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Old 11-28-2007, 06:55 AM
John Summerfield
 
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Tim wrote:

o need, what I do works fine for me. And 'tis considered extremely bad

etiquette to try un-anonymising someone.


I've never heard that. I'm more bothered by those who try to hide behind
ridiculous pseudonyms.


It's true you cannot email me at this address any more, but it's done a
wonderful job on the spammers;-), and the name is actually the one my
parents gave me.







--

Cheers
John

-- spambait
1aaaaaaa@coco.merseine.nu Z1aaaaaaa@coco.merseine.nu
-- Advice
http://webfoot.com/advice/email.top.php
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

You cannot reply off-list:-)

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Old 11-28-2007, 08:08 AM
Ed Greshko
 
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Arthur Pemberton wrote:
> On Nov 27, 2007 8:35 AM, Ed Greshko <Ed.Greshko@greshko.com> wrote:
>> Tim wrote:
>>
>>> You'd hope so, but I think that's three unsub messages I've seen in the
>>> last few days. Sometimes people don't notice that the addresses aren't
>>> quite the same until another hint comes along.
>> Which is why, when I see these unsubscribe messages, I reply directly to the
>> individual and don't copy the list.
>
>
> Seems to me you're encouraging lazyness. It doesn't take much effort.

If you like, you can think that way. Or, you could think it is a simple
matter of avoiding more needless traffic on this mailing list.

I've no idea what you mean by "It doesn't take much effort". It takes me
more effort to send a private message to the induhvidual than the list and
the person still needs to unsubscribe the usual way.

These unsubscribe emails don't happen that often...but when they do they
clutter the list with more chatter...like this message...than the original
OP. If everyone/someone would just reply directly and not get all bent out
of shape...well you know the rest of the story.

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Old 11-28-2007, 08:20 AM
Tim
 
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Tim:
>> 'tis considered extremely bad etiquette to try un-anonymising someone.

John Summerfield:
> I've never heard that.

Good grief, it's bloody obvious if you apply a tiny amount of thought to
it. How stupid does one have to be to not realise that someone who
doesn't identify themselves does not want to be identified? Try looking
up general etiquette, then; never mind something specific to e-mail.
You've been around long enough that you ought to know that sort of
thing.

> I'm more bothered by those who try to hide behind ridiculous pseudonyms.

I do use my real name, just not all of it. E-mail addresses, the user
account name part (left of the @ sign), are not names. Or should we
call you "Debian"?

Consider yourself privileged, Debby, ;-) that I let strangers refer to
me by my first name, rather than sir, or mister in front of my surname.

> It's true you cannot email me at this address any more, but it's done a
> wonderful job on the spammers;-), and the name is actually the one my
> parents gave me.
>
>
> Cheers
> John
>
> -- spambait

Or is it "John Spambait"? (Comment not intended to be taken seriously.)

--
(This computer runs FC7, my others run FC4, FC5 & FC6, in case that's
important to the thread.)

Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored.
I read messages from the public lists.

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Old 11-28-2007, 08:57 AM
John Summerfield
 
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Tim wrote:

Tim:

'tis considered extremely bad etiquette to try un-anonymising someone.


John Summerfield:

I've never heard that.


Good grief, it's bloody obvious if you apply a tiny amount of thought to
it. How stupid does one have to be to not realise that someone who
doesn't identify themselves does not want to be identified? Try looking


Calm down Tim; if you didn't want to be identified, you've made several
mistakes, the most recent biting when I suggested the localhost name.
All _I_ knew for certain was where your email entered the Internet.


I did nothing difficult or time-consuming, and if you seriously don't
want to be identified, it's not hard to arrange it so that it's not so
trivial.


You and I both manage our own mail servers, it's trivial to create an
account (as I did), and to configure my name in
Seamonkey/Thunderbird/Kmail/Evolution or any other email client to
"Kevin Rudd" should I choose.




up general etiquette, then; never mind something specific to e-mail.
You've been around long enough that you ought to know that sort of
thing.


I'm more bothered by those who try to hide behind ridiculous pseudonyms.


I do use my real name, just not all of it. E-mail addresses, the user
account name part (left of the @ sign), are not names. Or should we
call you "Debian"?


Please yourself, spammers did. I actually created that address to use in
connexion with the taroon beta, to protect my more usual email addresses
from spammers.





Consider yourself privileged, Debby, ;-) that I let strangers refer to
me by my first name, rather than sir, or mister in front of my surname.


From my viewpoint, how would you describe your attitude now?

Calling me silly names doesn't make you look so good.



It's true you cannot email me at this address any more, but it's done a
wonderful job on the spammers;-), and the name is actually the one my
parents gave me.



Cheers
John

-- spambait


Or is it "John Spambait"? (Comment not intended to be taken seriously.)


??

Anyone writing to those addresses is, by definition, a spammer.

--

Cheers
John

-- spambait
1aaaaaaa@coco.merseine.nu Z1aaaaaaa@coco.merseine.nu
-- Advice
http://webfoot.com/advice/email.top.php
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

You cannot reply off-list:-)

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Old 11-28-2007, 01:10 PM
Tim
 
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Tim:
>> Good grief, it's bloody obvious if you apply a tiny amount of thought to
>> it. How stupid does one have to be to not realise that someone who
>> doesn't identify themselves does not want to be identified?

John Summerfield:
> Calm down Tim; if you didn't want to be identified, you've made several
> mistakes, the most recent biting when I suggested the localhost name.
> All _I_ knew for certain was where your email entered the Internet.

I'm only mildly annoyed. I'm more surprised, than anything else, that
you'd do something so daft.

I make a trivial effort to remain relatively anonymous, and avoid the
usual spam harvesters. It doesn't stop those who know what they're
doing from working things out, but I'd expect that such people would
know better than to do what you did.

>> I do use my real name, just not all of it. E-mail addresses, the user
>> account name part (left of the @ sign), are not names. Or should we
>> call you "Debian"?

> Please yourself, spammers did. I actually created that address to use in
> connexion with the taroon beta, to protect my more usual email addresses
> from spammers.

On other mailing lists, where I had decided to let people contact me, I
had an e-mail address beginning with "sir". At least it forced a bit of
manners on to address harvesting spammers, such junk mail came addressed
to me as "dear sir". ;-) 'twas nothing more than a private joke,
though.

>> Consider yourself privileged, Debby, ;-) that I let strangers refer to
>> me by my first name, rather than sir, or mister in front of my surname.

> From my viewpoint, how would you describe your attitude now?

It's called paying someone out for doing two things as daft as you did.
Not respecting anonymity, then going on to talk to me about using
pseudonyms when I was already using my real name, and not using any
pseudonyms. If you'd looked a bit harder, you'd have noticed those
points.

If I was going to flame you, I'd be far more scathing.

--
(This computer runs FC7, my others run FC4, FC5 & FC6, in case that's
important to the thread.)

Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored.
I read messages from the public lists.

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Old 11-28-2007, 10:23 PM
John Summerfield
 
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Tim wrote:

Tim:

Good grief, it's bloody obvious if you apply a tiny amount of thought to
it. How stupid does one have to be to not realise that someone who
doesn't identify themselves does not want to be identified?


John Summerfield:
Calm down Tim; if you didn't want to be identified, you've made several
mistakes, the most recent biting when I suggested the localhost name.
All _I_ knew for certain was where your email entered the Internet.


I'm only mildly annoyed. I'm more surprised, than anything else, that
you'd do something so daft.

I make a trivial effort to remain relatively anonymous, and avoid the
usual spam harvesters. It doesn't stop those who know what they're
doing from working things out, but I'd expect that such people would
know better than to do what you did.


The email address I suggested is unusable outside your mail server. See
what the host IP address is. That was the key point to my suggestion.





I do use my real name, just not all of it. E-mail addresses, the user
account name part (left of the @ sign), are not names. Or should we
call you "Debian"?


Please yourself, spammers did. I actually created that address to use in
connexion with the taroon beta, to protect my more usual email addresses
from spammers.


On other mailing lists, where I had decided to let people contact me, I
had an e-mail address beginning with "sir". At least it forced a bit of
manners on to address harvesting spammers, such junk mail came addressed
to me as "dear sir". ;-) 'twas nothing more than a private joke,
though.


<->




Consider yourself privileged, Debby, ;-) that I let strangers refer to
me by my first name, rather than sir, or mister in front of my surname.



From my viewpoint, how would you describe your attitude now?


It's called paying someone out for doing two things as daft as you did.
Not respecting anonymity, then going on to talk to me about using
pseudonyms when I was already using my real name, and not using any
pseudonyms. If you'd looked a bit harder, you'd have noticed those
points.


It's perfectly possible that you've overlooked something, maybe that the
email address I used is unusable, though it's in your power to change
that when you need to receive its email to subscribe to a list.



If I was going to flame you, I'd be far more scathing.


That would reflect more on you than on me. To illustrate, Malcolm
Turnbull's assertion we should have signed the Kyoto agreement has, I'm
sure, offended more people than it's pleased. Assuming he wins today's
vote, he could subsequently agree with the new government's decision to
sign it, there's no need for any particular comment or criticism on
previous leadership.




--

Cheers
John

-- spambait
1aaaaaaa@coco.merseine.nu Z1aaaaaaa@coco.merseine.nu
-- Advice
http://webfoot.com/advice/email.top.php
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

You cannot reply off-list:-)

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Old 11-28-2007, 10:36 PM
Craig White
 
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On Thu, 2007-11-29 at 08:23 +0900, John Summerfield wrote:
> Tim wrote:
> > Tim:
> >>> Good grief, it's bloody obvious if you apply a tiny amount of thought to
> >>> it. How stupid does one have to be to not realise that someone who
> >>> doesn't identify themselves does not want to be identified?
> >
> > John Summerfield:
> >> Calm down Tim; if you didn't want to be identified, you've made several
> >> mistakes, the most recent biting when I suggested the localhost name.
> >> All _I_ knew for certain was where your email entered the Internet.
> >
> > I'm only mildly annoyed. I'm more surprised, than anything else, that
> > you'd do something so daft.
> >
> > I make a trivial effort to remain relatively anonymous, and avoid the
> > usual spam harvesters. It doesn't stop those who know what they're
> > doing from working things out, but I'd expect that such people would
> > know better than to do what you did.
>
> The email address I suggested is unusable outside your mail server. See
> what the host IP address is. That was the key point to my suggestion.
>
>
> >
> >>> I do use my real name, just not all of it. E-mail addresses, the user
> >>> account name part (left of the @ sign), are not names. Or should we
> >>> call you "Debian"?
> >
> >> Please yourself, spammers did. I actually created that address to use in
> >> connexion with the taroon beta, to protect my more usual email addresses
> >> from spammers.
> >
> > On other mailing lists, where I had decided to let people contact me, I
> > had an e-mail address beginning with "sir". At least it forced a bit of
> > manners on to address harvesting spammers, such junk mail came addressed
> > to me as "dear sir". ;-) 'twas nothing more than a private joke,
> > though.
>
> <->
>
> >
> >>> Consider yourself privileged, Debby, ;-) that I let strangers refer to
> >>> me by my first name, rather than sir, or mister in front of my surname.
> >
> >> From my viewpoint, how would you describe your attitude now?
> >
> > It's called paying someone out for doing two things as daft as you did.
> > Not respecting anonymity, then going on to talk to me about using
> > pseudonyms when I was already using my real name, and not using any
> > pseudonyms. If you'd looked a bit harder, you'd have noticed those
> > points.
>
> It's perfectly possible that you've overlooked something, maybe that the
> email address I used is unusable, though it's in your power to change
> that when you need to receive its email to subscribe to a list.
>
> > If I was going to flame you, I'd be far more scathing.
----
aussie aussie aussie
oy oy oy

are you guys having fun?

Craig

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Old 11-29-2007, 09:49 AM
Tim
 
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Tim:
>> I make a trivial effort to remain relatively anonymous, and avoid the
>> usual spam harvesters. It doesn't stop those who know what they're
>> doing from working things out, but I'd expect that such people would
>> know better than to do what you did.

John Summerfield:
> The email address I suggested is unusable outside your mail server. See
> what the host IP address is. That was the key point to my suggestion.

I know, but 'twasn't anon, that's my key point against it. If I wanted
to use my own domain name on here, I could do so, in any manner of
different ways, and still block reception of mail to it (null
sub-domains, non-existent mail boxes, etc.). You weren't telling me
anything that I didn't already know, thought about, and rejected long
ago.

>> It's called paying someone out for doing two things as daft as you did.
>> Not respecting anonymity, then going on to talk to me about using
>> pseudonyms when I was already using my real name, and not using any
>> pseudonyms. If you'd looked a bit harder, you'd have noticed those
>> points.

> It's perfectly possible that you've overlooked something, maybe that the
> email address I used is unusable, though it's in your power to change
> that when you need to receive its email to subscribe to a list.

The one who missed things was you. I wasn't using pseudonyms, I already
had an address that blocked spam, and it was a real e-mail address. My
mail client was already set up exactly as you were telling me to change
it to ("from" addressing information, etc.). You looked at the wrong
information (message IDs and mail SERVER addresses in the headers).
Look again... this time not quoting the information. I'd have to stuff
up using proper domain names throughout my entire computer network to
remove that information.

--
(This computer runs FC7, my others run FC4, FC5 & FC6, in case that's
important to the thread.)

Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored.
I read messages from the public lists.

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Old 11-29-2007, 09:52 AM
Tim
 
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On Wed, 2007-11-28 at 16:36 -0700, Craig White wrote:
> aussie aussie aussie
> oy oy oy

I never head that childish chant before until we had some soldiers doing
some sort of rescue mission overseas. It's not a part of *our* culture.

> are you guys having fun?

No, this isn't what I call fun, it's just a conversation. Fun would be
me down at the beach in the recent weather that we've been having.

--
(This computer runs FC7, my others run FC4, FC5 & FC6, in case that's
important to the thread.)

Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored.
I read messages from the public lists.

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Old 11-29-2007, 10:07 AM
Res
 
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On Thu, 29 Nov 2007, Tim wrote:


On Wed, 2007-11-28 at 16:36 -0700, Craig White wrote:

aussie aussie aussie
oy oy oy


I never head that childish chant before until we had some soldiers doing
some sort of rescue mission overseas. It's not a part of *our* culture.


You live an incredibly sheltered life Timothy, I recall that from when I
was a small kid, its an occurance at international sporting events and has
been for several decades.



--
Cheers
Res


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