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Old 01-19-2011, 11:45 AM
Alan Pope
 
Default a confusion regarding package updates

On 19 January 2011 12:33, Tapas Mishra <mightydreams@gmail.com> wrote:
> 125 packages can be updated.
> 77 updates are security updates.
>
> Before I do any command as below
> *apt-get update && apt-get -y upgrade > /dev/null
>
> I want to make sure it does not upgrades from 10.04 to 10.10 I do not
> want the OS version to change.

It wont. The only way you'll go from 10.04 to 10.10 is if you do one
of the following:-

1) Run update-manager and click the "upgrade to 10.10" button (I'm
guessing this is a server so slim chance of this)
2) Run do-release-upgrade
3) Edit your /etc/apt/sources.list and change lucid to maverick then
upgrade using the apt based tools.
4) Install 10.10

Don't do any of those and you'll stay on 10.04.

> So can any one tell as if the above way of doing(installing updates
> and security updates) is correct or not.

It's not.

apt-get update
apt-get dist-upgrade

If you do "upgrade" and not "dist-upgrade" then there's the
probability that some packages may get held back (not upgraded).

The man page for apt-get explains the difference between "upgrade" and
"dist-upgrade".

Al.

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Old 01-19-2011, 12:09 PM
Tapas Mishra
 
Default a confusion regarding package updates

Hi Alan thanks for your reply.
You correctly guessed it is a server so GUI is not there.
It clears my doubt to some extent.

How ever from man page of apt-get I am not clear with a few things.

On Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 6:15 PM, Alan Pope <popey@ubuntu.com> wrote:

> The man page for apt-get explains the difference between "upgrade" and
> "dist-upgrade".
Here are the excerpts from apt-get man page

" dist-upgrade
dist-upgrade in addition to performing the function of
upgrade, also intelligently handles changing dependencies with new
versions of packages; apt-get has a "smart" conflict resolution
system, and it will attempt to upgrade the most important packages at
the expense of less important ones if necessary. So, dist-upgrade
command may remove some packages. The /etc/apt/sources.list file
contains a list of locations from which to retrieve desired package
files. See also apt_preferences(5) for a mechanism for overriding the
general settings for individual packages."

When it says intelligently handles changing dependencies with new
version of packages then what does it mean?
Is it referring to moving from 10.04 to 10.10?

and from the apt-get man page about upgrade

" upgrade
upgrade is used to install the newest versions of all
packages currently installed on the system from the sources enumerated
in /etc/apt/sources.list.Packages currently installed with new
versions available are retrieved and upgraded; under no circumstances
are currently installed packages removed,or packages not already
installed retrieved and installed. New versions of currently installed
packages that cannot be upgraded without changing theinstall status of
another package will be left at their current version. An update must
be performed first so that apt-get knows that new versions of packages
are available."

Here my doubt in the above para from man page of apt-get is when it says

"New versions of currently installed packages that cannot be upgraded
without changing the install status of another package will be left at
their current version."

What is install status?

I had a long time back used tasksel on 9.04 to remove a few packages
and it removed everthing on my laptop.
If some thing similar happens I am not in a position to recover back
(in terms of time).
So I am a bit fearing to use apt-get upgrade on the server in question.

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Old 01-19-2011, 12:56 PM
Alan Pope
 
Default a confusion regarding package updates

On 19 January 2011 13:09, Tapas Mishra <mightydreams@gmail.com> wrote:
> When it says intelligently handles changing dependencies with new
> version of packages then what does it mean?
> Is it referring to moving from 10.04 to 10.10?
>

Yes and no.

apt-get dist-upgrade _can_ be used as one of the tools to get you from
10.04 to 10.10. However so long as you haven't changed your
sources.list, you'll stay on whatever release you're currently on.

> "New versions of currently installed packages that cannot be upgraded
> without changing the install status of another package will be left at
> their current version."
>
> What is install status?
>

Lets say you have a package called foo-1.0 and there is a new version
called foo-1.1 which fixes some bugs, but foo-1.1 requires some extra
package called bar-0.5. If you do "apt-get upgrade" you will _not_
install bar-0.5 and thus foo-1.1 will be prevented from installing. if
you do "apt-get dist-upgrade" then it will.

> If some thing similar happens I am not in a position to recover back
> (in terms of time).
> So I am a bit fearing to use apt-get upgrade on the server in question.
>

apt-get upgrade and dist-upgrade are pretty safe.

Al.

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Old 01-19-2011, 01:21 PM
Tapas Mishra
 
Default a confusion regarding package updates

On Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 7:26 PM, Alan Pope <popey@ubuntu.com> wrote:
> On 19 January 2011 13:09, Tapas Mishra <mightydreams@gmail.com> wrote:
>> When it says intelligently handles changing dependencies with new
>> version of packages then what does it mean?
>> Is it referring to moving from 10.04 to 10.10?
>>
>
> Yes and no.
>
> apt-get dist-upgrade _can_ be used as one of the tools to get you from
> 10.04 to 10.10. However so long as you haven't changed your
> sources.list, you'll stay on whatever release you're currently on.

Hmmm, I remember a long time back some faulty way of upgrade by me
had changed the sources.list file.
That time I had not touched manually the sources.list file so is this
same case when you
do a apt-get dist-upgrade (i.e. the script changes the sources.list
when a new release is available)
or it will ask the user to proceed or not to and then upgrade only new
packages (and not the OS itself).

>> "New versions of currently installed packages that cannot be upgraded
>> without changing the install status of another package will be left at
>> their current version."
>>
>> What is install status?
>>
>
> Lets say you have a package called foo-1.0 and there is a new version
> called foo-1.1 which fixes some bugs, but foo-1.1 requires some extra
> package called bar-0.5. If you do "apt-get upgrade" you will _not_
> install bar-0.5 and thus foo-1.1 will be prevented from installing. if
> you do "apt-get dist-upgrade" then it will.
Ok this is helpful.I feel in man pages not only the information but if
simple explanations with some test cases or common usage scenarios
are also given then reading them will be quite useful.Consider this as
a suggestion to incorporate(if possible) in future releases.
You may consider having a separate package which can install examples
for man pages (if ISO size is a constraint).

>> If some thing similar happens I am not in a position to recover back
>> (in terms of time).
>> So I am a bit fearing to use apt-get upgrade on the server in question.
>>
>
> apt-get upgrade and dist-upgrade are pretty safe.
Ok.

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Old 01-19-2011, 01:21 PM
Tom H
 
Default a confusion regarding package updates

On Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 8:56 AM, Alan Pope <popey@ubuntu.com> wrote:
> On 19 January 2011 13:09, Tapas Mishra <mightydreams@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> When it says intelligently handles changing dependencies with new
>> version of packages then what does it mean?
>> Is it referring to moving from 10.04 to 10.10?
>
> Yes and no.
>
> apt-get dist-upgrade _can_ be used as one of the tools to get you from
> 10.04 to 10.10. However so long as you haven't changed your
> sources.list, you'll stay on whatever release you're currently on.

In Debian, do-release-upgrade doesn't exist so an upgrade is performed
by making some preparatory changes including changing
"/etc/apt/sources.list" and running "apt-get upgrade" or "aptitude
safe-upgrade" for a "minimal system upgrade" before upgrading the
entire system. The same definitely applies to Ubuntu so as not to
introduce too many changes in one go if you choose not to use
do-release-upgrade.

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Old 01-19-2011, 01:33 PM
Alan Pope
 
Default a confusion regarding package updates

On 19 January 2011 14:21, Tapas Mishra <mightydreams@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hmmm, I remember a long time back some faulty way of upgrade by me
> had changed the sources.list file.

Yes. That happens a lot.

> That time I had not touched manually the sources.list file so is this
> same case when you
> do a apt-get dist-upgrade (i.e. the script changes the sources.list
> when a new release is available)
> or it will ask the user to proceed or not to and then upgrade only new
> packages (and not the OS itself).
>

I don't fully understand. But "apt-get dist-upgrade" will _not_ change
your sources.list at all.

Al.

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Old 01-19-2011, 01:33 PM
Alan Pope
 
Default a confusion regarding package updates

On 19 January 2011 14:21, Tapas Mishra <mightydreams@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hmmm, I remember a long time back some faulty way of upgrade by me
> had changed the sources.list file.

Yes. That happens a lot.

> That time I had not touched manually the sources.list file so is this
> same case when you
> do a apt-get dist-upgrade (i.e. the script changes the sources.list
> when a new release is available)
> or it will ask the user to proceed or not to and then upgrade only new
> packages (and not the OS itself).
>

I don't fully understand. But "apt-get dist-upgrade" will _not_ change
your sources.list at all.

Al.

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Old 01-19-2011, 02:09 PM
Tapas Mishra
 
Default a confusion regarding package updates

On Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 8:03 PM, Alan Pope <popey@ubuntu.com> wrote:
> On 19 January 2011 14:21, Tapas Mishra <mightydreams@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hmmm, I remember a long time back some faulty way of upgrade by me
>> had changed the sources.list file.
>
> Yes. That happens a lot.
>
>> That time I had not touched manually the sources.list file so is this
>> same case when you
>> do a apt-get dist-upgrade (i.e. the script changes the sources.list
>> when a new release is available)
>> or it will ask the user to proceed or not to and then upgrade only new
>> packages (and not the OS itself).
>>
>
> I don't fully understand.
I had observed the process of an OS changing from one version to another.
i.e.10.04 to 10.10 ( I do not remember the command right now)
but what I saw was sources.list.old or with some similar name was
created (which I correctly remember I had not done)
and then the upgrade from old version to new version went on.

So this confusion came to my mind if apt-get dist-upgrade can also
change the sources.list
Which you clarified in the next line.
>But "apt-get dist-upgrade" will _not_ change
> your sources.list at all.
This is what I wanted to confirm.
Thanks for clarifying it.
---------------------------------

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