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Old 06-29-2012, 01:11 AM
Alecks Gates
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On Thu, Jun 28, 2012 at 7:36 PM, walt <w41ter@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 06/28/2012 05:19 PM, Alecks Gates wrote:
>> On Thu, Jun 28, 2012 at 7:12 PM, walt <w41ter@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> On 06/28/2012 03:41 PM, Dale wrote:
>>>> Paul Hartman wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, Jun 25, 2012 at 12:05 AM, Dale <rdalek1967@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> It appears that grub2 is coming soon.
>>>>> grub 2.00 has been released!
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.gnu.org/software/grub/
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I wasn't expecting it to be that soon. *I guess it will hit the tree
>>>> pretty soon then. *Well, we all need to think about the goods and bads
>>>> of upgrading or staying with the old. *I'm thinking about using the new
>>>> one pretty soon. *Heck, they ticked me off pretty bad with the /usr and
>>>> init thingy so I may as well jump off the cliff I was pushed up to. *:/
>>>>
>>>> 1/4 of the way down, all is good so far. *1/2 way down and all is good
>>>> so far. *3/4 way down and all is good so far. *I'm worried about that
>>>> sudden stop now. *O_O
>>>
>>> Well said
>>>
>>> I've heard a rumor that Windows doesn't like GUID partition tables, so
>>> I haven't yet installed grub2 on my one machine that still multiboots
>>> between operating systems. *(That's my one remaining machine with a
>>> legal install of Windows.) *I confess I'm not interested enough to
>>> confirm the rumor, so I continue to wait because there is no incentive
>>> for me to make the change.
>>>
>>>
>> I've never had a problem with Grub 2 + Windows (XP, Vista, 7, still
>> haven't had the will to sacrifice myself for 8). *Although sometimes
>> it seems, with all the complaining some linux users like to do about
>> new software, I must be a wee bit lucky. *Been using Grub 2 alpha/beta
>> for years with much success! *I've so far enjoyed the configuration
>> more than legacy Grub.
>
> Just to confirm, my reservations are not about Windows, but about GUID
> partitions. *Are you using GUID partition tables?
>
No, I'm not using GUID right now. But I don't believe this has
anything to do with Grub 2 itself and from what I can tell you don't
actually use GPT on your dual-boot machine anyway. Though that would
take away the main reason to upgrade. Doing a quick DDG search, I see
more positive than negative about Windows + GTP. I think we should
promote a greater sense of adventure.
 
Old 06-29-2012, 01:53 AM
Bill Kenworthy
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On Thu, 2012-06-28 at 20:36 -0400, Michael Mol wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 28, 2012 at 6:41 PM, Dale <rdalek1967@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Paul Hartman wrote:
> >> On Mon, Jun 25, 2012 at 12:05 AM, Dale <rdalek1967@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> It appears that grub2 is coming soon.
> >> grub 2.00 has been released!
> >>
> >> https://www.gnu.org/software/grub/
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > I wasn't expecting it to be that soon. I guess it will hit the tree
> > pretty soon then. Well, we all need to think about the goods and bads
> > of upgrading or staying with the old. I'm thinking about using the new
> > one pretty soon. Heck, they ticked me off pretty bad with the /usr and
> > init thingy so I may as well jump off the cliff I was pushed up to. :/
> >
> > 1/4 of the way down, all is good so far. 1/2 way down and all is good
> > so far. 3/4 way down and all is good so far. I'm worried about that
> > sudden stop now. O_O
> >
> > Dale
>
> *shuffles his feet*
>
> I've started using genkernel. Once I discovered I can specify my own
> kernel configuration, it got a lot less ugly to me. The initramfs
> thing hasn't gotten in my way...yet. And it helped me recover an
> install process once so far, so I can't complain _to_ much. My only
> complaint thus far is its terrible error reporting. And since I'm
> using an initramfs, I went ahead and dropped my / on top of a raid5
> volume.
>
> But even before I started using genkernel...grub2 sounded like a good
> thing. One of the previous threads in here described how you assemble
> its configuration, and it made a *lot* of sense, from an architectural
> standpoint.
>
>

genkernel error reporting can be improved no end by editing the script
(/usr/share/genkernel/defaults/linuxrc) and sprinkling with echo,
good_msg and bad_msg statements ...

Unfortunately it cant log to a file (or at least I have not tried) so
sleep statements may help so you read the messages.

Copy the above script to a new name and run genkernel as "genkernel
--color --linuxrc=/usr/share/genkernel/defaults/linuxrc.uswsusp
--initramfs-overlay=/var/lib/genkernel/overlay --lvm --menuconfig all "

The overlay is a some extra stuff I wanted in the initramfs for suspend
to disk.

BillK




BillK
 
Old 06-29-2012, 08:35 AM
Neil Bothwick
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:12:54 -0700, walt wrote:

> I've heard a rumor that Windows doesn't like GUID partition tables, so
> I haven't yet installed grub2 on my one machine that still multiboots
> between operating systems. (That's my one remaining machine with a
> legal install of Windows.) I confess I'm not interested enough to
> confirm the rumor, so I continue to wait because there is no incentive
> for me to make the change.

GRUB and GPT are completely unrelated, I use GRUB2 on machines with both
DOS and GPT partition tables, you don't need to repartition your drive to
upgrade your bootloader.

However, I also run GRUB legacy on some systems. I'd never install it
now, but if it's installed and working, why mess with it?


--
Neil Bothwick

Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
 
Old 06-29-2012, 02:57 PM
Mike Gilbert
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 3:00 PM, Michael Mol <mikemol@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 2:52 PM, Tanstaafl <tanstaafl@libertytrek.org> wrote:
>> On 2012-06-25 1:05 AM, Dale <rdalek1967@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Howdy,
>>>
>>> It appears that grub2 is coming soon.
>>
>>
>> Has the Handbook/Install docs been updated to provide for installing Grub2
>> with a fresh install?
>>
>> I'm about to do one, and would like to not have to switch this out later...
>
> No, handbook only discusses grub (not grub2) and lilo.
>
> Which is sad; I'd love to use stuff like grub2 and {ext,sys}linux.
> It'd be sweet to make things more easily convertible to netboot or
> cdrom-boot scenarios.

We will add some instructions to the handbook when grub:2 is
stabilized. The docs team doesn't want to do it before then.
 
Old 06-29-2012, 03:04 PM
Michael Orlitzky
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On 06/29/12 10:57, Mike Gilbert wrote:
>>
>> No, handbook only discusses grub (not grub2) and lilo.
>>
>> Which is sad; I'd love to use stuff like grub2 and {ext,sys}linux.
>> It'd be sweet to make things more easily convertible to netboot or
>> cdrom-boot scenarios.
>
> We will add some instructions to the handbook when grub:2 is
> stabilized. The docs team doesn't want to do it before then.
>

This makes sense, because people only do stable installs.
 
Old 06-29-2012, 03:05 PM
Mike Gilbert
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On Mon, Jun 25, 2012 at 1:05 AM, Dale <rdalek1967@gmail.com> wrote:
> Howdy,
>
> It appears that grub2 is coming soon. *Thread on -dev said a couple
> months or so till it hits the tree, keyworded and/or masked I'm sure. *I
> guess it is about time to jump off the cliff and give this a try. *I
> installed Kubuntu on a system for my brother and it uses grub2. *I have
> had to edit the config and then run the update script. *I have sort of
> installed and made a config change to grub2, even tho it was only once.
> Basically, I sort of seen the thing at least. *o_O
>
> My first question is, how hard is this to change from old grub to
> grub2? *I only run Gentoo here, no windoze at all and no other distro
> either. *I figure that may make it easier. *I must confess tho, I'm a
> hoarder of kernels. *LOL * I generally have several versions of them on
> here. *Is there a way for it to only see say the last 3 versions or so?
> I only have three right now but I cleaned out all the non-init kernels a
> while back. *Given time, I may have a dozen or so. *I would rather not
> have that many lines on the grub screen when booting.
>
> Also, will it know what init thingy image to connect the kernels too? *I
> name my kernels with the version and name the init thingy with a similar
> name. *Looks someting like this:
>
> root@fireball / # ls -al /boot/bzImage-3.*
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4740064 May 16 20:25 /boot/bzImage-3.3.5-2
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4758496 May 23 13:09 /boot/bzImage-3.4.0-1
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4758816 Jun 14 09:00 /boot/bzImage-3.4.2.r1-1
> root@fireball / # ls -al /boot/initramfs-3.*
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 3560934 May 12 05:03 /boot/initramfs-3.3.5-1.img
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 3560423 May 23 13:10 /boot/initramfs-3.4.0.img
> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 3561170 Jun 14 09:05 /boot/initramfs-3.4.2.img
> root@fireball / #
>
> There are times when I may have more than one kernel but only one init
> thingy tho. *So far, one init thingy will work with any kernel of that
> version. *I have not tried mixing tho.
>
> Also, how much disk space does grub take up on /boot? *Mine is on a
> separate partition and I hope it is large enough.
>
> Thoughts. *Info.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>

Thanks for "announcing" this Dale. grub-2.00 is in ~arch as of last night.

Given your current naming scheme, grub2-mkconfig will not detect your
kernels. They must be named vmlinuz-version or kernel-version. For
example:

/boot/vmlinuz-3.4.3
/boot/kernel-2.6.39-gentoo

Your initramfs files look good.

Space wise, grub needs a couple hundred sectors after your MBR to
embed itself. If you used the default fdisk setting when you
partitioned your drive, you should have 2047 free sectors that it can
use.

If you have your kernels named properly and some free sectors on your
hard drive, setting up grub:2 is a very easy process. See the wiki
page for more info.

http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/GRUB2_Quick_Start
 
Old 06-29-2012, 08:46 PM
Grant Edwards
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On 2012-06-29, Alecks Gates <alecks.g@gmail.com> wrote:

> I've never had a problem with Grub 2 + Windows (XP, Vista, 7, still
> haven't had the will to sacrifice myself for 8).

I've had problems with Ubuntu and Grub2. It seems you can't install
grub2 anywhere except the MBR, but I think that may be a bug in the
installer rather than Grub2.

> Although sometimes it seems, with all the complaining some linux
> users like to do about new software, I must be a wee bit lucky.

Nah, mostly we just like to complain.

Young kids these days with their fancy graphics and bloated
software...

Things have been going steadily downhill since the days of V7 on a
PDP-11 with 256K words of RAM, a 20MB hard drive and uucp via dial-up
modems for "networking". Real programmers didn't _need_ more that 64k
of text and 64k data to get the job done. And that machine supported
8 software engineers doing embedded SW development. In the snow. Up
hill both ways. And we liked it!

> Been using Grub 2 alpha/beta for years with much success! I've so
> far enjoyed the configuration more than legacy Grub.

--
Grant Edwards grant.b.edwards Yow! MMM-MM!! So THIS is
at BIO-NEBULATION!
gmail.com
 
Old 06-30-2012, 12:45 AM
walt
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On 06/29/2012 08:05 AM, Mike Gilbert wrote:
>
> http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/GRUB2_Quick_Start

Thanks for the tip. /etc/make.conf strikes me as an odd
place to put settings that apply to only one package.

Any idea why that decision was made?
 
Old 06-30-2012, 12:55 AM
walt
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On 06/29/2012 01:35 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:
> GRUB and GPT are completely unrelated, I use GRUB2 on machines with both
> DOS and GPT partition tables, you don't need to repartition your drive to
> upgrade your bootloader.

I didn't make myself clear. I wouldn't hesitate to convert this machine
to GPT (I like it) but I don't know if Windows would like GPT.

I guess I should get off my butt and go google it.

Maybe tomorrow
 
Old 06-30-2012, 01:07 AM
walt
 
Default Grub2 and is the upgrade a tooth puller.

On 06/29/2012 05:55 PM, walt wrote:
> On 06/29/2012 01:35 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:
>> GRUB and GPT are completely unrelated, I use GRUB2 on machines with
>> both DOS and GPT partition tables, you don't need to repartition
>> your drive to upgrade your bootloader.
>
> I didn't make myself clear. I wouldn't hesitate to convert this
> machine to GPT (I like it) but I don't know if Windows would like
> GPT.
>
> I guess I should get off my butt and go google it.
>
> Maybe tomorrow

Hah! I knew all along that if I waited long enough, David Haller would
post a link to this info:

Microsoft's FAQ is a bit pessimistic. It is possible to boot
Windows from a GPT disk on a BIOS-based computer, but the ways
to do this are hacks.

Thanks, David


--
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