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Old 11-09-2010, 02:06 PM
Jonathan Riddell
 
Default debugging and conf file location

Anyone remember why we have QT_NO_DEBUG set but we still get debug
output (some turned on by default)?

As a separate issue, maybe we should move our config files to
/usr/share/config/

Jonathan


13:01 < dfaure> Riddell: do you disable debug output by default in
kubuntu? You could add a
/usr/share/kubuntu-default-settings/kde4-profile/default/share/config/kdebugrc
with
DisableAll=true
13:03 < dfaure> Riddell: I added this (in 4.4 maybe) so that debug
output is not removed at compile time anymore, but can be enabled on
request
13:08 < dfaure> he thinks it should be off by default and developers
should turn it on in kdebugdialog. But to me this is wrong, it's
"providing api that doesn't work" and leaving
developers confused.
13:09 < dfaure> my idea is that distros should turn it off, but this
way a self-compiled kdelibs trunk would still default to on.
13:09 < Riddell> dfaure: but your suggestion to me is to do just that
n'est pas? DisableAll=true is off by default and developers can turn
it on
13:09 < dfaure> Well .... not on kubuntu
13:10 < dfaure> Riddell: if you provide a /usr/share/config/kdebugrc,
then a self-compiled kdelibs in $HOME/kde would still default to on.
13:11 < Riddell> dfaure: maybe we should just move to using
/usr/share/config/, I wonder if adding
/usr/share/kubuntu-default-settings adds to startup times anyway
13:12 < dfaure> Chani: yes but Riddell is right, the problem is
"packaged kdelibs with self-compiled app on top" ....
13:12 < dfaure> Riddell: I would very much like that, yes. It's really
odd when a "clean upstream self-compiled konqueror" stlil shows the
kubuntu customizations because of that
kubuntu-default-settings stuff...

13:23 < dfaure> Riddell: QT_NO_DEBUG should make the debug output
disabled by default (but still compiled in)

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Old 11-10-2010, 04:17 PM
Harald Sitter
 
Default debugging and conf file location

On Tuesday 09 November 2010 15:06:17 Jonathan Riddell wrote:
> Anyone remember why we have QT_NO_DEBUG set but we still get debug
> output (some turned on by default)?

Where do we have QT_NO_DEBUG?

> As a separate issue, maybe we should move our config files to
> /usr/share/config/

How does /usr/share/config play into any of this?
Maybe you mean /usr/share/config/kde4? In that case there would be a problem
since that is where some apps have their default configs...

> 13:01 < dfaure> Riddell: do you disable debug output by default in
> kubuntu? You could add a
> /usr/share/kubuntu-default-settings/kde4-profile/default/share/config/kdebug
> rc with
> DisableAll=true

I totally agree with this.

--
Harald Sitter
Kubuntu Core Developer
http://www.kubuntu.org--
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Old 11-10-2010, 04:22 PM
Jonathan Riddell
 
Default debugging and conf file location

On Wed, Nov 10, 2010 at 06:17:17PM +0100, Harald Sitter wrote:
> On Tuesday 09 November 2010 15:06:17 Jonathan Riddell wrote:
> > Anyone remember why we have QT_NO_DEBUG set but we still get debug
> > output (some turned on by default)?
>
> Where do we have QT_NO_DEBUG?

08_add_debian_build_type.diff in kde4libs (and every build log)

> > As a separate issue, maybe we should move our config files to
> > /usr/share/config/
>
> How does /usr/share/config play into any of this?
> Maybe you mean /usr/share/config/kde4? In that case there would be a problem
> since that is where some apps have their default configs...

Maybe I ment /usr/share/kde4/config

Yes that's an issue.

> > 13:01 < dfaure> Riddell: do you disable debug output by default in
> > kubuntu? You could add a
> > /usr/share/kubuntu-default-settings/kde4-profile/default/share/config/kdebug
> > rc with
> > DisableAll=true
>
> I totally agree with this.

Jonathan

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Old 11-10-2010, 05:19 PM
Harald Sitter
 
Default debugging and conf file location

On Wednesday 10 November 2010 17:22:31 Jonathan Riddell wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 10, 2010 at 06:17:17PM +0100, Harald Sitter wrote:
> > On Tuesday 09 November 2010 15:06:17 Jonathan Riddell wrote:
> > > Anyone remember why we have QT_NO_DEBUG set but we still get debug
> > > output (some turned on by default)?
> >
> > Where do we have QT_NO_DEBUG?
>
> 08_add_debian_build_type.diff in kde4libs (and every build log)

Oh. Well. That will only affect kDebug(), on my system the most useless
messages come from Qt though (size/position warnings in plasma, ibus ...).
Hence I think we should also define it at Qt level. Combined with kdebugrc this
should get rid of every debug message by default.

> > > As a separate issue, maybe we should move our config files to
> > > /usr/share/config/
> >
> > How does /usr/share/config play into any of this?
> > Maybe you mean /usr/share/config/kde4? In that case there would be a
> > problem since that is where some apps have their default configs...
>
> Maybe I ment /usr/share/kde4/config
>
> Yes that's an issue.

Let's approach the problems from another angle.
I think the main concerns here are:
- setting kds in /etc/kde4rc affects also custom (developer) builds of KDE
- possibility of increased startup time

...The first one we could probably resolve by patching kds into the search path
of our KDE, rather than doing it via the config.

...The second one I still would like to see actual data on, what the config
cascading does is only adding additional path lookups for every config. I do
however believe that this is neglectable overhead, I think we are looking in
more paths for libraries than for configs for instance.

What is expensive about this is the actual cascading (i.e. the merging of
multiple configs (worst case: user-kdeglobals>etc-kdeglobals>kds-
kdeglobals>kd[n/m]s-kdeglobals). We cannot do much about this. user and etc
are given, kds is a necessary evil to not patch around wildely. However, the
additional cascading of netbook/mobile settings could be improved.

I mentioned this briefly when Rodrigo and I were talking about speed at UDS,
however I do not think I elaborated this.

The general idea is to introduce install-time-cascading. Since each of netbook
and mobile overrides settings in kds, you could merge kds with the given
specific type, into say kubuntu-default-settings-merged, at the time the
specific package gets installed. In startkde, then instead of exporting both
the specific path *and* kds, they would only export the merged path, hence
removing one level of the cascade.

Although. Thinking about it... One maybe could use the same approach to get
kds into /usr/share/kde4/config...

If we got our packages to install files to /usr/share/kde4/config-raw, then
trigger a script upon changes in that directory as well as
/usr/share/kde4/config-kubuntu, the trigger can then merge them into
/usr/share/kde4/config.

See [1] for some info on dpkg triggers. They are for example used to keep the
GTK icon cache updated (e.g. see hicolor)

Opinions?

[1] http://www.seanius.net/blog/2009/09/dpkg-triggers-howto/

--
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Kubuntu Core Developer
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