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Old 07-17-2012, 08:57 AM
Nikos Chantziaras
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

On 17/07/12 05:22, Nilesh Govindrajan wrote:

So the same old query again I guess.
What architecture should I use for a machine with 3GB RAM and a 64bit
processor?

I believe 64bit should be given serious consideration only if RAM is gt
or = 4 GB, even there 32bit is allowable with PAE if I'm not wrong.

So what is recommended? There are as such no special use cases to go
64bit for me.


Since your CPU is 64-bit, use that. You will find reports out there
about how 64-bit consumes more RAM. The effect however is very small.


Also, if you later get more RAM, you won't have to switch archs. DDR3
is very cheap, about 5 bucks ($ or €) per GB right now.
 
Old 07-17-2012, 01:36 PM
Pandu Poluan
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

On Jul 17, 2012 10:08 AM, "Michael Mol" <mikemol@gmail.com> wrote:

>

--- >8

>

> IMO, it's worth the 'overhead' to run 64-bit, if only for the greater

> number of GPRs and other architectural improvements. There's honestly

> a lot of good stuff in x86-64 beyond the larger address space. The

> increased address space also helps long-lived programs avoid address

> space fragmentation.

>

> --

> :wq

>


+1 on architectural improvements.


From a purely data-wise view: with 64 bits, Long Integers will be handled much faster than having to manhandle 2 32-bit chunks of half-integers.


Rgds,
 
Old 07-17-2012, 01:49 PM
Leiking
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

64bit means bugs.?? But I use 64.

2012/7/17 Pandu Poluan <pandu@poluan.info>:
>
> On Jul 17, 2012 10:08 AM, "Michael Mol" <mikemol@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
> --- >8
>
>
>>
>> IMO, it's worth the 'overhead' to run 64-bit, if only for the greater
>> number of GPRs and other architectural improvements. There's honestly
>> a lot of good stuff in x86-64 beyond the larger address space. The
>> increased address space also helps long-lived programs avoid address
>> space fragmentation.
>>
>> --
>> :wq
>>
>
> +1 on architectural improvements.
>
> From a purely data-wise view: with 64 bits, Long Integers will be handled
> much faster than having to manhandle 2 32-bit chunks of half-integers.
>
> Rgds,
 
Old 07-17-2012, 02:04 PM
Nilesh Govindrajan
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

On 07/17/2012 07:19 PM, Leiking wrote:

64bit means bugs.?? But I use 64.

2012/7/17 Pandu Poluan <pandu@poluan.info>:


On Jul 17, 2012 10:08 AM, "Michael Mol" <mikemol@gmail.com> wrote:



--- >8




IMO, it's worth the 'overhead' to run 64-bit, if only for the greater
number of GPRs and other architectural improvements. There's honestly
a lot of good stuff in x86-64 beyond the larger address space. The
increased address space also helps long-lived programs avoid address
space fragmentation.

--
:wq



+1 on architectural improvements.

From a purely data-wise view: with 64 bits, Long Integers will be handled
much faster than having to manhandle 2 32-bit chunks of half-integers.

Rgds,




Bugs. This is why I wanted to get an answer to this question specifically.

I've been using Gentoo since one year and with amd64 only. But recently
(if you noticed), I'd posted a thread about lot of segfaults.


As much as I was compelled to think that something is really wrong with
my hardware, a similar segfault bug occurred on an _amd64_ Gentoo VM
with Linode I manage, that too with a program that had been working ever
since I installed it, and there were no updates as such.


But from the inputs I received, I think it would be obviously better to
stay with 64bit.


Is it only me or the ~amd64 branch has become really unstable in the few
days? (Yeah I know ~amd64 can be unstable to any extent it wants to, but
just a qualitative question)


--
Nilesh Govindrajan
http://nileshgr.com
 
Old 07-17-2012, 02:18 PM
Mark Knecht
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 9:23 PM, Michael Mol <mikemol@gmail.com> wrote:
<SNIP>
> This is all on an amd64 system. I don't know what it's like in 32-bit
> x86 on Gentoo, as I've never run that form of Gentoo; I let multilib
> handle things there.
>
> --
> :wq
>

Correct me if I'm wrong please but as I remember it everyone running
64-bit is running multi-lib unless they specifically choose a
no-multilib profile, correct?

Anyway, I suspect our systems are reasonably similar in terms of
capability, and for clarity, the only 64-bit machine I have any
troubles on, which are Flash & OpenGL/KDE, is my compute server that
runs VMs all day, and those problems only started when I added a
second Nvidia card. With a single card & 2 monitors everything was
fine. With 2 cards, both Nvidia but different models, and 3 monitors,
Flash in Firefox fails all the time, (But not Flash in Chrome where
it's built in) and some of the nice OpenGL features of KDE simply
don't operate any more.

If I had lots of money I'd look into an Nvidia card that supports 4
outputs but for now I'm stuck with what I've got!

- Mark
 
Old 07-17-2012, 02:32 PM
Michael Mol
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 10:18 AM, Mark Knecht <markknecht@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 9:23 PM, Michael Mol <mikemol@gmail.com> wrote:
> <SNIP>
>> This is all on an amd64 system. I don't know what it's like in 32-bit
>> x86 on Gentoo, as I've never run that form of Gentoo; I let multilib
>> handle things there.
>>
>> --
>> :wq
>>
>
> Correct me if I'm wrong please but as I remember it everyone running
> 64-bit is running multi-lib unless they specifically choose a
> no-multilib profile, correct?

Correct. And I'm not using a no-multilib profile, either.

>
> Anyway, I suspect our systems are reasonably similar in terms of
> capability, and for clarity, the only 64-bit machine I have any
> troubles on, which are Flash & OpenGL/KDE, is my compute server that
> runs VMs all day, and those problems only started when I added a
> second Nvidia card.

I haven't run a dual-card setup. I have two systems I can relate to.
One is a dual-E5345 system with 10GB of RAM, and one is a Phenom 9650
with 8GB of RAM.

> With a single card & 2 monitors everything was
> fine. With 2 cards, both Nvidia but different models, and 3 monitors,
> Flash in Firefox fails all the time, (But not Flash in Chrome where
> it's built in) and some of the nice OpenGL features of KDE simply
> don't operate any more.

I haven't run a multimon setup in a while. I sacrificed one of my
displays as a debugging display for another machine.

What driver are you using? About 3 years ago, I had a setup going
where I was using both my onboard ATI RadeonHD3200 and an nVidia
GeForce 210 with five displays split across the two. Flash never
*crashed* on me, but it did get extraordinarily confused whenever it
came time to fullscreen.

(I did eventually switch to using an ATI Radeon 5770, but only because
of the headaches trying to manage things with two different
proprietary tools. You could do some scary stuff at the time. I don't
know if that's still possible. I'm certain I was running an
unsupported configuration...)

>
> If I had lots of money I'd look into an Nvidia card that supports 4
> outputs but for now I'm stuck with what I've got!

I'd bet on it being a driver issue.

--
:wq
 
Old 07-17-2012, 04:31 PM
Volker Armin Hemmann
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

Am Dienstag, 17. Juli 2012, 07:52:08 schrieb Nilesh Govindrajan:
> So the same old query again I guess.
> What architecture should I use for a machine with 3GB RAM and a 64bit
> processor?
>
> I believe 64bit should be given serious consideration only if RAM is gt or
> = 4 GB, even there 32bit is allowable with PAE if I'm not wrong.
>
> So what is recommended? There are as such no special use cases to go 64bit
> for me.

now that I am home: you believe wrong.

There are many good reasons to go 64 bit. Easier memory managment, more
registers. Bigger register. Faster math because of the bigger registers.

There is seriously NUL reasons to use 32bit. Zero. Zilch. Why throw away all
those nice improvements - for nothing in return?

Video-codecs? I haven't seen a video in years that was not playable by 64bit
ffmpeg based players but worked with 32bit. Those who were troublemakers were
also unplayable with 32bit codecs. Flash? Just works. Stable? You bet.

The only use case that might come up is wine - I don't know anything about
that beast. Haven't had any use for it in years.

--
#163933
 
Old 07-17-2012, 04:34 PM
Volker Armin Hemmann
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

Am Dienstag, 17. Juli 2012, 19:34:32 schrieb Nilesh Govindrajan:

>
> Is it only me or the ~amd64 branch has become really unstable in the few
> days? (Yeah I know ~amd64 can be unstable to any extent it wants to, but
> just a qualitative question)

It is you. Some gnome/freedesktop/whatthehell stuff interacting badly. Not a
64bit problem.

--
#163933
 
Old 07-17-2012, 04:38 PM
Michael Mol
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 12:31 PM, Volker Armin Hemmann
<volkerarmin@googlemail.com> wrote:
> Am Dienstag, 17. Juli 2012, 07:52:08 schrieb Nilesh Govindrajan:
>> So the same old query again I guess.
>> What architecture should I use for a machine with 3GB RAM and a 64bit
>> processor?
>>
>> I believe 64bit should be given serious consideration only if RAM is gt or
>> = 4 GB, even there 32bit is allowable with PAE if I'm not wrong.
>>
>> So what is recommended? There are as such no special use cases to go 64bit
>> for me.
>
> now that I am home: you believe wrong.
>
> There are many good reasons to go 64 bit. Easier memory managment, more
> registers. Bigger register. Faster math because of the bigger registers.
>
> There is seriously NUL reasons to use 32bit. Zero. Zilch. Why throw away all
> those nice improvements - for nothing in return?
>
> Video-codecs? I haven't seen a video in years that was not playable by 64bit
> ffmpeg based players but worked with 32bit. Those who were troublemakers were
> also unplayable with 32bit codecs. Flash? Just works. Stable? You bet.
>
> The only use case that might come up is wine - I don't know anything about
> that beast. Haven't had any use for it in years.

IME, 64-bit WINE 64-bit works as well as 32-bit WINE...Which is to
say, your mileage will vary based on what you're doing, same as it
always has.

--
:wq
 
Old 07-17-2012, 04:43 PM
Alecks Gates
 
Default 32bit or 64bit

On Jul 17, 2012 11:32 AM, "Volker Armin Hemmann" <volkerarmin@googlemail.com> wrote:

*snip*

> The only use case that might come up is wine - I don't know anything about

> that beast. Haven't had any use for it in years.

>

> --

> #163933

>

I use wine daily on 64 bit with no problems.* You can generate a 32 or 64 bit config with the "WINEARCH" setting but I haven't found a reason to use a win64 config (nor do I know the differences within wine).* I am not sure if a 32 bit OS would make a wine any faster, but probably not noticeably faster.



OT: Wine on Gentoo seems much faster than other distros.* I think this is one case where the performance makes a difference.* I usually do it with Lord of the Rings Online, which is more intensive than WoW as Michael mentioned to run.



Alecks Gates, sent from Android on an HTC G2
 

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