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Old 01-08-2009, 11:40 AM
"Ben Edwards"
 
Default Creating high quality avi from DVD

Over the years I have tried several programs to create avi files from
DVD. My files do not look anything as good/sharp of other peoples. I
am guessing it is the settings I am using, and the codecs. The
container does not have to be .avi. A program witch rips and encodes
on the ply would be good but quality is my main concern.

Any advice would be good, probably best to keep this thread focused on
quality of output rather than other aspects such as
functionality/usability.

Regards,
Ben

PS DVDRip-o-matic was one of the programs I got fairly good results with

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Old 01-08-2009, 01:36 PM
"Craig Hagerman"
 
Default Creating high quality avi from DVD

On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 9:40 PM, Ben Edwards <list4me2@googlemail.com> wrote:
> Over the years I have tried several programs to create avi files from
> DVD. My files do not look anything as good/sharp of other peoples. I
> am guessing it is the settings I am using, and the codecs. The
> container does not have to be .avi. A program witch rips and encodes
> on the ply would be good but quality is my main concern.
>
> Any advice would be good, probably best to keep this thread focused on
> quality of output rather than other aspects such as
> functionality/usability.
>
> Regards,
> Ben

I think DVD::Rip is usually considered one of the best apps for
ripping a DVD to avi. It has lots of configuration settings which are
mostly straightforward to allow you to rip to whatever quality you
want.

Craig

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Old 01-08-2009, 01:52 PM
Rashkae
 
Default Creating high quality avi from DVD

Ben Edwards wrote:
> Over the years I have tried several programs to create avi files from
> DVD. My files do not look anything as good/sharp of other peoples. I
> am guessing it is the settings I am using, and the codecs. The
> container does not have to be .avi. A program witch rips and encodes
> on the ply would be good but quality is my main concern.
>
> Any advice would be good, probably best to keep this thread focused on
> quality of output rather than other aspects such as
> functionality/usability.
>

Go right to the source. Mencoder is the program used almost universally
to encode the videos. There is much documentation and examples on the
mplayer web page.. Unfortunately, it's a bit of a black art with several
options available, so you'll have to be prepared to bite deep and do
some experimentation to find combinations that work well for you.

A quick note on codecs. H264 will give you better quality than the
traditional Xvid, the downside is that the H264 videos will not play on
DVD players that support Xvid/avi.

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Old 01-08-2009, 04:27 PM
"Ben Edwards"
 
Default Creating high quality avi from DVD

2009/1/8 Rashkae <ubuntu@tigershaunt.com>:
> Ben Edwards wrote:
>> Over the years I have tried several programs to create avi files from
>> DVD. My files do not look anything as good/sharp of other peoples. I
>> am guessing it is the settings I am using, and the codecs. The
>> container does not have to be .avi. A program witch rips and encodes
>> on the ply would be good but quality is my main concern.
>>
>> Any advice would be good, probably best to keep this thread focused on
>> quality of output rather than other aspects such as
>> functionality/usability.
>>
>
> Go right to the source. Mencoder is the program used almost universally
> to encode the videos. There is much documentation and examples on the
> mplayer web page.. Unfortunately, it's a bit of a black art with several
> options available, so you'll have to be prepared to bite deep and do
> some experimentation to find combinations that work well for you.
>
> A quick note on codecs. H264 will give you better quality than the
> traditional Xvid, the downside is that the H264 videos will not play on
> DVD players that support Xvid/avi.

Thats a good point, it would be good to play on xvid enabled DVD
players. I actually use a PS3 for most things, will have a look
around to see if I can create files it can play.

Regards,
Ben

>
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Old 01-08-2009, 09:22 PM
"Brian McKee"
 
Default Creating high quality avi from DVD

On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 12:27 PM, Ben Edwards <list4me2@googlemail.com> wrote:
> 2009/1/8 Rashkae <ubuntu@tigershaunt.com>:
>> Ben Edwards wrote:
>>> Any advice would be good, probably best to keep this thread focused on
>>> quality of output rather than other aspects such as
>>> functionality/usability.

Consider the 'tovid' set of tools, todisc, todvd etc. I've had some
success with them, and they are straightforward to use.
>> Go right to the source. Mencoder is the program used almost universally
>> to encode the videos. There is much documentation and examples on the
>> mplayer web page.. Unfortunately, it's a bit of a black art with several
>> options available, so you'll have to be prepared to bite deep and do
>> some experimentation to find combinations that work well for you.
>> A quick note on codecs. H264 will give you better quality than the
>> traditional Xvid, the downside is that the H264 videos will not play on
>> DVD players that support Xvid/avi.

Just a comment here - I keep seeing that in print, but the stuff I've
tried always worked out better with xvid/avi. H264 seems to make
horizontal lines at the point of motion that I notice right away and
find objectionable. Maybe it's just me, or maybe I just haven't ever
got the right settings for H264... Just expressing my experience.

Quality of output I think is a function of the experience and patience
of the encoder (the person) more than the software. Black art indeed.

Brian

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Old 01-17-2009, 07:20 PM
Loc Martin
 
Default Creating high quality avi from DVD

Ben Edwards wrote:
> Over the years I have tried several programs to create avi files from
> DVD. My files do not look anything as good/sharp of other peoples. I
> am guessing it is the settings I am using, and the codecs. The
> container does not have to be .avi. A program witch rips and encodes
> on the ply would be good but quality is my main concern.
>
> Any advice would be good, probably best to keep this thread focused on
> quality of output rather than other aspects such as
> functionality/usability.
>
> Regards,
> Ben
>
> PS DVDRip-o-matic was one of the programs I got fairly good results with
>

Sorry for the late reply, I was away.

To get best results, use the x264 codec to create MPEG4-AVC (H.264)
video, and encode the audio either in OGG (then you'll want to create an
.mkv file) or in AAC (you can then make an .mp4 file, even though .mkv
would still work).

Since you want to play them on a PS3 and want good quality, don't waste
your time with MPEG4-ASP (XVID, DivX...). The PS3, the PSP, Ipods and
Blueray players all have hardware decoding for MPEG4-AVC, and AFAIK
you'll want .mp4 files for those (not .mkv, even though you can play
.mkv on the PS3 if you install Linux on it).

If you're a beginner, use Avidemux, then chose the codecs and save as an
MP4 file.

Most newbie errors that results in a bad quality file are:
- forgetting to remove the black bars on top, bottom and sometimes on
the side (=cropping);
- not knowing that the resulting resolution (after cropping) needs to be
multiples of 16 for x264 encoding;
- resizing the video is a big mistake that was only necessary with
codecs that compressed badly (DivX) and on really low resolution
monitors - don't resize to get the desired aspect ratio, keep the lines
you have and use the aspect ratio parameter instead;
- encoding interlaced video is subpar, if your source is interlaced
encode it with the interlaced option in x264 and use filters when
reading the file on a computer LCD (TV should be ok).
- don't hardsub, add the subtitles as a separate track included in the
video file, you'll get better quality for the text (if you OCR it) in a
better resolution than the video itself, and save space (+ easy to
change the style when you read the video).

All those make a big difference in quality (along with choosing x264
over other codecs, I can tell because I still haven't finished
re-encoding my DVD from Xvid (audio in OGG) to x264 (audio in AAC). For
the audio, there's no real difference between OGG and AAC, but for MP4
it's MPEG4-AVC video + AAC audio.

Default options in Avidemux for x264 are quite conservative, I can't
help you for what the PS3 can support, but I'm sure you can use higher
options, esp for partition decision, method, max ref frames, mixed refs,
use as ref, bime. Always use two-pass encoding, for example the
size-based.

To refine the process, if you're trying to encode NTSC DVD of movies,
you can encode in the original (movie theater) 24fps instead of the
DVD's 29.97fps (PAL is less a problem since it's only 25fps).


To get access to more x264 options and use a better .mp4 muxer than the
one in Avidemux (gives troubles sometimes) use mencoder (video), faac
(audio) and mux with MP4Box (in the gpac package). With mencoder you can
use straight x264 libs and options.

For an example with mencoder + x264, here's a command line I use (it
most probably won't work on the PS3, you'll have to lower the options):

mencoder video.m2v -vf crop=720:544:0:16 -ofps 25 -nosound -of rawvideo
-o output.264 -ovc x264 -x264encopts
threads=6:bitrate=1400:bframes=16:b-pyramid:ref=6artitions=all:8x8dct:direct=tempora l:weightb:me=umh:merange=64:subme=7:b-rdo:mixed-refs:bime:trellis=2:no-fast-pskip:no-dct-decimate:nr=0:fps=25:sps-id=1ass=1

Faac is straightforward. MP4Box, for example:
MP4Box -par 1=16:9 Movie.mp4 -add output.264 -add
Japanese.aac:lang=japanese -add English.aac:lang=english -add
English.srt:lang=english

Cheers,
Loc

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Old 01-21-2009, 04:12 PM
Ben Edwards
 
Default Creating high quality avi from DVD

2009/1/17 Loc Martin <loic.martin3@gmail.com>:
> Ben Edwards wrote:
>> Over the years I have tried several programs to create avi files from
>> DVD. My files do not look anything as good/sharp of other peoples. I
>> am guessing it is the settings I am using, and the codecs. The
>> container does not have to be .avi. A program witch rips and encodes
>> on the ply would be good but quality is my main concern.
>>
>> Any advice would be good, probably best to keep this thread focused on
>> quality of output rather than other aspects such as
>> functionality/usability.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Ben
>>
>> PS DVDRip-o-matic was one of the programs I got fairly good results with
>>
>
> Sorry for the late reply, I was away.
>
> To get best results, use the x264 codec to create MPEG4-AVC (H.264)
> video, and encode the audio either in OGG (then you'll want to create an
> .mkv file) or in AAC (you can then make an .mp4 file, even though .mkv
> would still work).
>
> Since you want to play them on a PS3 and want good quality, don't waste
> your time with MPEG4-ASP (XVID, DivX...). The PS3, the PSP, Ipods and
> Blueray players all have hardware decoding for MPEG4-AVC, and AFAIK
> you'll want .mp4 files for those (not .mkv, even though you can play
> .mkv on the PS3 if you install Linux on it).
>
> If you're a beginner, use Avidemux, then chose the codecs and save as an
> MP4 file.
>
> Most newbie errors that results in a bad quality file are:
> - forgetting to remove the black bars on top, bottom and sometimes on
> the side (=cropping);
> - not knowing that the resulting resolution (after cropping) needs to be
> multiples of 16 for x264 encoding;
> - resizing the video is a big mistake that was only necessary with
> codecs that compressed badly (DivX) and on really low resolution
> monitors - don't resize to get the desired aspect ratio, keep the lines
> you have and use the aspect ratio parameter instead;
> - encoding interlaced video is subpar, if your source is interlaced
> encode it with the interlaced option in x264 and use filters when
> reading the file on a computer LCD (TV should be ok).
> - don't hardsub, add the subtitles as a separate track included in the
> video file, you'll get better quality for the text (if you OCR it) in a
> better resolution than the video itself, and save space (+ easy to
> change the style when you read the video).
>
> All those make a big difference in quality (along with choosing x264
> over other codecs, I can tell because I still haven't finished
> re-encoding my DVD from Xvid (audio in OGG) to x264 (audio in AAC). For
> the audio, there's no real difference between OGG and AAC, but for MP4
> it's MPEG4-AVC video + AAC audio.
>
> Default options in Avidemux for x264 are quite conservative, I can't
> help you for what the PS3 can support, but I'm sure you can use higher
> options, esp for partition decision, method, max ref frames, mixed refs,
> use as ref, bime. Always use two-pass encoding, for example the
> size-based.
>
> To refine the process, if you're trying to encode NTSC DVD of movies,
> you can encode in the original (movie theater) 24fps instead of the
> DVD's 29.97fps (PAL is less a problem since it's only 25fps).
>
>
> To get access to more x264 options and use a better .mp4 muxer than the
> one in Avidemux (gives troubles sometimes) use mencoder (video), faac
> (audio) and mux with MP4Box (in the gpac package). With mencoder you can
> use straight x264 libs and options.
>
> For an example with mencoder + x264, here's a command line I use (it
> most probably won't work on the PS3, you'll have to lower the options):
>
> mencoder video.m2v -vf crop=720:544:0:16 -ofps 25 -nosound -of rawvideo
> -o output.264 -ovc x264 -x264encopts
> threads=6:bitrate=1400:bframes=16:b-pyramid:ref=6artitions=all:8x8dct:direct=tempora l:weightb:me=umh:merange=64:subme=7:b-rdo:mixed-refs:bime:trellis=2:no-fast-pskip:no-dct-decimate:nr=0:fps=25:sps-id=1ass=1
>
> Faac is straightforward. MP4Box, for example:
> MP4Box -par 1=16:9 Movie.mp4 -add output.264 -add
> Japanese.aac:lang=japanese -add English.aac:lang=english -add
> English.srt:lang=english

Thanks a lot for taking the time and giving a very detailed/useful
reply. I do have a question about the audio. I tend to copy the
Dolby Digital audio rather than encode into .ogg etc. Am I correct in
guessing .ogg would give me a stereo, rather than surround sound,
track. I am verry keen to keep the surround sound. I guess this may
be using a lot of bandwidth and may result in the quality of the video
being not so good. I have actually gone to 1500 bits (with xvid) but
am not totally happy with the quality. I will give x264 a go.

Lastly do you know if there are any encoders that can use multiple cores?

Regards,
Ben

> Cheers,
> Loc
>
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Old 01-21-2009, 04:46 PM
Loc Martin
 
Default Creating high quality avi from DVD

Ben Edwards wrote:
> Thanks a lot for taking the time and giving a very detailed/useful
> reply. I do have a question about the audio. I tend to copy the
> Dolby Digital audio rather than encode into .ogg etc. Am I correct in
> guessing .ogg would give me a stereo, rather than surround sound,
> track. I am verry keen to keep the surround sound. I guess this may
> be using a lot of bandwidth and may result in the quality of the video
> being not so good. I have actually gone to 1500 bits (with xvid) but
> am not totally happy with the quality. I will give x264 a go.
>
> Lastly do you know if there are any encoders that can use multiple cores?

By surround sound I'm assuming you mean 5.1 or 7.1 audio, since you can
have a surround effect with 2 channels (Dobly surround).
You can just keep the AC3 audio as is (DVD audio should be AC3), I
reencode to aac or ogg because I'm never planning to have anything else
than a good 2.0 setup, but if you've got a home theater thing I guess
keeping the audio as is would be just fine (especially if you still have
enough space for 1500kbps). However, you can also have X.X audio with
AAC, and it should be the same for OGG. just check the size your audio
takes, and then it's just a trade-off between audio and video quality.

1500kbps for the video is more than enough for x264, you can encode
almost any movie, even without going to advanced options (but don't keep
Avidemux default options, they are really low). With good encoding
choices you can get as far as 1000kbps (or lower) especially for anime
(max the ref + bframes), CG movies and low pace movies, so you'd do
great with 1500kbps.

x264 through either mencoder or Avidemux use multiple cores, either auto
or by using the threads options (2 time more thread than your number of
cores). By default they don't max the load, so you can nice/renice them
to high priority and/or launch two or three encodes at the same time.
There 's a very small decrease in quality when you increase the thread
count, so a purist would lauch multiple encodes with a few thread each,
but if I use that method it's more for maximizing the load.

Loc

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