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Old 10-29-2008, 06:20 PM
"Mark Ellse"
 
Default Inability to browse Windows shares.

Jono Bacon suggested I subscribe to this list to raise the profile of bug 207072. This bug is a Nautilus one. It prevents Nautilus (and therefore the normal Ubuntu user) from browsing Windows shares on an Ubuntu computer connected to a Windows network.


This bug turns Ubuntu from a very useful operating system,* which one can recommend to ones friends and colleagues, to something that is pretty much useless.

I run a school. We have a number of Ubuntu workstations and LTSP servers on the staff networks. All this was set up since Ubuntu had for quite a while demonstrated its ability to browse Windows networks, and therefore be up to the task of deployment in a Windows network.


When Hardy was first released, it worked as well. But some update prevented browing, and hence it has become useless.

Since I, as principal of the school, have deployed Ubuntu, I look stupid and incompetent. I can tough that out. But had I been simply the IT manager, pushing for Ubuntu consideration, I'd have lost all future credibiltiy.


What interests me is that when I email Jono about the bug, he doesn't know anything about it. So there are clearly a large number of people who are using, and talking about, Ubuntu without having to experience that important Ubuntu-Windows interface in which a large part of the world lives.


Is there any development about this bug? Or are most of those who are involved in developing Ubuntu unaware of it, and its importance?

And if there is anyone working on it, is there any anticipated timescale for solution?


Cheers,

Mark Ellse

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/207072



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Old 10-31-2008, 05:57 PM
Renzo Bagnati
 
Default Inability to browse Windows shares.

I have reported this bug one month before the release of hardy; it is
not a nautilus bug, but a bug in the gvfs backend used to browse samba
shares. The bug was immediately forwarded to the upstream gnome
developers, however they have started to address it only recently: see
the last comments at http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=524485

I'm also of the opinion that this bug has prevented many people from
using ubuntu (and other distributions that included gnome 2.22 and
above) inside windows networks.

There are situations, inside AD networks, in which this bug can be
overcome. They are described in the launchpad bug comments.
Also some patches have been made, but they cause other severe regressions.

Hope that this bug will be solved soon, for the benefit of ubuntu and
linux in general.

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Old 11-02-2008, 07:01 AM
Scott Ritchie
 
Default Inability to browse Windows shares.

Mark Ellse wrote:
> Jono Bacon suggested I subscribe to this list to raise the profile of
> bug 207072. This bug is a Nautilus one. It prevents Nautilus (and
> therefore the normal Ubuntu user) from browsing Windows shares on an
> Ubuntu computer connected to a Windows network.
>
> This bug turns Ubuntu from a very useful operating system, which one
> can recommend to ones friends and colleagues, to something that is
> pretty much useless.
>
> I run a school. We have a number of Ubuntu workstations and LTSP servers
> on the staff networks. All this was set up since Ubuntu had for quite a
> while demonstrated its ability to browse Windows networks, and therefore
> be up to the task of deployment in a Windows network.
>
> When Hardy was first released, it worked as well. But some update
> prevented browing, and hence it has become useless.
>
> Since I, as principal of the school, have deployed Ubuntu, I look stupid
> and incompetent. I can tough that out. But had I been simply the IT
> manager, pushing for Ubuntu consideration, I'd have lost all future
> credibiltiy.
>
> What interests me is that when I email Jono about the bug, he doesn't
> know anything about it. So there are clearly a large number of people
> who are using, and talking about, Ubuntu without having to experience
> that important Ubuntu-Windows interface in which a large part of the
> world lives.
>
> Is there any development about this bug? Or are most of those who are
> involved in developing Ubuntu unaware of it, and its importance?
>
> And if there is anyone working on it, is there any anticipated timescale
> for solution?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Mark Ellse
>
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/207072
>
>

Have you installed Wine by chance?

Wine recommends winbind, which has been known to break Samba shares for
some reason (bug 277327:
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/samba/+bug/277327)

If this does turn out to be the problem, you can remove the winbind
package and see if that fixes things.

Thanks,
Scott Ritchie

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Old 11-02-2008, 01:02 PM
Fabian Rodriguez
 
Default Inability to browse Windows shares.

Hi Mark,

It's refreshing to see an actual principal of a school taking the time
to even subscribe to a developer's mailing list. Thank you for taking
the time to share your frustration and concerns.

I suspect you will be highly disappointed of the answers you get here,
unless you become an active part of the solution to the bug from the
developers point of view. I also see several Canonical people subscribed
to the bug, so I know it is being taken seriously. This being "release
time", they may be busier than usual so that may also affect how this
bug is worked on by anyone involved.

If you wish to follow the community path to resolution of this issue,
I'd suggest:

- Subscribing your IT staff to the bug report

- Getting familiar with the Ubuntu release cycles and why some bugs
solutions don't show up before 6-12 months:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates

- Getting familiar with the relationship with "upstream" products and
how collaboration/resolution happens at those levels. Jono Bacon and
Jorge Castro wrote something about how we try to improve that relationship
http://www.jonobacon.org/?p=1302
http://stompbox.typepad.com/blog/2008/09/introducing-the.html

- Assign your IT staff time to provide a thorough, detailed list of
steps to reproduce the bug including details of your configuration.
Becoming part of bug reporting teams may greatly improve your handling
of future / current issues. I wrote something about that a few months ago:
http://www.fabianrodriguez.com/blog/2008/01/18/the-bug-reporting-culture-10-things-to-avoid-10-things-you-must-do/
or
http://ur1.ca/dnn

- Make sure your IT staff follows up with their contribution, if any
(don't "fire & forget")

If this sounds time consuming and involved, it is. Samba / Windows file
sharing problems often happen in environments that are complex to
reproduce and troubleshoot, I think we all understand that. Such moving
targets require much more resources than others.

Failing that, there are commercial support options to do the same at a
fraction of the cost, leading to know earlier if/when it can be fixed.
Unfortunately as soon as I enter that territory it becomes slippery as I
am a Canonical employee (at support!) and commercial services mean
spending money, always a touchy subject when Ubuntu is only known as a
community project, as opposed to the commercial product it also is. But
you're talking about an organization with business concerns, so I feel
the least you should do is know your options - even this late in your
problem. Other commercial providers would probably contact you directly
in other contexts and I am guessing you are open to that as the
principal at your school.

I hope this sheds some light and may help others approach this kind of
important issue in a helpful way - I don't pretend this post is the
final solution to all cases, but I'm very interested in the outcome,
whatever it may be and of course open to further discussion.

Cheers,

Fabian Rodriguez, Ubuntu Systems Senior Support Analyst
Canonical Global Support & Services
http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FabianRodriguez

Mark Ellse wrote:
> [...]
> This bug turns Ubuntu from a very useful operating system, which one
> can recommend to ones friends and colleagues, to something that is
> pretty much useless.
>
> I run a school. We have a number of Ubuntu workstations and LTSP
> servers on the staff networks. All this was set up since Ubuntu had
> for quite a while demonstrated its ability to browse Windows networks,
> and therefore be up to the task of deployment in a Windows network.
>
> When Hardy was first released, it worked as well. But some update
> prevented browing, and hence it has become useless.
>
> Since I, as principal of the school, have deployed Ubuntu, I look
> stupid and incompetent. I can tough that out. But had I been simply
> the IT manager, pushing for Ubuntu consideration, I'd have lost all
> future credibiltiy.
>
> What interests me is that when I email Jono about the bug, he doesn't
> know anything about it. So there are clearly a large number of people
> who are using, and talking about, Ubuntu without having to experience
> that important Ubuntu-Windows interface in which a large part of the
> world lives.
>
> Is there any development about this bug? Or are most of those who are
> involved in developing Ubuntu unaware of it, and its importance?
>
> And if there is anyone working on it, is there any anticipated
> timescale for solution?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Mark Ellse
>
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/207072
>
>


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Old 11-02-2008, 01:03 PM
Fabian Rodriguez
 
Default Inability to browse Windows shares.

Hi Mark,

It's refreshing to see an actual principal of a school taking the time
to even subscribe to a developer's mailing list. Thank you for taking
the time to share your frustration and concerns.

I suspect you will be highly disappointed of the answers you get here,
unless you become an active part of the solution to the bug from the
developers point of view. I also see several Canonical people subscribed
to the bug, so I know it is being taken seriously. This being "release
time", they may be busier than usual so that may also affect how this
bug is worked on by anyone involved.

If you wish to follow the community path to resolution of this issue,
I'd suggest:

- Subscribing your IT staff to the bug report

- Getting familiar with the Ubuntu release cycles and why some bugs
solutions don't show up before 6-12 months:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates

- Getting familiar with the relationship with "upstream" products and
how collaboration/resolution happens at those levels. Jono Bacon and
Jorge Castro wrote something about how we try to improve that relationship
http://www.jonobacon.org/?p=1302
http://stompbox.typepad.com/blog/2008/09/introducing-the.html

- Assign your IT staff time to provide a thorough, detailed list of
steps to reproduce the bug including details of your configuration.
Becoming part of bug reporting teams may greatly improve your handling
of future / current issues. I wrote something about that a few months ago:
http://www.fabianrodriguez.com/blog/2008/01/18/the-bug-reporting-culture-10-things-to-avoid-10-things-you-must-do/
or
http://ur1.ca/dnn

- Make sure your IT staff follows up with their contribution, if any
(don't "fire & forget")

If this sounds time consuming and involved, it is. Samba / Windows file
sharing problems often happen in environments that are complex to
reproduce and troubleshoot, I think we all understand that. Such moving
targets require much more resources than others.

Failing that, there are commercial support options to do the same at a
fraction of the cost, leading to know earlier if/when it can be fixed.
Unfortunately as soon as I enter that territory it becomes slippery as I
am a Canonical employee (at support!) and commercial services mean
spending money, always a touchy subject when Ubuntu is only known as a
community project, as opposed to the commercial product it also is. But
you're talking about an organization with business concerns, so I feel
the least you should do is know your options - even this late in your
problem. Other commercial providers would probably contact you directly
in other contexts and I am guessing you are open to that as the
principal at your school.

I hope this sheds some light and may help others approach this kind of
important issue in a helpful way - I don't pretend this post is the
final solution to all cases, but I'm very interested in the outcome,
whatever it may be and of course open to further discussion.

Cheers,

Fabian Rodriguez, Ubuntu Systems Senior Support Analyst
Canonical Global Support & Services
http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FabianRodriguez

Mark Ellse wrote:
> [...]
> This bug turns Ubuntu from a very useful operating system, which one
> can recommend to ones friends and colleagues, to something that is
> pretty much useless.
>
> I run a school. We have a number of Ubuntu workstations and LTSP
> servers on the staff networks. All this was set up since Ubuntu had
> for quite a while demonstrated its ability to browse Windows networks,
> and therefore be up to the task of deployment in a Windows network.
>
> When Hardy was first released, it worked as well. But some update
> prevented browing, and hence it has become useless.
>
> Since I, as principal of the school, have deployed Ubuntu, I look
> stupid and incompetent. I can tough that out. But had I been simply
> the IT manager, pushing for Ubuntu consideration, I'd have lost all
> future credibiltiy.
>
> What interests me is that when I email Jono about the bug, he doesn't
> know anything about it. So there are clearly a large number of people
> who are using, and talking about, Ubuntu without having to experience
> that important Ubuntu-Windows interface in which a large part of the
> world lives.
>
> Is there any development about this bug? Or are most of those who are
> involved in developing Ubuntu unaware of it, and its importance?
>
> And if there is anyone working on it, is there any anticipated
> timescale for solution?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Mark Ellse
>
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/207072
>
>



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Old 11-02-2008, 07:48 PM
Steve Langasek
 
Default Inability to browse Windows shares.

On Sun, Nov 02, 2008 at 01:01:50AM -0700, Scott Ritchie wrote:
> > https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/207072

> Have you installed Wine by chance?

> Wine recommends winbind, which has been known to break Samba shares for
> some reason (bug 277327:
> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/samba/+bug/277327)

> If this does turn out to be the problem, you can remove the winbind
> package and see if that fixes things.

He specifically pointed at bug #207072, a previously known and diagnosed bug
that's unrelated to winbind.

--
Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer http://www.debian.org/
slangasek@ubuntu.com vorlon@debian.org

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Old 11-03-2008, 10:27 AM
"Mark Ellse"
 
Default Inability to browse Windows shares.

Thanks for this. But Wine is not the culprit. Not installed.

Mark

2008/11/2 Scott Ritchie <scott@open-vote.org>

Mark Ellse wrote:

> Jono Bacon suggested I subscribe to this list to raise the profile of

> bug 207072. This bug is a Nautilus one. It prevents Nautilus (and

> therefore the normal Ubuntu user) from browsing Windows shares on an

> Ubuntu computer connected to a Windows network.

>

> This bug turns Ubuntu from a very useful operating system, *which one

> can recommend to ones friends and colleagues, to something that is

> pretty much useless.

>

> I run a school. We have a number of Ubuntu workstations and LTSP servers

> on the staff networks. All this was set up since Ubuntu had for quite a

> while demonstrated its ability to browse Windows networks, and therefore

> be up to the task of deployment in a Windows network.

>

> When Hardy was first released, it worked as well. But some update

> prevented browing, and hence it has become useless.

>

> Since I, as principal of the school, have deployed Ubuntu, I look stupid

> and incompetent. I can tough that out. But had I been simply the IT

> manager, pushing for Ubuntu consideration, I'd have lost all future

> credibiltiy.

>

> What interests me is that when I email Jono about the bug, he doesn't

> know anything about it. So there are clearly a large number of people

> who are using, and talking about, Ubuntu without having to experience

> that important Ubuntu-Windows interface in which a large part of the

> world lives.

>

> Is there any development about this bug? Or are most of those who are

> involved in developing Ubuntu unaware of it, and its importance?

>

> And if there is anyone working on it, is there any anticipated timescale

> for solution?

>

> Cheers,

>

> Mark Ellse

>

> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/207072

>

>



Have you installed Wine by chance?



Wine recommends winbind, which has been known to break Samba shares for

some reason (bug 277327:

https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/samba/+bug/277327)



If this does turn out to be the problem, you can remove the winbind

package and see if that fixes things.



Thanks,

Scott Ritchie



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Old 11-10-2008, 01:54 PM
Steve Langasek
 
Default Inability to browse Windows shares.

Hi Mark,

On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 07:20:06PM +0000, Mark Ellse wrote:
> Jono Bacon suggested I subscribe to this list to raise the profile of bug
> 207072. This bug is a Nautilus one. It prevents Nautilus (and therefore the
> normal Ubuntu user) from browsing Windows shares on an Ubuntu computer
> connected to a Windows network.

Yes, this is a very unfortunate bug that we have found little traction on to
date. Despite my own best efforts I was unable to come up with a patch that
fixes this issue without causing regressions for other use cases, probably
due to a failure to understand how the gvfs APIs in GNOME are meant to work.

I'm happy to see the profile of this bug raised, but I'm not at all
optimistic about the prospects of finding a solution without help from
upstream.

Fortunately it looks like there may be some progress in the upstream bug
report, so that a solution might be possible for the next Ubuntu 8.04 point
release.

> When Hardy was first released, it worked as well. But some update prevented
> browing, and hence it has become useless.

It's possible you're seeing a different bug, then, as bug #207072 has been
present since the hardy release and affects any attempts at browsing Windows
networks from the GNOME desktop when using Active Directory authentication.

> What interests me is that when I email Jono about the bug, he doesn't know
> anything about it. So there are clearly a large number of people who are
> using, and talking about, Ubuntu without having to experience that important
> Ubuntu-Windows interface in which a large part of the world lives.

Since this bug is specifically about connections within Active Directory
realms, it indeed appears to be the case that many of our users are
unaffected, including many who use Windows servers in a standalone
configuration or as part of an NT4 domain. I know that's little
consolation, but I hope it sheds some light on how the problem managed to be
overlooked upstream.

--
Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer http://www.debian.org/
slangasek@ubuntu.com vorlon@debian.org

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