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Old 01-20-2008, 02:34 AM
steve
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

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Conrad Knauer wrote:
| I note, via http://www.tectonic.co.za/?p=2053 that a blogger has
| posted an open letter to SABDFL
| http://www.deviceguru.com/2008/01/17/an-open-letter-to-mark-shuttleworth/
|
| ---
| Dear Mark,
|
| In order to maximize brand awareness, I recommend that you brand all
| forms of Ubuntu (i.e. Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Edubuntu, etc.) as
| various "Editions" of Ubuntu.
|
| So, for example, you might end up with something along the lines of:
|
| * Ubuntu GNOME Edition (aka "Ubuntu")
| * Ubuntu KDE Edition
| * Ubuntu Xfce Edition
| * Ubuntu Educational Edition
| * Ubuntu Server Edition (as is)
|
| I think it's critical to focus as much attention as possible on a
| single brand, Ubuntu, to maximize its adoption and success. Given the
| already fragmented nature of Linux, why fragment a specific
| distribution unnecessarily?
|
| It'd be great if I could finally be a Ubuntu user! I can't help it, I
| just happen to prefer KDE over GNOME ;-) But I'd feel more part of the
| Ubuntu community if the OS I run on the Black Tower was called Ubuntu.
|
| cheers,
| Rick
| DeviceGuru.com
| ---
|
| I don't have a stong opinion on this, though I tend to lean more
| towards the Tectonic POV, which is that "I don't see at as being
| necessary - all the versions are already based around the Ubuntu name,
| as are the logos based on the original Ubuntu theme with their own
| distinctive flavour."
|
| But I thought I'd post it here for comment.
|
| CK
|

heres a better idea. drop all the "edu", "xu", "ku" like he asks, and
let the installer decide what they want when they install like every
other distro. isnt uniformity what we should be after? OR just install
all 3 if they want, its not that much extra space. im betting the
percentage of users who have more than one desktop environment installed
is pretty great. like me, i have kde, xfce, and gnome installed. i use
gnome everyday, but kde has some great packages which i use as well.

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Old 01-20-2008, 10:10 AM
Brian Astill
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

On Sun, 20 Jan 2008 02:04:38 pm steve wrote:
> Conrad Knauer wrote:
|
> | * Ubuntu GNOME Edition (aka "Ubuntu")
> | * Ubuntu KDE Edition
> | * Ubuntu Xfce Edition
> | * Ubuntu Educational Edition
> | * Ubuntu Server Edition (as is)
> | Rick
> | DeviceGuru.com

> | I don't have a stong opinion on this
> | But I thought I'd post it here for comment.

Fair enough. I think the issue Rick raises is valid, though I'm
not attracted to his solution. As Steve said:

> heres a better idea. drop all the "edu", "xu", "ku" like he
> asks, and let the installer decide what they want when they
> install like every other distro.

Well yes, but the Education and Server "editions" do serve quite
special and particular needs. However, distinguishing solely on
the basis of which desktop the Ubuntu disk defaults to does seem
silly.

--
Regards,
Brian

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Old 01-20-2008, 10:33 AM
Oliver Grawert
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

hi,
On So, 2008-01-20 at 21:40 +1030, Brian Astill wrote:
> Well yes, but the Education and Server "editions" do serve quite
> special and particular needs. However, distinguishing solely on
> the basis of which desktop the Ubuntu disk defaults to does seem
> silly.
note that edubuntu is currently doing the step to become an addon to
desktop or server so it wont matter anymore whats under the hood (KDE,
xfce, gnome or a LAMP server)

pieces that come from the edu side but are also used in corporate or
home environments (like ltsp) move to the respective ubuntu CD (ltsp
moves to ubuntu-alternate, the edubuntu content server will sit on top
of a ubuntu-server LAMP install now, etc ...) so this step already
happens in the ubuntu world where its possible and might got further in
other parts of the distro in the future ...

ciao
oli



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Old 01-20-2008, 11:06 AM
Nils Kassube
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

steve wrote:
> heres a better idea. drop all the "edu", "xu", "ku" like he asks, and
> let the installer decide what they want when they install like every
> other distro. isnt uniformity what we should be after? OR just install
> all 3 if they want, its not that much extra space.

I doubt there is space enough on a single CD. On a Gutsy Kubuntu
installation, when I select to additionally install ubuntu-desktop, the
installer wants to fetch 255MB.

BTW: Why did you choose to change the mailing list? The original mail was
sent to sounder, which is the right place for this kind of discussion.


Nils

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Old 01-20-2008, 04:09 PM
steve
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

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Nils Kassube wrote:
| steve wrote:
|> heres a better idea. drop all the "edu", "xu", "ku" like he asks, and
|> let the installer decide what they want when they install like every
|> other distro. isnt uniformity what we should be after? OR just install
|> all 3 if they want, its not that much extra space.
|
| I doubt there is space enough on a single CD. On a Gutsy Kubuntu
| installation, when I select to additionally install ubuntu-desktop, the
| installer wants to fetch 255MB.
|
| BTW: Why did you choose to change the mailing list? The original mail was
| sent to sounder, which is the right place for this kind of discussion.
|
|
| Nils
|

sorry, when i hit reply it chose the user to reply to, deleted that,
hit "u" and thats the list that showed up first, never looked.


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Old 01-20-2008, 08:11 PM
Derek Broughton
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

steve wrote:

> heres a better idea. drop all the "edu", "xu", "ku" like he asks, and
> let the installer decide what they want when they install like every
> other distro. isnt uniformity what we should be after? OR just install
> all 3 if they want, its not that much extra space.

But it's enough extra space that it can't be done on a CD - which is still a
target.

Frankly, I'm saddened to find that as Kubuntu user I'm not really part of
Ubuntu. I might just go and slit my wrists now...
--
derek


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Old 01-20-2008, 10:16 PM
NoOp
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

On 01/20/2008 01:11 PM, Derek Broughton wrote:
> steve wrote:
>
>> heres a better idea. drop all the "edu", "xu", "ku" like he asks, and
>> let the installer decide what they want when they install like every
>> other distro. isnt uniformity what we should be after? OR just install
>> all 3 if they want, its not that much extra space.
>
> But it's enough extra space that it can't be done on a CD - which is still a
> target.
>
> Frankly, I'm saddened to find that as Kubuntu user I'm not really part of
> Ubuntu. I might just go and slit my wrists now...

U-tube ? :-)





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Old 01-21-2008, 03:14 AM
Charlie Kravetz
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

On Sun, 2008-01-20 at 13:06 +0100, Nils Kassube wrote:
> steve wrote:
> > heres a better idea. drop all the "edu", "xu", "ku" like he asks, and
> > let the installer decide what they want when they install like every
> > other distro. isnt uniformity what we should be after? OR just install
> > all 3 if they want, its not that much extra space.
>
> I doubt there is space enough on a single CD. On a Gutsy Kubuntu
> installation, when I select to additionally install ubuntu-desktop, the
> installer wants to fetch 255MB.
>
> BTW: Why did you choose to change the mailing list? The original mail was
> sent to sounder, which is the right place for this kind of discussion.
>
>
> Nils
>
Strangely enough, if I download the ubuntu-alternate CD, I can install
Ubuntu-desktop (which uses Gnome), then install the Xubuntu-desktop
and/or Kubuntu-desktop from that CD, cant I? Has that now been changed,
too? I have done that with 5.10, 6.06, and 7.04, at least. I have not
tried it in 7.10, yet. It did make it easier, since I did not have to
download the different versions each time.

Just my own thoughts,

--
Charlie Kravetz
Linux Registered User Number 425914 [http://counter.li.org/]
Never let anyone steal your DREAM. [http://keepingdreams.com]


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Old 01-21-2008, 02:10 PM
Nils Kassube
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

Charlie Kravetz wrote:
> On Sun, 2008-01-20 at 13:06 +0100, Nils Kassube wrote:
> > I doubt there is space enough on a single CD. On a Gutsy Kubuntu
> > installation, when I select to additionally install ubuntu-desktop,
> > the installer wants to fetch 255MB.
>
> Strangely enough, if I download the ubuntu-alternate CD, I can install
> Ubuntu-desktop (which uses Gnome), then install the Xubuntu-desktop
> and/or Kubuntu-desktop from that CD, cant I?

I just checked the alternate CD for Ubuntu 7.10. There is ONLY Ubuntu,
none of the other versions included. Are you sure, you installed from the
CD and not via internet download?


Nils

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Old 01-21-2008, 04:39 PM
"Liam Proven"
 
Default DeviceGuru's Open letter to Mark Shuttleworth

On 20/01/2008, steve <sfreilly@roadrunner.com> wrote:
> heres a better idea. drop all the "edu", "xu", "ku" like he asks, and
> let the installer decide what they want when they install like every
> other distro. isnt uniformity what we should be after? OR just install
> all 3 if they want, its not that much extra space. im betting the
> percentage of users who have more than one desktop environment installed
> is pretty great. like me, i have kde, xfce, and gnome installed. i use
> gnome everyday, but kde has some great packages which i use as well.

I disagree. I don't think that's a better idea at all. A large part of
the strength of the original Ubuntu system is that it doesn't ask the
user incomprehensible questions during setup; it just gets the job
done. A Linux novice won't know what the hell "KDE" is, nor will they
want to choose GNOME - a gnome is a lawn ornament to most people.

It's simple. Keep it that way.

--
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Email: lproven@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lproven@gmail.com
Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419
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