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Old 11-27-2007, 01:06 PM
Derek Broughton
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

Jonathan Jesse wrote:

> I am getting frustrated with using Konqueror as my default browser. I
> don't know if I just have some problems, or its the fact that I am running
> 64-bit Kubuntu, but it is getting to the point that browsing the web is
> just easier, and more fun in Internet Explorer.
>
> I know that Google and GMail don't always play nice with Konqueror and
> have lived to accept it,

But you _don't_ have to accept it. Just click on the odd icon that, to my
eyes at least, looks like a toad facing away from you (it's also in the
Tools menu, "Change Browser Identification") and tell it to identify as the
latest version of either Firefox or IE. For google and gmail, either
works.

> but it is other sites that I am getting sick of
> trying to deal with.

> Is it just that I need to switch to Firefox on my Kubuntu install? Or
> should I stick to browsing the web in my XP VM, cause things "just work"
> there.

That's life. The price you pay to use Konqueror is that it is
standards-compliant. I'm not sure I agree with not breaking the agreed
standards to conform to the de-facto standard, but that's the choice the
developers have made. I have never come across a site that doesn't work in
konqueror that still passes the W3C checks (though I expect there are
_some_).

If that's a huge problem for you - and it seems like it is - use Firefox.
It's a better browser than IE, and will work on virtually all the same
sites.
--
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Old 11-27-2007, 01:06 PM
Derek Broughton
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

Jonathan Jesse wrote:

> I am getting frustrated with using Konqueror as my default browser. I
> don't know if I just have some problems, or its the fact that I am running
> 64-bit Kubuntu, but it is getting to the point that browsing the web is
> just easier, and more fun in Internet Explorer.
>
> I know that Google and GMail don't always play nice with Konqueror and
> have lived to accept it,

But you _don't_ have to accept it. Just click on the odd icon that, to my
eyes at least, looks like a toad facing away from you (it's also in the
Tools menu, "Change Browser Identification") and tell it to identify as the
latest version of either Firefox or IE. For google and gmail, either
works.

> but it is other sites that I am getting sick of
> trying to deal with.

> Is it just that I need to switch to Firefox on my Kubuntu install? Or
> should I stick to browsing the web in my XP VM, cause things "just work"
> there.

That's life. The price you pay to use Konqueror is that it is
standards-compliant. I'm not sure I agree with not breaking the agreed
standards to conform to the de-facto standard, but that's the choice the
developers have made. I have never come across a site that doesn't work in
konqueror that still passes the W3C checks (though I expect there are
_some_).

If that's a huge problem for you - and it seems like it is - use Firefox.
It's a better browser than IE, and will work on virtually all the same
sites.
--
derek


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Old 11-27-2007, 01:22 PM
"Phil Pinkerton"
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

I have always used FireFox.. it has been enough for what I need, but
then again my needs are basic and simple.

Just my .02345 cents

On Nov 26, 2007 9:52 PM, Jonathan Jesse <jjesse@iserv.net> wrote:
> Good evening,
>
> I know I probablly shouldn't be posting this to both lists, but I couldn't
> figure out which one would be better to post to.
>
> I am getting frustrated with using Konqueror as my default browser. I
> don't know if I just have some problems, or its the fact that I am running
> 64-bit Kubuntu, but it is getting to the point that browsing the web is
> just easier, and more fun in Internet Explorer.
>
> I know that Google and GMail don't always play nice with Konqueror and
> have lived to accept it, but it is other sites that I am getting sick of
> trying to deal with.
> I can to a page, an example being Facebook, and not get all of the images
> or all of the links to work. I go to a travel site to book airplane
> tickets and get to use the "basic" settings, I go to a page and am told
> flash is not installed when I do have the non-free version of flash
> installed or even better I click on a link and nothing happens until I
> click on the link 3 or 4 times and finally the "gear" starts spinning and
> I get the page I want. Another fun problem is when I increase the font
> size the text blurs together and I can't read it.... or go to a page that
> has a form and the text runs into the form so I don't really know what I'm
> filling out.
>
> Is it just that I need to switch to Firefox on my Kubuntu install? Or
> should I stick to browsing the web in my XP VM, cause things "just work"
> there.
>
>
> --
> Jonathan Jesse
>
>
>
> --
> kubuntu-users mailing list
> kubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
> Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/kubuntu-users
>



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physical concept lies exclusively in its clear an unambiguous relation
to the facts it can be experienced" AE

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Old 11-27-2007, 02:11 PM
Derek Broughton
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

Serg B wrote:

> Realistically, if you are using Konqueror as your primary web browser
> you may as well go with IE7,

There's no logic in that statement.

> at least you will be able to get
> something done. I personally suggest ditching Konqueror as a web
> browser and going with FireFox instead. Konqueror in my opinion is a
> great all-round file manager utility, but it certainly has a long way
> to go to compete with any modern day browsers.

Konqueror never _will_ compete with modern browsers, because it starts from
the basis that pages have to comply with standards.
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Old 11-27-2007, 03:00 PM
"Dotan Cohen"
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

On 27/11/2007, Jonathan Jesse <jjesse@iserv.net> wrote:
> Good evening,
>
> I know I probablly shouldn't be posting this to both lists, but I couldn't
> figure out which one would be better to post to.
>
> I am getting frustrated with using Konqueror as my default browser. I
> don't know if I just have some problems, or its the fact that I am running
> 64-bit Kubuntu, but it is getting to the point that browsing the web is
> just easier, and more fun in Internet Explorer.
>
> I know that Google and GMail don't always play nice with Konqueror and
> have lived to accept it, but it is other sites that I am getting sick of
> trying to deal with.
> I can to a page, an example being Facebook, and not get all of the images
> or all of the links to work. I go to a travel site to book airplane
> tickets and get to use the "basic" settings, I go to a page and am told
> flash is not installed when I do have the non-free version of flash
> installed or even better I click on a link and nothing happens until I
> click on the link 3 or 4 times and finally the "gear" starts spinning and
> I get the page I want. Another fun problem is when I increase the font
> size the text blurs together and I can't read it.... or go to a page that
> has a form and the text runs into the form so I don't really know what I'm
> filling out.
>
> Is it just that I need to switch to Firefox on my Kubuntu install? Or
> should I stick to browsing the web in my XP VM, cause things "just work"
> there.

What websites do not work properly in Konqueror? If you list specific
websites and specific problems, I personally will confirm the problems
and write to the webmasters. Konqueror is more standards-compliant
that either Firefox or IE, and websites that do not display properly
are obviously poorly coded. A common reason for this is that the sites
code to display properly according to Internet Explorer's bugs. This
is a flawed approach for many reasons, one of which is that IE's flaws
change from version to version.

That said, I myself browse in Firefox.

Dotan Cohen

http://what-is-what.com
http://gibberish.co.il
א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-*-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
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Old 11-27-2007, 03:02 PM
"Dotan Cohen"
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

On 27/11/2007, Anton Rolls <anton@wilddsl.net.au> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Jonathan Jesse wrote:
> > Good evening,
> >
> > I know I probablly shouldn't be posting this to both lists, but I couldn't
> > figure out which one would be better to post to.
> >
> > I am getting frustrated with using Konqueror as my default browser. I
> > don't know if I just have some problems, or its the fact that I am running
> > 64-bit Kubuntu, but it is getting to the point that browsing the web is
> > just easier, and more fun in Internet Explorer.
> >
> > I know that Google and GMail don't always play nice with Konqueror and
> > have lived to accept it, but it is other sites that I am getting sick of
> > trying to deal with.
> > I can to a page, an example being Facebook, and not get all of the images
> > or all of the links to work. I go to a travel site to book airplane
> > tickets and get to use the "basic" settings, I go to a page and am told
> > flash is not installed when I do have the non-free version of flash
> > installed or even better I click on a link and nothing happens until I
> > click on the link 3 or 4 times and finally the "gear" starts spinning and
> > I get the page I want. Another fun problem is when I increase the font
> > size the text blurs together and I can't read it.... or go to a page that
> > has a form and the text runs into the form so I don't really know what I'm
> > filling out.
> >
> > Is it just that I need to switch to Firefox on my Kubuntu install? Or
> > should I stick to browsing the web in my XP VM, cause things "just work"
> > there.
>
> Konqueror, when operating as a web-browser, is simple and
> underpowered compared to Firefox etc..
>
> It sounds like the solution for you might be to
> install the win32 version of Firefox and install the
> flash plugin.
> Here's how I did it:
>
> 1) I got the latest version of Wine.
> Quite recently I went to the Wine website for the
> latest version, and I noticed it's a newer version
> than the one in Adept. I looked at the change history
> between the versions and saw all just bug fixes.
> So I installed the newer version.
> (I think I added the Wine website to my package sources
> list and then used Adept...?)
>
> 2) I got the Win32 version of Mozilla Firefox.
> I browsed to the Firefox download page in Konqueror and configured
> Konqueror Browser Identification to be Internet Explorer on
> Windows so that the Mozilla website diplays the Windows version
> to download.
>
> 3) Then I ran the Firefox setup executable in the console:
>
> wine "Firefox Setup 2.0.0.9.exe"
>
> You should now have a Firefox icon to click. (I chose to
> make one myself.)
>
> Hope that helps,
>
> Anton.

You run the windows version of Fx in wine? You are aware that you can
run 32 bit Firefox on a 64 bit system, no?

Dotan Cohen

http://what-is-what.com
http://gibberish.co.il
א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-*-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
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Old 11-27-2007, 04:39 PM
Daniel Anderson
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

Paul Lemmons wrote:
>
> Anton Rolls wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> It sounds like the solution for you might be to
>> install the win32 version of Firefox and install the
>> flash plugin.
>> Here's how I did it:
>>
>> 1) I got the latest version of Wine.
>> <snip>
>>
> Ummm... there is a linux version of the flash plug in that works
> flawlessly... save the wine for special occasions...
>
ies4linux will install ie6 under wine, if that's any help. Works well here.
Dan

--
Using Linux since 1998.
(: (: (: (: (: (: (:

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Old 11-27-2007, 05:24 PM
Sylviane et Perry White
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

On Tuesday 27 November 2007 17:00, Dotan Cohen wrote:
> What websites do not work properly in Konqueror? If you list specific
> websites and specific problems, I personally will confirm the problems
> and write to the webmasters.
Great.

I followed that thread with interest, usually use Konk, but switcht to firefox
if I need.
Perhaps I will implement the strategie suggested by Derek "Change Browser
Identification" [tells you how whicked some corporations are !] (it is not
the first time I read about that).


If you're "Feeling like a 2nd class citizen", want to know how a First class
citizen feel? (sorry, couldn't help it)
read on:
************************************************** **********************************
Words of G.W. Bush at a Town Hall session in Orlando, Florida, on the 4th
december 2001

Question:
How did you *feel* when you heard about the terrorist attack?

Answer:
*Well*...(long pause, applauses from audience)
Thank you Jordan, You are not gonna belive *what state I was in* when I heard
about the terrorist attack. *I was in Florida.*

(taken from
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6529813972926262623
************************************************** *********************************




--
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Old 11-27-2007, 05:43 PM
"Dotan Cohen"
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

On 27/11/2007, Sylviane et Perry White <spwhite@freesurf.ch> wrote:
> On Tuesday 27 November 2007 17:00, Dotan Cohen wrote:
> > What websites do not work properly in Konqueror? If you list specific
> > websites and specific problems, I personally will confirm the problems
> > and write to the webmasters.
> Great.
>
> I followed that thread with interest, usually use Konk, but switcht to firefox
> if I need.
> Perhaps I will implement the strategie suggested by Derek "Change Browser
> Identification" [tells you how whicked some corporations are !] (it is not
> the first time I read about that).

Why not adapt a parallel strategy and write to those responsible for
the websites in question? I have found that most websites, large and
small, are in fact willing to make the necessary changes once enough
people ask them to.

Dotan Cohen

http://what-is-what.com
http://gibberish.co.il
א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-*-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
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Old 11-27-2007, 07:14 PM
"Jos Poortvliet"
 
Default Feeling like a 2nd class citizen

On Nov 27, 2007 3:06 PM, Derek Broughton <news@pointerstop.ca> wrote:
> Jonathan Jesse wrote:
>
> > I am getting frustrated with using Konqueror as my default browser. I
> > don't know if I just have some problems, or its the fact that I am running
> > 64-bit Kubuntu, but it is getting to the point that browsing the web is
> > just easier, and more fun in Internet Explorer.
> >
> > I know that Google and GMail don't always play nice with Konqueror and
> > have lived to accept it,
>
> But you _don't_ have to accept it. Just click on the odd icon that, to my
> eyes at least, looks like a toad facing away from you (it's also in the
> Tools menu, "Change Browser Identification") and tell it to identify as the
> latest version of either Firefox or IE. For google and gmail, either
> works.
>
> > but it is other sites that I am getting sick of
> > trying to deal with.
>
> > Is it just that I need to switch to Firefox on my Kubuntu install? Or
> > should I stick to browsing the web in my XP VM, cause things "just work"
> > there.
>
> That's life. The price you pay to use Konqueror is that it is
> standards-compliant. I'm not sure I agree with not breaking the agreed
> standards to conform to the de-facto standard, but that's the choice the
> developers have made. I have never come across a site that doesn't work in
> konqueror that still passes the W3C checks (though I expect there are
> _some_).
>
> If that's a huge problem for you - and it seems like it is - use Firefox.
> It's a better browser than IE, and will work on virtually all the same
> sites.

I'd like to note that the above is just barely true. Firefox has a
slightly better UI than IE 7, but is much slower. If it were FOSS, I might
even use IE 7 instead of FF now and then...

The horrible interface FF has is for me reason to use Konqi. I just
miss too much functionality in FF, and I'm not going to fix that by
installing all kinds of weird and unstable extensions. If I would be
happy fixing my software by installing *other* software, I would still
be using Windows 98 (with a million little tools to make it bearable).

> --
> derek
>
>
>
> --

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