanks to everybody who helped!

--
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-
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however, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.


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