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-   -   Rosetta after 31 July 2008 (http://www.linux-archive.org/launchpad-user/116198-rosetta-after-31-july-2008-a.html)

Adi Roiban 06-30-2008 02:14 PM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
Hi,

What would happen to translation for which they author does not access
the license update page?

For the Romanian team there are about 100 contributiors, some of them
are upstream, but many of them are no longer active in the translation
team.

Most probably they will not access their launchpad account in the next
months and thus they will not update their translation license.

Should I, as the Romanian translation team coordinator, contact them and
ask them to update their license?

Many thanks!

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Adi Roiban


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Jeroen Vermeulen 06-30-2008 03:24 PM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
Adi Roiban wrote:

> What would happen to translation for which they author does not access
> the license update page?

They stay around. The existing terms of use already allowed making them
available to other projects under different licenses. We're asking
people about this because we feel it's the right thing to do, but we
don't see any actual conflict between the old terms and the new ones.


> For the Romanian team there are about 100 contributiors, some of them
> are upstream, but many of them are no longer active in the translation
> team.
>
> Most probably they will not access their launchpad account in the next
> months and thus they will not update their translation license.
>
> Should I, as the Romanian translation team coordinator, contact them and
> ask them to update their license?

For people who don't look at any translations for that long, it's
probably not worth it. As far as we can see they would not be affected
in any practical way.


Jeroen

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Barry Warsaw 06-30-2008 03:48 PM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
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On Jun 30, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Jeroen Vermeulen wrote:

> Adi Roiban wrote:
>
>> What would happen to translation for which they author does not
>> access
>> the license update page?
>
> They stay around. The existing terms of use already allowed making
> them
> available to other projects under different licenses. We're asking
> people about this because we feel it's the right thing to do, but we
> don't see any actual conflict between the old terms and the new ones.

The requirement to BSD license translations effectively means that GNU
Mailman cannot use Launchpad for translations. We're currently
evaluating Pootle and I'd like to have a fair bake-off with LP
Translations, but I think it's practically impossible for us to de-GPL-
ify our existing translations.

- -Barry

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"Christopher Armstrong" 06-30-2008 03:52 PM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 11:48 AM, Barry Warsaw <barry@canonical.com> wrote:
> On Jun 30, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Jeroen Vermeulen wrote:
>
>> Adi Roiban wrote:
>>
>>> What would happen to translation for which they author does not
>>> access
>>> the license update page?
>>
>> They stay around. The existing terms of use already allowed making
>> them
>> available to other projects under different licenses. We're asking
>> people about this because we feel it's the right thing to do, but we
>> don't see any actual conflict between the old terms and the new ones.
>
> The requirement to BSD license translations effectively means that GNU
> Mailman cannot use Launchpad for translations. We're currently
> evaluating Pootle and I'd like to have a fair bake-off with LP
> Translations, but I think it's practically impossible for us to de-GPL-
> ify our existing translations.

Hi Barry,

Accepting BSD translations doesn't require you to change your existing
translations to a different license. In fact, you can GPL the
translations that you receive under the BSD license. That's one of the
major reasons to use BSD: it's lax enough that it shouldn't really
prevent _anyone_ from using it in whatever way they want, as long as
they include the notice.

--
Christopher Armstrong
International Man of Twistery
http://radix.twistedmatrix.com/
http://twistedmatrix.com/
http://canonical.com/

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Barry Warsaw 06-30-2008 04:15 PM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
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On Jun 30, 2008, at 11:52 AM, Christopher Armstrong wrote:

> Accepting BSD translations doesn't require you to change your existing
> translations to a different license. In fact, you can GPL the
> translations that you receive under the BSD license. That's one of the
> major reasons to use BSD: it's lax enough that it shouldn't really
> prevent _anyone_ from using it in whatever way they want, as long as
> they include the notice.

Hi Chris,

Thanks for the follow up. I think the problem is that because my
current translations are all GPL and FSF assigned, I can't upload them
to LP and still be in compliance with LP's requirements.

So if I wanted to use LP for Mailman translations, I'd have to start
from scratch.

- -Barry

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"Francis J. Lacoste" 06-30-2008 05:13 PM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
On June 30, 2008, Barry Warsaw wrote:
> On Jun 30, 2008, at 11:52 AM, Christopher Armstrong wrote:
> > Accepting BSD translations doesn't require you to change your existing
> > translations to a different license. In fact, you can GPL the
> > translations that you receive under the BSD license. That's one of the
> > major reasons to use BSD: it's lax enough that it shouldn't really
> > prevent _anyone_ from using it in whatever way they want, as long as
> > they include the notice.
>
> Hi Chris,
>
> Thanks for the follow up. I think the problem is that because my
> current translations are all GPL and FSF assigned, I can't upload them
> to LP and still be in compliance with LP's requirements.
>
> So if I wanted to use LP for Mailman translations, I'd have to start
> from scratch.
>

Someone from the Translations team should confirm, but I think that when you
import them as coming from 'upstream', they won't be offered as 'suggestions'
to other project. In other words, only translations entered by Launchpad
users through the web interface are considered as your contributions and thus
licensed as BSD.




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Francis J. Lacoste
francis.lacoste@canonical.com
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Jeroen Vermeulen 07-03-2008 08:37 AM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
Barry Warsaw wrote:
> On Jun 30, 2008, at 11:52 AM, Christopher Armstrong wrote:
>
>> Accepting BSD translations doesn't require you to change your existing
>> translations to a different license. In fact, you can GPL the
>> translations that you receive under the BSD license. That's one of the
>> major reasons to use BSD: it's lax enough that it shouldn't really
>> prevent _anyone_ from using it in whatever way they want, as long as
>> they include the notice.

> Thanks for the follow up. I think the problem is that because my
> current translations are all GPL and FSF assigned, I can't upload them
> to LP and still be in compliance with LP's requirements.
>
> So if I wanted to use LP for Mailman translations, I'd have to start
> from scratch.

Not necessarily from scratch. The existing GPL'ed translations are
effectively "published" ones. Which means they stay licensed as they
are. If you re-import them as published uploads, further changes in
Launchpad can be "overlaid" as BSD-licensed additions on top of those.

You'd have to mix licenses, with the additions covered by both GPL and
BSD, but is that a problem?


Jeroen

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Barry Warsaw 07-03-2008 12:13 PM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
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On Jul 3, 2008, at 4:37 AM, Jeroen Vermeulen wrote:

> Barry Warsaw wrote:
>> On Jun 30, 2008, at 11:52 AM, Christopher Armstrong wrote:
>>> Accepting BSD translations doesn't require you to change your
>>> existing
>>> translations to a different license. In fact, you can GPL the
>>> translations that you receive under the BSD license. That's one of
>>> the
>>> major reasons to use BSD: it's lax enough that it shouldn't really
>>> prevent _anyone_ from using it in whatever way they want, as long as
>>> they include the notice.
>
>> Thanks for the follow up. I think the problem is that because my
>> current translations are all GPL and FSF assigned, I can't upload
>> them to LP and still be in compliance with LP's requirements.
>> So if I wanted to use LP for Mailman translations, I'd have to
>> start from scratch.
>
> Not necessarily from scratch. The existing GPL'ed translations are
> effectively "published" ones. Which means they stay licensed as
> they are. If you re-import them as published uploads, further
> changes in Launchpad can be "overlaid" as BSD-licensed additions on
> top of those.
>
> You'd have to mix licenses, with the additions covered by both GPL
> and BSD, but is that a problem?

I don't know. Has anybody contacted the FSF about this? If not, I
have contacts there and could see what their opinion is of the current
arrangement.

- -Barry

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07-04-2008 03:33 PM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
Hi Barry,

Yesterday at 14:13, Barry Warsaw wrote:

>> You'd have to mix licenses, with the additions covered by both GPL
>> and BSD, but is that a problem?
>
> I don't know. Has anybody contacted the FSF about this? If not, I
> have contacts there and could see what their opinion is of the current
> arrangement.

FSF is pretty clear on the topic:

http://www.fsf.org/licensing/licenses/gpl-faq.html#WhatDoesCompatMean
http://www.fsf.org/licensing/licenses/gpl-faq.html#OrigBSD (implicit, but I believe still of value: we are using the revised BSD license)

FWIW, we also had a lot of discussion about translation licensing in
Launchpad with Benjamin Mako Hill months ago, who is now at FSF.


Cheers,
Danilo

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"Andi Albrecht" 07-05-2008 05:01 AM

Rosetta after 31 July 2008
 
On Jul 3, 2008, at 4:37 AM, Jeroen Vermeulen wrote:
> Not necessarily from scratch. The existing GPL'ed translations are
> effectively "published" ones. Which means they stay licensed as
> they are. If you re-import them as published uploads, further
> changes in Launchpad can be "overlaid" as BSD-licensed additions on
> top of those.
>
> You'd have to mix licenses, with the additions covered by both GPL
> and BSD, but is that a problem?

After reading the discussions about the license issue on this list,
I'm pretty unsure about the consequences. I have no problems with the
BSD license, but at least I want to have all translations licensed the
same as the project itself.

Let's assume the following:

I've uploaded a template and a german translation to Launchpad, both
GPL'ed. Someone adds for example a spanish translation and someone
else changes one or two strings in my german translation. Does this
mean that I come up with a GPL'ed template, a BSD licensed spanish
translation and a GPL'ed german translation with one or two strings
licensed under BSD?

-Andi

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