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Old 12-19-2008, 02:03 PM
Art Alexion
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

On Tuesday 16 December 2008 7:34:02 am Art Alexion wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 16, 2008 at 2:24 AM, Eberhard Roloff <tuxebi@gmx.de> wrote:
> > Eberhard Roloff wrote:
> >> definitely. Since I am on ext3, ntfs problems are a thing of the past.
> >>
> >>> I was thinking I'd create a really small fat32 partion and put the ext3
> >>> driver for windows there so that I could install it if I ever need it
> >>> on a windows system.
> >>
> >> smart idea. Thanks much!
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > it just came to my mind.
> >
> > You most probhably need to have Administrator Privileges to install the
> > Ext3 filesystem driver on windows.
> >
> > That means, that you cannot expect this to work with any windows machine
> > that you see out there.
> >
> > However, 95% of windows machines where the user routinely works as an
> > administrator, might be ok for a start. ;-))
>
> Good point, Eberhard. I expect I will be able to gain administrator
> privileges when I need to as it will usually involve a machine I am
> troubleshooting or repairing.
>
> By the way, it happened again after a reboot with the drive plugged in.
>
> Plugged it into gnome laptop and it mounted fine. This is the same
> version of k/ubuntu. And it it isn't the individual machine. At home
> I have a kubuntu 8.04 desktop and a laptop with ubuntu (gnome) 8.04.
> Automounts on the laptop, and won't even create an unmounted device on
> the desktop. At work, it is the same thing. Ignored by kubuntu 8.04
> desktop, and automounts on Ubuntu 8.10 desktop and winxp desktop.
>
> Why is kubuntu or kde having a problem with this drive that other
> systems do not have?

OK. The problem seems to be with Kubuntu KDE 3.5.10, and not 4.1. The drive
mounts fine on Kubuntu 8.10. The problem exists on three Kubuntu KDE 3.5.10
machines, while everything works fine on a KDE 4.1 machine and an Ubuntu 8.10
Gnome machine and an 8.04 Gnome machine. It also work in WinXP. The only
Kubuntu 8.10 machine I tested it on is 64-bit, if that makes a difference.

Thinking it was a problem with ntfs-3g or something, I reformatted the drive
as ext3. It made absolutely no difference.

I want to report this as a bug, but have no idea what package to report
against. Any ideas?

This is a real PITA because the purpose of the drive depends on it working
with XP and Kubuntu 8.04. I have my music on my production Kubuntu computer
and my iTouch file system is only detected by iTunes 8 (which doesn't run
under wine or crossover).
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Old 12-19-2008, 03:31 PM
Billie Walsh
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

Art Alexion wrote:
> Ok, The problem seems to be with Kubuntu KDE 3.5.10, and not 4.1. The drive mounts fine on Kubuntu 8.10. The problem exists on three Kubuntu KDE 3.5.10
> machines, while everything works fine on a KDE 4.1 machine and an Ubuntu 8.10
> Gnome machine and an 8.04 Gnome machine. It also work in WinXP. The only
> Kubuntu 8.10 machine I tested it on is 64-bit, if that makes a difference.
>
> Thinking it was a problem with ntfs-3g or something, I reformatted the drive
> as ext3. It made absolutely no difference.
>
> I want to report this as a bug, but have no idea what package to report
> against. Any ideas?
>

Considering it only appears in KDE 3.5.10 I would assume that you would
have to post it to KDE 3.5.10. BUT, don't expect it to get fixed. It is
just possible that someone could decide to fix it, but for all practical
intents and purposes KDE 3.x is not being "fixed" any longer.

> This is a real PITA because the purpose of the drive depends on it working
> with XP and Kubuntu 8.04. I have my music on my production Kubuntu computer
> and my iTouch file system is only detected by iTunes 8 (which doesn't run
> under wine or crossover).
>

I don't play with external drives and such all that much, but on both my
8.04/3.5.10 machines [ one 64 and one 32 ] I don't have the problem.
Whenever I plug one in it works just fine.

I seem to recall that HAL is what sees and mounts new drives etc. that
are plugged in [ could be - and probably am - wrong about this ]. Could
it be that somehow HAL got broken. Does it only happen with this one drive?

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Old 12-19-2008, 03:59 PM
Art Alexion
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

On Friday 19 December 2008 11:31:10 am Billie Walsh wrote:
> I don't play with external drives and such all that much, but on both my
> 8.04/3.5.10 machines [ one 64 and one 32 ] I don't have the problem.
> Whenever I plug one in it works just fine.

Same with other drives and usb sticks.


>
> I seem to recall that HAL is what sees and mounts new drives etc. that
> are plugged in [ could be - and probably am - wrong about this ].

I thought the same, but wouldn't hal-Ubuntu 8.04 be the same as hal-Kubuntu
8.04?


> Could
> it be that somehow HAL got broken.

Unlikely broken the same on two different machines, unless some other Kubuntu
8.04-only update broke it.


> Does it only happen with this one drive?

This is a 2.5" IDE hard drive from a laptop, in a usb enclosure. The
particular enclosure does not have its own power supply, but gets power from
the USB port. The other magnetic drives that do work fine are 3.5" from
desktops with separately powered enclosures. Would that make a difference?
I don't know.

I just know that I don't want to upgrade my kubuntu on this machine until at
least 4.2, while I have finally found something that KDE 4.1 seems to do
better than 3.5.


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Old 12-19-2008, 06:32 PM
Billie Walsh
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

Art Alexion wrote:
> On Friday 19 December 2008 11:31:10 am Billie Walsh wrote:
>
>> I don't play with external drives and such all that much, but on both my
>> 8.04/3.5.10 machines [ one 64 and one 32 ] I don't have the problem.
>> Whenever I plug one in it works just fine.
>>
>
> Same with other drives and usb sticks.
>
>
>
>> I seem to recall that HAL is what sees and mounts new drives etc. that
>> are plugged in [ could be - and probably am - wrong about this ].
>>
>
> I thought the same, but wouldn't hal-Ubuntu 8.04 be the same as hal-Kubuntu
> 8.04?
>
>
>
>> Could
>> it be that somehow HAL got broken.
>>
>
> Unlikely broken the same on two different machines, unless some other Kubuntu
> 8.04-only update broke it.
>

You would have to ask someone _MUCH_ smarter than me. About all I know
about it that I was using OpenSuSE with KDE 3.x and somehow HAL got
broken and wouldn't do S___. That's what made me wonder if that might be
a problem.

>
>
>> Does it only happen with this one drive?
>>
>
> This is a 2.5" IDE hard drive from a laptop, in a usb enclosure. The
> particular enclosure does not have its own power supply, but gets power from
> the USB port. The other magnetic drives that do work fine are 3.5" from
> desktops with separately powered enclosures. Would that make a difference?
> I don't know.
>
> I just know that I don't want to upgrade my kubuntu on this machine until at
> least 4.2, while I have finally found something that KDE 4.1 seems to do
> better than 3.5.
>
>
>

If some drives work fine I would think HAL must be working.

My only suggestion would be to figure out a way to externally power the
drive and see if that made a difference. Maybe a five volt wall wart and
a home made USB connector. If I remember correctly the data uses the two
center connections and the power is on the two outer connections [ I
think I found that information on Wikipedia ]. I don't know if Rat Shack
[ Radio Shack for the uninitiated ] has USB connectors for experimental
use but that might be a choice if they do. Otherwise carefully remove
the outer covering from an old USB cable and figure out the wiring and
splice in a power connection after you cut the leads to the computer end.

Come to think of it, something like that might come in handy for other
uses also. May have to build one just for fun.

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Old 12-19-2008, 07:02 PM
James Tappin
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 13:32:35 -0600
Billie Walsh <bilwalsh@swbell.net> wrote:

BW> My only suggestion would be to figure out a way to externally power
BW> the drive and see if that made a difference. Maybe a five volt wall
BW> wart and a home made USB connector. If I remember correctly the
BW> data uses the two center connections and the power is on the two
BW> outer connections [ I think I found that information on Wikipedia
BW> ]. I don't know if Rat Shack [ Radio Shack for the uninitiated ]
BW> has USB connectors for experimental use but that might be a choice
BW> if they do. Otherwise carefully remove the outer covering from an
BW> old USB cable and figure out the wiring and splice in a power
BW> connection after you cut the leads to the computer end.

I'm not quite sure about this, but if my memory servers me, some mp3
players actually have a mains adaptor that plugs into the mini-usb
socket. If that's right then you would only need a mini-USB -> full-size
adaptor. [Might be worth checking Newegg (US), Dabs (UK) or equivalent].

--
+------------------------+-------------------------------+---------+
| James Tappin | School of Physics & Astronomy | O__ |
| sjt@star.sr.bham.ac.uk | University of Birmingham | -- /` |
| Ph: 0121-414-6462. Fax: 0121-414-3722 | |
+--------------------------------------------------------+---------+

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Old 12-19-2008, 07:17 PM
Art Alexion
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

On Friday 19 December 2008 2:32:35 pm Billie Walsh wrote:
> About all I know
> about it that I was using OpenSuSE with KDE 3.x and somehow HAL got
> broken and wouldn't do S___. That's what made me wonder if that might be
> a problem.

I think the problem IS hal related. That's my quandary. I would think that
hal/Ubuntu 8.04 would be the same as hal/Kubuntu 8.04. Maybe gnome-vfs picks
up where hal fails. I don't know.... (sigh)


>
> > *
> >
> >> Does it only happen with this one drive?
> >> * *
> >
> > This is a 2.5" IDE hard drive from a laptop, in a usb enclosure. *The
> > particular enclosure does not have its own power supply, but gets power
> > from the USB port. *The other magnetic drives that do work fine are 3.5"
> > from desktops with separately powered enclosures. *Would that make a
> > difference? I don't know.
> >
> > I just know that I don't want to upgrade my kubuntu on this machine until
> > at least 4.2, while I have finally found something that KDE 4.1 seems to
> > do better than 3.5.
> >
> >
> > *
>
> If some drives work fine I would think HAL must be working.

Not necessarily, it may be working well enough to connect to some drives, but
not all.


>
> My only suggestion would be to figure out a way to externally power the
> drive and see if that made a difference. Maybe a five volt wall wart and
> a home made USB connector. If I remember correctly the data uses the two
> center connections and the power is on the two outer connections [ I
> think I found that information on Wikipedia ]. I don't know if Rat Shack
> [ Radio Shack for the uninitiated ] has USB connectors for experimental
> use but that might be a choice if they do. Otherwise carefully remove
> the outer covering from an old USB cable and figure out the wiring and
> splice in a power connection after you cut the leads to the computer end.
>
> Come to think of it, something like that might come in handy for other
> uses also. May have to build one just for fun.

First what I like about this is portability. It is about the size of a silver
cigarette case, with only the usb cable as a dongle. If I am going with
power and all, I can use a 500 GB 3.5" that works fine on Kubuntu KDE 3.5.

That may be where I am until KDE 4 works well enough to rely on.

My other choice is getting iTunes to connect to my iTouch while running in a
VM. That, or sell my iTouch and get a standard iPod that works with Amarok.

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Old 12-28-2008, 08:43 PM
Valter Mura
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

Il venerd́ 19 dicembre 2008 16:03:19 Art Alexion ha scritto:
> OK. The problem seems to be with Kubuntu KDE 3.5.10, and not 4.1. The
> drive mounts fine on Kubuntu 8.10. The problem exists on three Kubuntu KDE
> 3.5.10 machines, while everything works fine on a KDE 4.1 machine and an
> Ubuntu 8.10 Gnome machine and an 8.04 Gnome machine. It also work in
> WinXP. The only Kubuntu 8.10 machine I tested it on is 64-bit, if that
> makes a difference.

I can confirm this issue: the same external usb drive that I couldn't open with
Kubuntu 8.04/KDE 3.5.x, now opens perfectly in Kubuntu 8.10/KDE 4.1.3

Model: Packard Bell Store & Save 320 GB / USB connection
>
> Thinking it was a problem with ntfs-3g or something, I reformatted the
> drive as ext3. It made absolutely no difference.
>
> I want to report this as a bug, but have no idea what package to report
> against. Any ideas?

Well, I think you have to indicate the model of the ext drive and the system
you were using, comparing it with the actual system, perhaps it's a kernel
problem (?)

--
Valter
Registered Linux User #466410 http://counter.li.org
Kubuntu Linux: www.ubuntu.com
Usa OpenOffice.org: www.openoffice.org
"Coltiva Linux, tanto Windows si pianta da solo"

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Old 12-29-2008, 06:58 AM
Art Alexion
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

On Sunday 28 December 2008 16:43:25 Valter Mura wrote:
> Il venerd́ 19 dicembre 2008 16:03:19 Art Alexion ha scritto:
> > OK. *The problem seems to be with Kubuntu KDE 3.5.10, and not 4.1. *The
> > drive mounts fine on Kubuntu 8.10. *The problem exists on three Kubuntu
> > KDE 3.5.10 machines, while everything works fine on a KDE 4.1 machine and
> > an Ubuntu 8.10 Gnome machine and an 8.04 Gnome machine. *It also work in
> > WinXP. *The only Kubuntu 8.10 machine I tested it on is 64-bit, if that
> > makes a difference.
>
> I can confirm this issue: the same external usb drive that I couldn't open
> with Kubuntu 8.04/KDE 3.5.x, now opens perfectly in Kubuntu 8.10/KDE 4.1.3
>
> Model: Packard Bell Store & Save 320 GB / USB connection

Is that a USB powered drive or does it have its own power supply?


>
> > Thinking it was a problem with ntfs-3g or something, I reformatted the
> > drive as ext3. *It made absolutely no difference.
> >
> > I want to report this as a bug, but have no idea what package to report
> > against. *Any ideas?
>
> Well, I think you have to indicate the model of the ext drive and the
> system you were using, comparing it with the actual system, perhaps it's a
> kernel problem (?)

That would be a problem because it is a drive I took out of an otherwise
broken laptop and a generic 2.5" enclosure.

I can't imagine it would be a kernel problem because Kubuntu and Ubuntu share
the same kernel and it mounts fine in Ubuntu.




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Old 12-29-2008, 03:15 PM
Valter Mura
 
Default Problems with NTFS external USB drive in Kubuntu (update)

Il luned́ 29 dicembre 2008 08:58:19 Art Alexion ha scritto:
> >
> > I can confirm this issue: the same external usb drive that I couldn't
> > open with Kubuntu 8.04/KDE 3.5.x, now opens perfectly in Kubuntu 8.10/KDE
> > 4.1.3
> >
> > Model: Packard Bell Store & Save 320 GB / USB connection
>
> Is that a USB powered drive or does it have its own power supply?

It has its own power supply.

> > > I want to report this as a bug, but have no idea what package to report
> > > against. *Any ideas?
> >
> > Well, I think you have to indicate the model of the ext drive and the
> > system you were using, comparing it with the actual system, perhaps it's
> > a kernel problem (?)
>
> That would be a problem because it is a drive I took out of an otherwise
> broken laptop and a generic 2.5" enclosure.
>
> I can't imagine it would be a kernel problem because Kubuntu and Ubuntu
> share the same kernel and it mounts fine in Ubuntu.

Well, you're right. But I think you should open the issue, there will be an
expert who will ask to you more info concerning the problem.

--
Valter
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