FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
» Video Reviews

» Linux Archive

Linux-archive is a website aiming to archive linux email lists and to make them easily accessible for linux users/developers.


» Sponsor

» Partners

» Sponsor

Go Back   Linux Archive > Ubuntu > Ubuntu Desktop

 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
 
Old 03-26-2010, 01:44 AM
Krzysztof Klimonda
 
Default Review of featured applications

On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 02:16 +0000, Arand Nash wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 18:04 +1100, Robert Ancell wrote:
>
> > I also wanted to pick one FPS but they all seemed difficult to use.
> > The problems seemed to be similar:
> > * Huge downloads
> > * Opening and choosing first menu (e.g. "single player") often
> > didn't work, there were no bots
> > * Very slow load times
> > (...)
>
We can't have both appealing 3D games and fast load times in my opinion
so the problem isn't really a problem but a trade-off.

> I've tested both openarena and nexuiz.
What about Warsow? I've found it the most compelling from all three
games. It has a nice graphics and some nice concepts. I'm not sure if it
has bots though.

> And the only issue there is the indeed huge downloads (oa ~300MB nx ~900MB)
Well, all games that have decent 3d graphic are going to take quite a
lot of space. It shouldn't be a problem in my opinion. (Warsow is ~256MB
btw).

> They are in my opinion very straigtforward, 2-3 clicks and you're in a
> singleplayer game with fully functional bots.
> Both games also has a singleplayer "campaign" in the form of consecutive
> unlockable skirmish-levels.
>
> However, what might speak against them is the ~18 rating that any of
> these games would have if sold in stores, due to their violent and
> meatpieces-flying-gory nature.
Did Quake 3 get the ~18 rating somewhere? I think it's 15+ everywhere
and I think the gore level there was similar.

> > I installed Saurbraten and the ground didn't render.
>
> Sauerbraten has a very unfinished touch yes, which probably makes it
> unsuitable for featuring. But I have ran it countless times without
> seeing that issue.
>
>
> For simple shoot-em-ups there is several games by Kenta Cho (nice search
> term for USC) that might be worth a look, many are still dependent on 3D
> drivers like chromium-bsu, but in my experience they seem vaguely
> playable without them, whereas chromium-bsu just turns into sirup.
>
> I've added tumiki-fighters to the wiki, and I would propose this as a
> replacement for chromium-bsu, since it seems to run very well on my
> no-3D nouveau drivers.
> One potential problem with these games is that they use the somewhat
> unorthodox z-key as the fire-key, also, the homepage describes them as
> "games for windows", but those are minor things I guess.
>
>
> When it comes to Wine, if it is going to be mentioned on the installer
> slideshow:
> https://code.launchpad.net/~lielft/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/games-slide/+merge/15545
>
> does it not then make sense to have it in the featured section?
> (I did even make a comment on the merge about the possibly overly
> optimistic tone taken when describing Wine there...)
I think promoting wine as a way of running games is a mistake if we
don't say that it supports only a handful of them, often a lot of
tweaking is required and it doesn't work well with all available 3d
cards. Already there are a lot of people who are complaining that Wine
doesn't support they favorite game X - if we promote it further the
amount of complaints and disappointment is only going to increase.

> - Arand
>
>

--
Krzysztof Klimonda <kklimonda@syntaxhighlighted.com>

PS Most FPS games shine only when users play them online - what if the
newer version of the game that is incompatible with our version is
released? 3 years is a lot of time to keep game that users can't play
with friends anymore. I know it's not really a point of this post but
it's something we should think about.
--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 01:52 AM
Arand Nash
 
Default Review of featured applications

Robert Ancell wrote:
> On 26/03/10 13:16, Arand Nash wrote:
>> On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 18:04 +1100, Robert Ancell wrote:
>>
>>> I also wanted to pick one FPS but they all seemed difficult to use.
>>> The problems seemed to be similar:
>>> * Huge downloads
>>> * Opening and choosing first menu (e.g. "single player") often
>>> didn't work, there were no bots
>>> * Very slow load times
>>> (...)
>>
>> I've tested both openarena and nexuiz.
>> And the only issue there is the indeed huge downloads (oa ~300MB nx
>> ~900MB)
>> They are in my opinion very straigtforward, 2-3 clicks and you're in a
>> singleplayer game with fully functional bots.
>> Both games also has a singleplayer "campaign" in the form of consecutive
>> unlockable skirmish-levels.
> Interesting. Did you install them through the software center? Did you
> install any additional packages?

Nope, this was straight out of the USC

>>
>> However, what might speak against them is the ~18 rating that any of
>> these games would have if sold in stores, due to their violent and
>> meatpieces-flying-gory nature.
> I'd agree.
>>
>>> I installed Saurbraten and the ground didn't render.
>>
>> Sauerbraten has a very unfinished touch yes, which probably makes it
>> unsuitable for featuring. But I have ran it countless times without
>> seeing that issue.
>>
> It's probably a driver issue but I have a fairly standard Dell Studio
> laptop with an ATI card so I wouldn't expect any major issues. (I have
> been running alpha software so it may work for me in Lucid final).

I'm on a Dell with nvidia here (xps1530 & 8600gt), so the discrepancy
might be there. Yours would presumably be a fairly common setup so
presumably good grounds for rejection though.

> (...)


- Arand

--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 01:55 AM
Shane Fagan
 
Default Review of featured applications

> I've tested both openarena and nexuiz.
Nexuiz is dying upstream from what I hear so I wouldnt feature it
myself. The development team had a big split recently and a lot of the
developers are making forks of it. So id say Open Arena would be a lot
more suitable long term.

Id love to get a rating system (like 18+ for games with gore or
shooting) for games I think that would be a good work item for lucid+1.
It would be cool if we could list the game content too like how they do
it on commercial games so like here
http://www.esrb.org/ratings/ratings_guide.jsp
Just a thought

Shane Fagan


--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 01:55 AM
Robert Ancell
 
Default Review of featured applications

I've opened a bug to request the following changes:

- Remove Eclipse
- Huge download
- Only supports Java out of the box
- The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting
- Replace chromium-bsu with tumiki-fighters
- chromium has poor performance on non-3D accelerated hardware
- Add tuxpaint
- We don't currently have any applications for children
- Very well established project
- Those whose children use it describe it as a killer app

https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/548534

On 26/03/10 13:52, Arand Nash wrote:
> Robert Ancell wrote:
>
>> On 26/03/10 13:16, Arand Nash wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 2010-03-01 at 18:04 +1100, Robert Ancell wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> I also wanted to pick one FPS but they all seemed difficult to use.
>>>> The problems seemed to be similar:
>>>> * Huge downloads
>>>> * Opening and choosing first menu (e.g. "single player") often
>>>> didn't work, there were no bots
>>>> * Very slow load times
>>>> (...)
>>>>
>>> I've tested both openarena and nexuiz.
>>> And the only issue there is the indeed huge downloads (oa ~300MB nx
>>> ~900MB)
>>> They are in my opinion very straigtforward, 2-3 clicks and you're in a
>>> singleplayer game with fully functional bots.
>>> Both games also has a singleplayer "campaign" in the form of consecutive
>>> unlockable skirmish-levels.
>>>
>> Interesting. Did you install them through the software center? Did you
>> install any additional packages?
>>
> Nope, this was straight out of the USC
>
>
>>> However, what might speak against them is the ~18 rating that any of
>>> these games would have if sold in stores, due to their violent and
>>> meatpieces-flying-gory nature.
>>>
>> I'd agree.
>>
>>>
>>>> I installed Saurbraten and the ground didn't render.
>>>>
>>> Sauerbraten has a very unfinished touch yes, which probably makes it
>>> unsuitable for featuring. But I have ran it countless times without
>>> seeing that issue.
>>>
>>>
>> It's probably a driver issue but I have a fairly standard Dell Studio
>> laptop with an ATI card so I wouldn't expect any major issues. (I have
>> been running alpha software so it may work for me in Lucid final).
>>
> I'm on a Dell with nvidia here (xps1530& 8600gt), so the discrepancy
> might be there. Yours would presumably be a fairly common setup so
> presumably good grounds for rejection though.
>
>
>> (...)
>>
>
> - Arand
>


--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 02:05 AM
Shane Fagan
 
Default Review of featured applications

> - Remove Eclipse
> - Huge download
> - Only supports Java out of the box
> - The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting
Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with
Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,vala....etc although require
the user to install the support for each language.

-Fagan


--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 02:18 AM
Rick Spencer
 
Default Review of featured applications

Shane, good thought, but I don't think any developer tools are
interesting for featured applications. The Featured section is not
geared to a developer user, so I think we should just pull out Eclipse
and leave it at that.

Cheers, Rick

On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 03:05 +0000, Shane Fagan wrote:
> > - Remove Eclipse
> > - Huge download
> > - Only supports Java out of the box
> > - The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting
> Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with
> Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,vala....etc although require
> the user to install the support for each language.
>
> -Fagan
>
>



--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 02:22 AM
Robert Ancell
 
Default Review of featured applications

On 26/03/10 14:05, Shane Fagan wrote:
>> - Remove Eclipse
>> - Huge download
>> - Only supports Java out of the box
>> - The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting
>>
> Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with
> Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,vala....etc although require
> the user to install the support for each language.
>
My review of all the supplied IDEs showed MonoDevelop to appear to be
the easiest to use, but:
- I've never used an IDE for any significant period of time
- I didn't use any of the proposed IDEs to do more that write a hello
world program.

We need to consider what sort of user clicks on featured applications
and which users would benefit from the suggested IDE.
My experience of IDE users is:
- They're generally passionate users who have a preferred IDE (much
like text editors for non-IDE programmers). So by suggesting an IDE
we're targeting people who haven't already chosen an IDE.
- IDEs tend be a part of a developer package. If we suggest
MonoDevelop will users link well to documentation and the developer
community? Or will it just be a fancy text editor/compiler?

Saying it in a simpler way:
- Will an IDE encourage people to learn programming?
- Will opportunistic developers be able to use it to complete their
desired project?
- Will experienced developers find the suggested IDE helpful or will
they already use their existing IDE/do the research themselves?


--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 02:25 AM
Shane Fagan
 
Default Review of featured applications

Makes sense Rick, I agree with that. Hmmm maybe for lucid+1 we might be
able to detect if they have installed development tools before and
suggest some in featured applications.

-Fagan

On Thu, 2010-03-25 at 20:18 -0700, Rick Spencer wrote:
> Shane, good thought, but I don't think any developer tools are
> interesting for featured applications. The Featured section is not
> geared to a developer user, so I think we should just pull out Eclipse
> and leave it at that.
>
> Cheers, Rick
>
> On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 03:05 +0000, Shane Fagan wrote:
> > > - Remove Eclipse
> > > - Huge download
> > > - Only supports Java out of the box
> > > - The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting
> > Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with
> > Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,vala....etc although require
> > the user to install the support for each language.
> >
> > -Fagan
> >
> >
>
>



--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 02:27 AM
Arand Nash
 
Default Review of featured applications

On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 2:44 AM, Krzysztof Klimonda
<kklimonda@syntaxhighlighted.com> wrote:
>
> On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 02:16 +0000, Arand Nash wrote:
> > I've tested both openarena and nexuiz.
> What about Warsow? I've found it the most compelling from all three
> games. It has a nice graphics and some nice concepts. I'm not sure if it
> has bots though.
>

Tested Warsow just now, and it does indeed have boots, however in the
starting screen of "local game" you will have to put in the number of
bots in the settings yourself.
Also, the single-player is mainly Skirmish (pick a level, pick some
bots), so I would assume not as straightforward as that of OA or NX.
It has a very nice audio/demo tutorial though.

>
> > However, what might speak against them is the ~18 rating that any of
> > these games would have if sold in stores, due to their violent and
> > meatpieces-flying-gory nature.
> Did Quake 3 get the ~18 rating somewhere? I think it's 15+ everywhere
> and I think the gore level there was similar.
>

Well, seems like Quake3 got an M for ESBR at least (and ELSPA: 15+, OFLC: MA15+)
I don't know, and today the threshold is probably higher, but until we
get a good age-rating system into USC it might be really muddy waters.
Isn't age rating and all that law-enforced in some way even?

On 26/03/10 14:05, Shane Fagan wrote:
> Nexuiz is dying upstream from what I hear so I wouldnt feature it
> myself. The development team had a big split recently and a lot of the
> developers are making forks of it. So id say Open Arena would be a lot
> more suitable long term.

At least the name and the main developer seems to be heading towards
some company deal, fork is at http://www.xonotic.org/ but I agree that
it seems to be in a quite a lot of turmoil at the moment, so possibly
not the best choice current.

- Arand

--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 
Old 03-26-2010, 02:32 AM
Shane Fagan
 
Default Review of featured applications

On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 14:22 +1100, Robert Ancell wrote:
> On 26/03/10 14:05, Shane Fagan wrote:
> >> - Remove Eclipse
> >> - Huge download
> >> - Only supports Java out of the box
> >> - The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting
> >>
> > Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with
> > Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,vala....etc although require
> > the user to install the support for each language.
> >
> My review of all the supplied IDEs showed MonoDevelop to appear to be
> the easiest to use, but:
> - I've never used an IDE for any significant period of time
> - I didn't use any of the proposed IDEs to do more that write a hello
> world program.
>
> We need to consider what sort of user clicks on featured applications
> and which users would benefit from the suggested IDE.
> My experience of IDE users is:
> - They're generally passionate users who have a preferred IDE (much
> like text editors for non-IDE programmers). So by suggesting an IDE
> we're targeting people who haven't already chosen an IDE.
> - IDEs tend be a part of a developer package. If we suggest
> MonoDevelop will users link well to documentation and the developer
> community? Or will it just be a fancy text editor/compiler?
>
> Saying it in a simpler way:
> - Will an IDE encourage people to learn programming?
> - Will opportunistic developers be able to use it to complete their
> desired project?
> - Will experienced developers find the suggested IDE helpful or will
> they already use their existing IDE/do the research themselves?
>
>
Well no it wouldnt encourage people to learn programming.
Hmmm I dont think there is any good python IDE for the opportunistic
developer.
I dont think many experienced developers use IDEs too much. The ones I
know in development companies use eclipse (or different flavors of
eclipse) or text editors. I use netbeans in college but for python I use
gedit.

-Fagan


--
ubuntu-desktop mailing list
ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
 

Thread Tools




All times are GMT. The time now is 07:30 AM.

VBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO ©2007, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright 2007 - 2008, www.linux-archive.org