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Old 12-03-2007, 08:28 AM
Janne Jokitalo
 
Default Mailing list etiquette

Luis de Bethencourt wrote:

...a meaningless one-liner and left a whole bunch of contentless quote to boot.

People, please, do watch what you're writing on a very concentrated mailing
list. I'm sure I speak for many here, when I say TRIM the quotes, and
consider first whether that damned funny one-liner really has importance in
the first place so that it is necessary for others to see.

This is not IRC, after all.

Oh, and some of us mind the top-posting too.

I know, I'm such a bore...


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Old 12-03-2007, 03:37 PM
Larry Lines
 
Default Mailing list etiquette

On Mon, 2007-12-03 at 11:28 +0200, Janne Jokitalo wrote:
> Luis de Bethencourt wrote:
>
> ...a meaningless one-liner and left a whole bunch of contentless quote to boot.
>
> People, please, do watch what you're writing on a very concentrated mailing
> list. I'm sure I speak for many here, when I say TRIM the quotes, and
> consider first whether that damned funny one-liner really has importance in
> the first place so that it is necessary for others to see.
>
> This is not IRC, after all.
>
> Oh, and some of us mind the top-posting too.
>
> I know, I'm such a bore...
>
>
> --
> Jaska

I wasn't going to mention this but since this was brought up. I don't
mind the witty quips. The top-posting bothers me. And it wouldn't
bother me if it were only top posting. But some people do the normal
mailing list post at the end. Some top post and the thread ends up
being a jumble of eventually unreadable squibble. If I want to glean
any useful information out of the post, I have to jump back and forth
and figure out who is answering who. It really makes for a useless
mailing list. I am on several because of various responsibilities and
to tell the truth, as soon as I see the jumping around, I skip the post.

For those of you who don't know mailing list etiquette, if you are
replying to a post, go to the end of the email and add your text to the
end of the email. Really it's amazing how useless the information in
the list can end up becoming if this simple rule isn't followed.

Larry Lines


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Old 12-03-2007, 07:25 PM
Larry Lines
 
Default Mailing List Etiquette

I received a couple of emails in response to my words on etiquette and
top posting. I'd like to reveal that I am actually new (about two
months) to this list as well. So I am no authority on the use or
etiquette of this list. I just thought it would be nice to point out
that general rule. I plan on being a part of Ubuntu Studio lists for a
while and getting more involved. So there's my disclaimer.

The emails I received seemed to be from people generally newer to the
Linux community asking for general rules on mailing list etiquette. I
looked for a general etiquette for Linux mailing lists faq or something
on google, but basically each mailing list has its own etiquette and
usually you can find those rules somewhere. Since Ubuntu Studio is an
offshoot of Ubuntu and we seem to be using their resources for forums
etc, I thought that the rules listed for Ubuntu mailing lists probably
apply to Ubuntu Studio:

http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community/mailinglists/etiquette

If I am wrong and there is a better resource for Ubuntu Studio, someone
with more authority on the subject is sure to chime in.

Also, I hope the etiquette discussion doesn't make people apprehensive
about posing to the list. In my experience, an active list is a good
list. When the posts trail off, the list's relevance dies.

Larry Lines


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Old 12-03-2007, 07:36 PM
"Cory K."
 
Default Mailing List Etiquette

Larry Lines wrote:
> http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community/mailinglists/etiquette
>
> If I am wrong and there is a better resource for Ubuntu Studio, someone
> with more authority on the subject is sure to chime in.
>

Nope. That's perfect.

> Also, I hope the etiquette discussion doesn't make people apprehensive
> about posing to the list. In my experience, an active list is a good
> list. When the posts trail off, the list's relevance dies.
>
> Larry Lines
>

I want to see a active list but just know that the topic should somehow
relate to Ubuntu Studio. Like I said before it should relate to
multimedia and not lots of general chat.

So even with this topic there's no need for a bazillion replies to the
thread. This above link was perfect.

I do want to also say that real-time chat about things like this is
better on IRC.

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InternetRelayChat

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcGuidelines


-Cory m/

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Old 12-04-2007, 08:55 AM
"Det"
 
Default Mailing List Etiquette

Ok folks,

after joking and fooling around a bit (what in every community sometimes
simply must be) I feel obliged to give a short reply to this more serious
stuff too, hoping also that the future will bring more on-topic stuff
(twinkling to Cory).

Larry Lines wrote:
> But some people do the normal mailing list post at the end.
[...]
> For those of you who don't know mailing list etiquette, if you are
> replying to a post, go to the end of the email and add your text to the
> end of the email.

It is indeed not only top-posting or bottom-posting, so "going to
the end" is not enough.
The principle is: trim the quote to the statements you
want to respond to, then answer inline!

I strongly second this critics, as I receive this mailing list as a digest
and it is very annoying to read the ONE resulting mail if the noise
ratio is too big.

As being member of many lists since years, and having been adminstrator
and moderator on some too, I consider it indeed a serious topic to be
recognised by writers, especially in a list which has the chance to
become a high traffic list, like this one.

> I looked for a general etiquette for Linux mailing lists faq or something
> on google, but basically each mailing list has its own etiquette and
> usually you can find those rules somewhere.

That leads to the impression there may be no "general etiquette",
but that is wrong.

The term for this is 'Netiquette' (Net+Etiquette) and is as old as
computer networking is. It evolved already at Usenet times, before
WWW was even invented. Quoting is only part of it, there is much
more to learn (about behaviour, sending HTML-Mails a.s.o.) .
But quoting is one of the most important things.

Since 1995 those rules are even formulated as "Request for Comment",
which is the form of specifications of the Internet Engineering Task Force.
(E.g. each technical protocol like tcp, ip, smtp, pop, http, ftp, irc
a.s.o. are specificied in such RFCs).

Sorry, long post, here is the link :
http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc1855

KR
Det


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Old 05-03-2011, 12:07 AM
NoOp
 
Default Mailing list etiquette

Just a friendly reminder to folks that are new to this list, please read:

http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community/mailinglists

Mailing list etiquette
These guidelines are designed to keep the productivity of the Ubuntu
mailing lists at a high level. They represent the conventions currently
used by the majority of participants in the mailing lists, and should be
used as a frame of reference for mailing list etiquette.

o Please bottom post & trim.
o Please avoid sending emails in HTML format, if possible.

Thanks. :-)




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Old 05-03-2011, 01:52 AM
chris
 
Default Mailing list etiquette

On Mon, 2011-05-02 at 17:07 -0700, NoOp wrote:
> Just a friendly reminder to folks that are new to this list, please read:
>
> http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community/mailinglists
>
> Mailing list etiquette
> These guidelines are designed to keep the productivity of the Ubuntu
> mailing lists at a high level. They represent the conventions currently
> used by the majority of participants in the mailing lists, and should be
> used as a frame of reference for mailing list etiquette.
>
> o Please bottom post & trim.
> o Please avoid sending emails in HTML format, if possible.
>
> Thanks. :-)
>
>
>
>

Does this also apply to sounder?



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Old 05-03-2011, 02:19 AM
NoOp
 
Default Mailing list etiquette

On 05/02/2011 06:52 PM, chris wrote:
> On Mon, 2011-05-02 at 17:07 -0700, NoOp wrote:
>> Just a friendly reminder to folks that are new to this list, please read:
>>
>> http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community/mailinglists
>>
>> Mailing list etiquette
>> These guidelines are designed to keep the productivity of the Ubuntu
>> mailing lists at a high level. They represent the conventions currently
>> used by the majority of participants in the mailing lists, and should be
>> used as a frame of reference for mailing list etiquette.
>>
>> o Please bottom post & trim.
>> o Please avoid sending emails in HTML format, if possible.
>>
>> Thanks. :-)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> Does this also apply to sounder?

Yes both you and I know that the page still references sounder... but
don't you think your continued posts on this list regarding sounder a
getting a bit tiring? Surely you must have the latest CouncilAgenda...

Let's try this one:
Code of Conduct
- Step down considerately
- Avoid flamewars, trolling, personal attacks, and repetitive arguments



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Old 05-03-2011, 10:07 PM
Robert Holtzman
 
Default Mailing list etiquette

On Tue, May 03, 2011 at 01:52:37PM +1200, chris wrote:
> On Mon, 2011-05-02 at 17:07 -0700, NoOp wrote:
> > Just a friendly reminder to folks that are new to this list, please read:
> >
> > http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community/mailinglists
> >
> > Mailing list etiquette
> > These guidelines are designed to keep the productivity of the Ubuntu
> > mailing lists at a high level. They represent the conventions currently
> > used by the majority of participants in the mailing lists, and should be
> > used as a frame of reference for mailing list etiquette.
> >
> > o Please bottom post & trim.
> > o Please avoid sending emails in HTML format, if possible.
> >
> > Thanks. :-)
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> Does this also apply to sounder?

Careful. You'll upset Alan.

--
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Key ID: 8D549279
"If you think you're getting free lunch,
check the price of the beer"
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Old 05-04-2011, 01:05 AM
NoOp
 
Default Mailing list etiquette

On 05/03/2011 03:07 PM, Robert Holtzman wrote:
> On Tue, May 03, 2011 at 01:52:37PM +1200, chris wrote:
>> On Mon, 2011-05-02 at 17:07 -0700, NoOp wrote:
>> > Just a friendly reminder to folks that are new to this list, please read:
>> >
>> > http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community/mailinglists
>> >
>> > Mailing list etiquette
>> > These guidelines are designed to keep the productivity of the Ubuntu
>> > mailing lists at a high level. They represent the conventions currently
>> > used by the majority of participants in the mailing lists, and should be
>> > used as a frame of reference for mailing list etiquette.
>> >
>> > o Please bottom post & trim.
>> > o Please avoid sending emails in HTML format, if possible.
>> >
>> > Thanks. :-)

>>
>> Does this also apply to sounder?
>
> Careful. You'll upset Alan.

Really? And where were you at 21:00 UTC today?

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncilAgenda
http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/05/03/%23ubuntu-meeting.html#t22:01
Ironic that all the fuss regarding sounder & when the Ubuntu Community
Council provided the 'users' a chance to show up & voice their opinions
only Amadee and myself commented.

I personally didn't have much to say as I think sounder was out of
control & given the lack of 'concerned sounder users' at the meeting I
figured there wasn't much point in saying much anyway.
(BTW: Thanks Amadee for at least showing up and offering
comments/opinions).
But the point being is that CC members *did* show up ready and willing
to discuss the issue with the "community" & the fact of the matter is
that those that may have had a genuine concern regarding sounder other
than Amadee or myself were nowhere to be seen. This is akin to folks
complaining about the recent <insert government official> election, but
never bothered to vote...

I reckon that if you'd like to discuss this further you can take it to
http://groups.google.com/group/bikeshed/, or alt.os.linux.ubuntu, or
some other forum, or even take it off-list and email me directly & have
at it. But your, and Chris', trolling regarding sounder and Alan in a
post intended to help new users & other users on this list isn't
appreciated.



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