On Jan 14, 2008 7:07 PM, Joel Bryan Juliano <joelbryan.juliano@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> If burning files is much concerned, using Nautilus CD Burner is the
> easiest way for both advanced
> and new users.
Brasero is just as easy, did you try it (especially the latest
version, 0.7)? Anyway, n-c-b is still included for now.
> To clear up some preconceptions, Nautilus:
>
> 1. does asks the user to blank non-empty CD-RW & DVD-RW's upon writing.
Yes, but it cannot blank cd's withouth writing to them.
> 2. burns CUE files via right-clicking it and choosing "Write to Disk".
Yes, as I wrote in my first email, serpentine does not support cue
files, n-c-b does.
> I think any other features is a niche, and/or can be done manually.
I would not consider features like inhibiting Gnome Power Manager from
suspending while burning niche, that is something that should just
work.
Wouter.
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01-14-2008, 10:33 PM
Sebastien Bacher
Proposal: include Brasero by default
Le mardi 15 janvier 2008 à 00:08 +0100, Wouter Stomp a écrit :
> On Jan 14, 2008 7:07 PM, Joel Bryan Juliano <joelbryan.juliano@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > If burning files is much concerned, using Nautilus CD Burner is the
> > easiest way for both advanced
> > and new users.
>
> Brasero is just as easy, did you try it (especially the latest
> version, 0.7)? Anyway, n-c-b is still included for now.
>
> > To clear up some preconceptions, Nautilus:
> >
> > 1. does asks the user to blank non-empty CD-RW & DVD-RW's upon writing.
>
> Yes, but it cannot blank cd's withouth writing to them.
The most common case you blank a CD-RW is to writte something else on
it, there might be some case where users want to clean datas there but
that's rather a corner case and could be done by some other way
> I would not consider features like inhibiting Gnome Power Manager from
> suspending while burning niche, that is something that should just
> work.
That's rather a small bug and likely easy to fix, the software just need
to send a signal over dbus
Sebastien Bacher
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01-14-2008, 10:43 PM
Matthew Garrett
Proposal: include Brasero by default
On Tue, Jan 15, 2008 at 12:08:06AM +0100, Wouter Stomp wrote:
> I would not consider features like inhibiting Gnome Power Manager from
> suspending while burning niche, that is something that should just
> work.
Well, that's clearly a bug that needs fixing in Nautilus in any case.
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01-15-2008, 08:00 AM
David Prieto
Proposal: include Brasero by default
Hi Sebastien,
That has already been discussed to the desktop team meeting some days
ago and we decided to give it a try
Have you thought of the possibility (since Brasero does everything Nautilus-cd-burner does, and more) to have the places → cd creator menu item launch Brasero? It would be good not to overpopulate the menus, and having two different applications for a single task would confuse newcomers anyway.
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01-15-2008, 08:52 AM
"Wouter Stomp"
Proposal: include Brasero by default
On Jan 15, 2008 12:33 AM, Sebastien Bacher <seb128@ubuntu.com> wrote:
> > I would not consider features like inhibiting Gnome Power Manager from
> > suspending while burning niche, that is something that should just
> > work.
>
> That's rather a small bug and likely easy to fix, the software just need
> to send a signal over dbus
>
No matter how easy it is to fix, that is irrelevant when it isn't
done. There has been an open bug report on that for 18 months.
Wouter.
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01-15-2008, 09:51 AM
"Wouter Stomp"
Proposal: include Brasero by default
On Jan 15, 2008 10:00 AM, David Prieto <frandavid100@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Have you thought of the possibility (since Brasero does everything
> Nautilus-cd-burner does, and more) to have the places → cd creator menu item
> launch Brasero? It would be good not to overpopulate the menus, and having
> two different applications for a single task would confuse newcomers anyway.
I would also like to argue for this: Brasero does everything n-c-b
does, and more. One of the goals/specs set for hardy is reducing
duplication within Ubuntu. If we would add brasero but keep n-c-b as
well we will be increasing the amount of duplicate functionality.
What is even more important is that ncb and brasero have a very, very
similar user interface, but not exactly the same. This can be very
confusing, as it feels like you are working with the same application
but then e.g. suddenly the burn cd button has moved to a different
location.
Some concerns have been raised about brasero being a more advanced
program with more options that you don't really need, but I think that
is not the case. The programs, if you disable the sidebar in both,
look almost identical. There is no options or preferences dialog in
brasero. It does all things ncb does with equal ease, but at the same
time it doesn't have the limitations that I mentioned in my first
email.
Wouter.
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01-15-2008, 10:11 AM
David Prieto
Proposal: include Brasero by default
I would also like to argue for this: Brasero does everything n-c-b
does, and more. One of the goals/specs set for hardy is reducing
duplication within Ubuntu. If we would add brasero but keep n-c-b as
well we will be increasing the amount of duplicate functionality.
What is even more important is that ncb and brasero have a very, very
similar user interface, but not exactly the same. This can be very
confusing, as it feels like you are working with the same application
but then e.g. suddenly the burn cd button has moved to a different
location.
Some concerns have been raised about brasero being a more advanced
program with more options that you don't really need, but I think that
is not the case. The programs, if you disable the sidebar in both,
look almost identical. There is no options or preferences dialog in
brasero. It does all things ncb does with equal ease, but at the same
time it doesn't have the limitations that I mentioned in my first
email.
That's exactly my point. In Bug #183130 Sebastien says that "nautilus-cd-burner is easier to use for simple task", but how exactly is that so? I have both open now and they look basically the same to me, except brasero has a bar indicating how much free space I have left.
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01-15-2008, 10:39 AM
Sebastien Bacher
Proposal: include Brasero by default
(no need to copy me on reply I'm subscribed to the list)
Le mardi 15 janvier 2008 à 10:52 +0100, Wouter Stomp a écrit :
> On Jan 15, 2008 12:33 AM, Sebastien Bacher <seb128@ubuntu.com> wrote:
> >
> > That's rather a small bug and likely easy to fix, the software just need
> > to send a signal over dbus
> >
>
> No matter how easy it is to fix, that is irrelevant when it isn't
> done. There has been an open bug report on that for 18 months.
And next time you find a bug in brasero not fixed yet you will advice
switching to yet another software?
That's not really a constructive comment. The bug has no duplicate, no
comment since it has been opened and no new subscriber, it doesn't look
like an issue really annoying users and such not a priority to be worked
Sebastien Bacher
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01-15-2008, 11:26 AM
"Wouter Stomp"
Proposal: include Brasero by default
On Jan 15, 2008 12:39 PM, Sebastien Bacher <seb128@ubuntu.com> wrote:
> And next time you find a bug in brasero not fixed yet you will advice
> switching to yet another software?
No of course not. This is only one of the many issues mentioned
earlier. Have you read my first email? Besides that, development of
brasero is very active, with bugs like these getting fixed very fast.
> That's not really a constructive comment.
Why?
> The bug has no duplicate,
The amount of duplicates doesn't say anything. This bug is not likely
to occur often, but when it happens, you have wasted a cd or dvd. This
is just something basic that applications should get right.
> no comment since it has been opened
Plenty of comments in the upstream bug report.
http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=344949
Wouter.
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01-15-2008, 12:08 PM
Matthew Paul Thomas
Proposal: include Brasero by default
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Wouter Stomp wrote:
>...
> What is even more important is that ncb and brasero have a very, very
> similar user interface, but not exactly the same. This can be very
> confusing, as it feels like you are working with the same application
> but then e.g. suddenly the burn cd button has moved to a different
> location.
>...
Removing nautilus-cd-burner wouldn't fix the problem you describe:
unnecessary UI inconsistency would still exist with Brasero vs. Nautilus
itself. Why is creating a new folder done one way in Nautilus, and
another way in Brasero? Why is removing files from a folder done way in
Nautilus, and another way in Brasero? Why does the confirmation alert
for replacing an item with the same name have different text and buttons
in Brasero than it does in Nautilus? Why does Brasero refer to
non-existent "projects"? And so on.
All these differences people shouldn't have to learn. The ideal data CD
(and CD image) burning interface would be a strict superset of the
normal interface for the file manager. nautilus-cd-burner provides this
for many use cases, but it's missing basic features (like multi-session
burning) that Brasero provides.
So if you want to solve the duplication problem thoroughly, implement
the missing data CD features in nautilus-cd-burner (branching it if
necessary), and the missing audio CD features in Rhythmbox. :-)
Cheers
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Matthew Paul Thomas
http://mpt.net.nz/
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Proposal: include Brasero by default
