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Florian Philipp 05-23-2008 04:21 PM

High Definition and OSS
 
Hi list!

I'm thinking about buying a BlueRay- and HD-DVD-combo reader.
Can I use GNU/Linux standard software (mplayer preferred) to watch
HD-movies or does its copy protection stop me from using it? If so, are
there any workarounds?

Thanks in advance!

Florian Philipp

"James" 05-23-2008 08:12 PM

High Definition and OSS
 
> Hi list!
>
> I'm thinking about buying a BlueRay- and HD-DVD-combo reader.
> Can I use GNU/Linux standard software (mplayer preferred) to watch
> HD-movies or does its copy protection stop me from using it? If so, are
> there any workarounds?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Florian Philipp
>
I think you have to run software to decrypt the DVD on the fly and then
have mplayer read the stream.
The decryption keys to older bluray titles are available but newer ones
might need to be decrypted (rip the movie to your harddrive).
It is definitely not easy right now but a lot of titles are being cracked
everyday.
I would avoid bluray until it gets easier to play.

Why would you buy an HD-DVD reader?
That format is dead and there won't be any new titles.


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Florian Philipp 05-24-2008 09:03 AM

High Definition and OSS
 
On Fri, 23 May 2008 16:12:16 -0400 (EDT)
"James" <bjlockie@lockie.ca> wrote:

> > Hi list!
> >
> > I'm thinking about buying a BlueRay- and HD-DVD-combo reader.
> > Can I use GNU/Linux standard software (mplayer preferred) to watch
> > HD-movies or does its copy protection stop me from using it? If so,
> > are there any workarounds?
> >
> > Thanks in advance!
> >
> > Florian Philipp
> >
> I think you have to run software to decrypt the DVD on the fly and
> then have mplayer read the stream.
> The decryption keys to older bluray titles are available but newer
> ones might need to be decrypted (rip the movie to your harddrive).
> It is definitely not easy right now but a lot of titles are being
> cracked everyday.
> I would avoid bluray until it gets easier to play.

Hmm, on which features depends the encryption? Would a Windows Media
Player in Wine be able to play it or do I need an operating system
supporting it, maybe in a virtual machine? Has anyone tried?

>
> Why would you buy an HD-DVD reader?
> That format is dead and there won't be any new titles.
>

It's meant for my dad. He's a big Star Trek fan and afaik the new
remastered Star Trek Original Series is HD-DVD-only. The price
difference isn't that big, either.

Stroller 05-24-2008 04:15 PM

High Definition and OSS
 
On 24 May 2008, at 10:03, Florian Philipp wrote:

...
I would avoid bluray until it gets easier to play.


Hmm, on which features depends the encryption? Would a Windows Media
Player in Wine be able to play it or do I need an operating system
supporting it, maybe in a virtual machine? Has anyone tried?


Neither of these methods would work at all.

Read up on the Protected Video Path (PVP) at:
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?
command=printArticleBasic&articleId=9005047


Basically you won't be able to use a "legitimate" player under Linux.
You either rip it, use a DeCSS equivalent, or not at all.



Why would you buy an HD-DVD reader?
That format is dead and there won't be any new titles.


It's meant for my dad. He's a big Star Trek fan and afaik the new
remastered Star Trek Original Series is HD-DVD-only.


It'll probably be available on BluRay soon enough, although HD-DVD
might be a cheap way to buy it. But don't plan on being able to use
those disks on set-top hi-def players in 5 years time.



The price
difference isn't that big, either.


For the drive, no. It's probably worth paying for that extra feature.

Stroller.


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Florian Philipp 05-24-2008 05:37 PM

High Definition and OSS
 
On Sat, 24 May 2008 17:15:34 +0100
Stroller <stroller@stellar.eclipse.co.uk> wrote:

>
> On 24 May 2008, at 10:03, Florian Philipp wrote:
> >> ...
> >> I would avoid bluray until it gets easier to play.
> >
> > Hmm, on which features depends the encryption? Would a Windows Media
> > Player in Wine be able to play it or do I need an operating system
> > supporting it, maybe in a virtual machine? Has anyone tried?
>
> Neither of these methods would work at all.
>
> Read up on the Protected Video Path (PVP) at:
> http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?
> command=printArticleBasic&articleId=9005047
>
> Basically you won't be able to use a "legitimate" player under
> Linux. You either rip it, use a DeCSS equivalent, or not at all.
>
> >> Why would you buy an HD-DVD reader?
> >> That format is dead and there won't be any new titles.
> >
> > It's meant for my dad. He's a big Star Trek fan and afaik the new
> > remastered Star Trek Original Series is HD-DVD-only.
>
> It'll probably be available on BluRay soon enough, although HD-DVD
> might be a cheap way to buy it. But don't plan on being able to use
> those disks on set-top hi-def players in 5 years time.
>
> > The price
> > difference isn't that big, either.
>
> For the drive, no. It's probably worth paying for that extra feature.
>
> Stroller.
>
>

Well, then it's a no-go. The display is a pre-"HD-ready" TV-set with a
standard DVI-D-port and a fairly high but non-standard resolution so I
don't expect it to work with a hardware player or PVP.

Well, it seems like the only thing someone like me can do is to use
[ahem] *alternative* ways to obtain a copy [1].

[1] Notice that this mail isn't signed in case someone doesn't
understand the irony in the statement above. Of course I'm a good
capitalistic citizen who'd give his life to protect the property of
Warner Bros. and Disney...
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Stroller 05-24-2008 09:18 PM

High Definition and OSS
 
On 24 May 2008, at 18:37, Florian Philipp wrote:

On Sat, 24 May 2008 17:15:34 +0100
Stroller <stroller@stellar.eclipse.co.uk> wrote:


Hmm, on which features depends the encryption? Would a Windows Media
Player in Wine be able to play it or do I need an operating system
supporting it, maybe in a virtual machine? Has anyone tried?


Neither of these methods would work at all.

Read up on the Protected Video Path (PVP) at:
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?
command=printArticleBasic&articleId=9005047

Basically you won't be able to use a "legitimate" player under
Linux. You either rip it, use a DeCSS equivalent, or not at all.
...

Well, then it's a no-go. The display is a pre-"HD-ready" TV-set with a
standard DVI-D-port and a fairly high but non-standard resolution so I
don't expect it to work with a hardware player or PVP.

Well, it seems like the only thing someone like me can do is to use
alternative ways to obtain a copy.


I wouldn't rule it out completely. I should mention that not all
disks require Protected Path at present, but more new releases may do
in the future. But I really wouldn't expect Nero HD-DVD player (or
whatever) to run under WINE.


I believe instead that you can rip the movie files off the bluray to
hard-drive and either play them from there or transcode them.


Blurays are about 25gig, IIRC, so it's a bit much to keep your whole
collection on your PC's desktop, but I think I read they can be
transcoded to half their size (or is it 5gig? I can't recall) without
quality loss. And I'd think they'd still be better-than-DVD quality
at 2 or 3 gigs.


So - 500gig harddrives coming in at under 10p per gig these days -
it's feasible to rip 100 or 200 blurays (which'd cost you a packet at
today's prices, anyway!) to the NAS, just until you upgrade your TV
in 5 years time.


If you Google "bluray Linux" an Ubuntu forums post comes up
explaining the hows & whys. All the bluray's VOB files are a standard
container/codec, so it's just the encryption you have to worry about.
What teh haXorz are doing is running a debugger under the Windows
players and reading the decryption keys out of memory; you download
the list of cracked keys and put it in ~./keyz or whereever and your
Linux ripper does the job. I think you can playback in mplayer.


Finally I should mention that hi-def isn't IMO worth getting excited
about, and I don't think it's that much better than regular old DVD.
I happen to have a bluray player because I bought a PS3 for
videogames and I have been tempted to buy a couple of movies for it.
I'm sure the clarity & crispness is much clearer on releases of the
latest movies (Transformers or whatever) but when watching classics
like Terminator the source material (grainy film) is the limitation.
I've got high-bitrate DVDs on which the failings of the source
material is clearly visible, FFS! On "28 Days Later" (bluray) you can
VERY clearly see the haze of the greenscreen behind the actor's head
as he walks across Westminster Bridge - they filmed that scene using
a small handycam (lower def than 1080p?), then used software to put
the background in afterwards, and it's quite obvious that they did
so. Any of these movies I'd enjoy just as much on regular DVD, so
just remember that hi-def isn't necessarily better - I might spend
the odd tenner here or there indulging myself on BluRays, but new or
second-hand I'm only paying 3 - 5 for DVDs, and it's hard to argue
that hi-def is 3x to 6x better.


Stroller.

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