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Old 07-13-2011, 05:58 PM
Rick Stevens
 
Default Getting into RedHat (yet another subject change)

On 07/13/2011 10:33 AM, Nikhil Sinha wrote:
> I am trying to get into Redhat, to work with, in fact to start with. Is this wrong place to post?

Ok, we have issues here, which is precisely why you do NOT reply to a
message digest. I mistook your reply to the digest as an errant reply
to another thread regarding one person's attempt to remove a driver from
their kernel. Ok, that's on my head.

You were trying to start a new thread that had nothing to do with the
digest. To start a new thread, you must write a NEW message with an
appropriate subject line and send it to

redhat-install-list@redhat.com

You should NOT have replied to an existing message or thread. That
breaks the threading nature of messages. New messages start threads
(a thread being a series of messages related to a specific subject),
replies add to existing threads. This is true for any mailing list and
not just this one. Hope that's clear.

Now as to is this the right place? The purpose of this list is
primarily to help people get RedHat and its derivatives (such as
CentOS) installed and working on their machines properly. It's not
really meant to be a general Linux beginner's "How do I do this?"
thing. There are probably better lists for that.

We can try to help when we can, but remember that the vast majority of
contributors to this list (and, in fact, most of RedHat's lists) are
NOT RedHat employees. We're end users, system administrators and
general volunteers who got help this way and are "paying it forward."

----------------------------------------------------------------------
- Rick Stevens, Systems Engineer, C2 Hosting ricks@nerd.com -
- AIM/Skype: therps2 ICQ: 22643734 Yahoo: origrps2 -
- -
- If at first you don't succeed, quit. No sense being a damned fool! -
----------------------------------------------------------------------

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Old 07-13-2011, 09:11 PM
Cameron Simpson
 
Default Getting into RedHat (yet another subject change)

On 13Jul2011 10:58, Rick Stevens <ricks@nerd.com> wrote:
| On 07/13/2011 10:33 AM, Nikhil Sinha wrote:
| > I am trying to get into Redhat, to work with, in fact to start with. Is this wrong place to post?
|
| Ok, we have issues here, which is precisely why you do NOT reply to a
| message digest. I mistook your reply to the digest as an errant reply
| to another thread regarding one person's attempt to remove a driver from
| their kernel. Ok, that's on my head.
|
| You were trying to start a new thread that had nothing to do with the
| digest. To start a new thread, you must write a NEW message with an
| appropriate subject line and send it to
|
| redhat-install-list@redhat.com
|
| You should NOT have replied to an existing message or thread. That
| breaks the threading nature of messages. New messages start threads
| (a thread being a series of messages related to a specific subject),
| replies add to existing threads. This is true for any mailing list and
| not just this one. Hope that's clear.

Also, replies to message digests almost always have a totally useless
subject line.

| Now as to is this the right place? The purpose of this list is
| primarily to help people get RedHat and its derivatives (such as
| CentOS) installed and working on their machines properly. It's not
| really meant to be a general Linux beginner's "How do I do this?"
| thing. There are probably better lists for that.

But it is a sutiable place for beginnger install questions. The list
even has the title "Getting started with Red Hat Linux".

However, Vikas' post wasn't about installs. It was a resume post seeking
a job. It really is off topic. Perhaps this can be attributed to
avgueness in the "getting started" term. For this list it is to do with
getting started installing and running RedHat linux, not getting started
in a careers or job.

Cheers,
--
Cameron Simpson <cs@zip.com.au> DoD#743
http://www.cskk.ezoshosting.com/cs/

Wagner's music is better than it sounds. - Mark Twain

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Old 07-14-2011, 03:08 AM
"Nikhil Sinha"
 
Default Getting into RedHat (yet another subject change)

Ok.

Nikhil.
------Original Message------
From: Cameron Simpson
To: Getting started with Red Hat Linux
Cc: Nikhil Sinha
Subject: Re: Getting into RedHat (yet another subject change)
Sent: 14 Jul 2011 02:41

On 13Jul2011 10:58, Rick Stevens <ricks@nerd.com> wrote:
| On 07/13/2011 10:33 AM, Nikhil Sinha wrote:
| > I am trying to get into Redhat, to work with, in fact to start with. Is this wrong place to post?
|
| Ok, we have issues here, which is precisely why you do NOT reply to a
| message digest. I mistook your reply to the digest as an errant reply
| to another thread regarding one person's attempt to remove a driver from
| their kernel. Ok, that's on my head.
|
| You were trying to start a new thread that had nothing to do with the
| digest. To start a new thread, you must write a NEW message with an
| appropriate subject line and send it to
|
| redhat-install-list@redhat.com
|
| You should NOT have replied to an existing message or thread. That
| breaks the threading nature of messages. New messages start threads
| (a thread being a series of messages related to a specific subject),
| replies add to existing threads. This is true for any mailing list and
| not just this one. Hope that's clear.

Also, replies to message digests almost always have a totally useless
subject line.

| Now as to is this the right place? The purpose of this list is
| primarily to help people get RedHat and its derivatives (such as
| CentOS) installed and working on their machines properly. It's not
| really meant to be a general Linux beginner's "How do I do this?"
| thing. There are probably better lists for that.

But it is a sutiable place for beginnger install questions. The list
even has the title "Getting started with Red Hat Linux".

However, Vikas' post wasn't about installs. It was a resume post seeking
a job. It really is off topic. Perhaps this can be attributed to
avgueness in the "getting started" term. For this list it is to do with
getting started installing and running RedHat linux, not getting started
in a careers or job.

Cheers,
--
Cameron Simpson <cs@zip.com.au> DoD#743
http://www.cskk.ezoshosting.com/cs/

Wagner's music is better than it sounds. - Mark Twain


Sent on my BlackBerry® from Vodafone

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Most Ubuntu and Debian packages, are indeed silent by default. However, the
fact that RPM's own post-install capabilities are atrocious compared to
dpkg's is completely the fault of the RPM developers and maintainers, and
has a lot to do with distro policies, in particular Fedora. It is something
that I am unhappy about, but I am resigned to having to deal with the
trade-off of a better-designed system being purposefully not as powerful for
distro philosophy reasons. And no, I will not attempt to submit patches to
add more powerful post-install capabilities. Even if I had the technical
knowledge to do it, it would never be accepted because the devs wouldn't
want that feature.

Calling it a misfeature is a mistake. Just because you don't want to use it
doesn't mean it shouldn't be there. There are several use-cases where it is
optimal to have some sort of post-install. In my opinion, post-install is
the one thing that dpkg is better at over rpm.

On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Evandro Giovanini <efgiovanini@gmail.com>wrote:

> On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 2:04 PM, Richard W.M. Jones <rjones@redhat.com>
> wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 10:57:03AM +0200, Olivier Sallou wrote:
> >> I create a new package.
> >> At install, we need to ask for some quesitons to the user to
> >> preconfigure the application.
> >
> > As others have said, this is a bad idea and not permitted for Fedora.
> > Personally I think it's a misfeature of apt/dpkg that updates are not
> > completely automated by default.
> >
> > Nevertheless, it *is* possible to write an RPM which asks questions
> > during the %post script, and in fact I have used RPMs which did this
> > in the past (a bit of proprietary software where installation required
> > a license key to be entered on the keyboard as part of the EULA).
> >
> >
>
> AFAIK it's also possible to setup apt/dpkg to be completely automated.
>
> Evandro
> --
> devel mailing list
> devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
>

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Most Ubuntu and Debian packages, are indeed silent by default. However, the fact that RPM's own post-install capabilities are atrocious compared to dpkg's is completely the fault of the RPM developers and maintainers, and has a lot to do with distro policies, in particular Fedora. It is something that I am unhappy about, but I am resigned to having to deal with the trade-off of a better-designed system being purposefully not as powerful for distro philosophy reasons. And no, I will not attempt to submit patches to add more powerful post-install capabilities. Even if I had the technical knowledge to do it, it would never be accepted because the devs wouldn't want that feature.<div>
<br></div><div>Calling it a misfeature is a mistake. Just because you don't want to use it doesn't mean it shouldn't be there. There are several use-cases where it is optimal to have some sort of post-install. In my opinion, post-install is the one thing that dpkg is better at over rpm.<br>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Evandro Giovanini <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:efgiovanini@gmail.com">efgiovanini@gm ail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div class="im">On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 2:04 PM, Richard W.M. Jones &lt;<a href="mailto:rjones@redhat.com">rjones@redhat.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 10:57:03AM +0200, Olivier Sallou wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; I create a new package.<br>
&gt;&gt; At install, we need to ask for some quesitons to the user to<br>
&gt;&gt; preconfigure the application.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; As others have said, this is a bad idea and not permitted for Fedora.<br>
&gt; Personally I think it's a misfeature of apt/dpkg that updates are not<br>
&gt; completely automated by default.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Nevertheless, it *is* possible to write an RPM which asks questions<br>
&gt; during the %post script, and in fact I have used RPMs which did this<br>
&gt; in the past (a bit of proprietary software where installation required<br>
&gt; a license key to be entered on the keyboard as part of the EULA).<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
<br>
</div>AFAIK it's also possible to setup apt/dpkg to be completely automated.<br>
<font color="#888888"><br>
Evandro<br>
</font><div><div></div><div class="h5">--<br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>

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