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Old 02-15-2008, 01:03 PM
Neil Bothwick
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

On Fri, 15 Feb 2008 14:36:25 +0100, Strong Cypher wrote:

> For exemple , with reiser4 the portage directory don't take a lot of
> space, and so read it it's really fast...

You could use a file, like this, then put ext2 on it.

http://gentoo-wiki.com/TIP_Speeding_up_portage#Make_A_Sparse_File_to_crea te_portage_in


--
Neil Bothwick

In an atomic war, all men will be cremated equal.
 
Old 02-15-2008, 01:10 PM
Dirk Heinrichs
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

Am Freitag, 15. Februar 2008 schrieb ext Strong Cypher:

> Is they a good fs that is extremly adapted to gentoo system (portage ...)

Huh. Why should somebody write a filesystem with Gentoo portage in mind?

> Is they fs that support gzip like reiser4 do ?

See http://parallel.vub.ac.be/~johan/compFUSEd/, it's an overlay filesystem,
so you're not bound to any specific real filesystem. OTOH, harddisks are
cheap nowadays.

> For exemple , with reiser4 the portage directory don't take a lot of
> space, and so read it it's really fast...

The same is true for reiser3.

> I want a alternative

Well, there are plenty: xfs, jfs, ...

> is ext4 a good alternative ?

ext4 is in early develoment, as are other new filesystems (btrfs for
example), so no it isn't (yet, but probably sooner than reiser4).

If you're searching something that stores small files efficiently, like
reiser3 does, btrfs comes close, if I remember right.

Bye...

Dirk
--
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Old 02-15-2008, 01:34 PM
Aaron Clark
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

Dirk Heinrichs wrote:

Am Freitag, 15. Februar 2008 schrieb ext Strong Cypher:


For exemple , with reiser4 the portage directory don't take a lot of
space, and so read it it's really fast...


The same is true for reiser3.


I want a alternative


Well, there are plenty: xfs, jfs, ...


Of the current main four FS's on modern linux, here's a general overview
of them:


ext3: Older, reliable, stable. You get very good tools support for ext3
(including online resize) and low cpu-usage for the most part but it's
slower and less space efficient than more recent fs's.


jfs: Better performance than ext3, deals with larger files reasonably
well with low cpu usage. Not very commonly used to my knowledge.


reiserfs (reiser3): very fast for most operations (the exception being
directory creation iirc), especially efficient for dealing with many
small files. It has noticeably higher cpu-usage than ext3/jfs. I
believe there are also some potential performance bottlenecks on SMP
systems as it makes liberal use of the Big Kernel Lock.


xfs: high performance, especially when dealing with many large or small
files; Gets along very well with raid arrays. Noticeably higher cpu
usage than ext3/jfs. IIRC, it aggressively caches its writes so there
is a slight possibility of data loss if your power goes out suddenly in
the middle of a series of writes (I consider this a very small
possibility, it is journalled like the other fs's on this list so the
filesystem will still come up in a consistent state, you just may be
missing some of the data you were writing). Very good online tools
support provided with it.


I'm sure someone will jump in to correct me if I've misremembered
something. Favorite filesystems can be a bit like Window Manager or
favorite Desktop debates.


Aaron


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Old 02-15-2008, 01:48 PM
Dale
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

Aaron Clark wrote:

Dirk Heinrichs wrote:

Am Freitag, 15. Februar 2008 schrieb ext Strong Cypher:


For exemple , with reiser4 the portage directory don't take a lot of
space, and so read it it's really fast...


The same is true for reiser3.


I want a alternative


Well, there are plenty: xfs, jfs, ...


Of the current main four FS's on modern linux, here's a general
overview of them:


ext3: Older, reliable, stable. You get very good tools support for
ext3 (including online resize) and low cpu-usage for the most part
but it's slower and less space efficient than more recent fs's.


jfs: Better performance than ext3, deals with larger files reasonably
well with low cpu usage. Not very commonly used to my knowledge.


reiserfs (reiser3): very fast for most operations (the exception being
directory creation iirc), especially efficient for dealing with many
small files. It has noticeably higher cpu-usage than ext3/jfs. I
believe there are also some potential performance bottlenecks on SMP
systems as it makes liberal use of the Big Kernel Lock.


xfs: high performance, especially when dealing with many large or
small files; Gets along very well with raid arrays. Noticeably higher
cpu usage than ext3/jfs. IIRC, it aggressively caches its writes so
there is a slight possibility of data loss if your power goes out
suddenly in the middle of a series of writes (I consider this a very
small possibility, it is journalled like the other fs's on this list
so the filesystem will still come up in a consistent state, you just
may be missing some of the data you were writing). Very good online
tools support provided with it.


I'm sure someone will jump in to correct me if I've misremembered
something. Favorite filesystems can be a bit like Window Manager or
favorite Desktop debates.


Aaron





Little addition to XFS, I tried it once a while ago. Every time the
power failed, it would never boot again. I can say from personal
experience and from what I have read from others, if you plan to use
XFS, have a good UPS hooked up. It does not like power failures at
all. YMMV


Dale

:-) :-)
--

gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org mailing list
 
Old 02-15-2008, 02:04 PM
Aaron Clark
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

Dale wrote:



Little addition to XFS, I tried it once a while ago. Every time the
power failed, it would never boot again. I can say from personal
experience and from what I have read from others, if you plan to use
XFS, have a good UPS hooked up. It does not like power failures at
all. YMMV




In the YMMV category, I've used XFS on pretty much every file server
I've had in the last 4-5 years and it's never given me any trouble
despite pretty much never having a UPS hooked up and a decent number of
power outages. Granted, I never used it on my root filesystem, only
storage partitions.


Aaron
--
gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org mailing list
 
Old 02-15-2008, 02:08 PM
Uwe Thiem
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

On Friday 15 February 2008, Aaron Clark wrote:

> xfs: high performance, especially when dealing with many large or
> small files; Gets along very well with raid arrays. Noticeably
> higher cpu usage than ext3/jfs. IIRC, it aggressively caches its
> writes so there is a slight possibility of data loss if your power
> goes out suddenly in the middle of a series of writes (I consider
> this a very small possibility, it is journalled like the other fs's
> on this list so the filesystem will still come up in a consistent
> state, you just may be missing some of the data you were writing).
> Very good online tools support provided with it.

Sigh. So many myths about journalled filesystems, so little time to
squash them. ;-)

First of all, you are contradicting yourself. First you say you think
the possibility of data loss is slight, then you state at the end
that some data loss may occur. The second part is right. Data losses
are possible. Journalled filesystems do not prevent this. They deal
with filesystem consistency.

Second, no journalled filesystem in the whole wide world can prevent
occurences of inconsisteny in case of a power cut. None, try as they
might. Please commit the last two sentences to permanent memory. The
reason for this isn't the cache in your computer's ram but the cache
in modern harddrives. If the journal change still resides in the
harddrive cache while your power cut occurs, boooom - inconsistency.
There is nothing a filesystem - journalled or not - can do about it.

If you are really concerned about data loss and filesystem
inconsistencies, use a good journalled fs *and* a small UPS that can
shut your box down gracefully in case of a power cut.

Uwe

--
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http://www.linux.org.na/
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http://www.SysEx.com.na/
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Old 02-15-2008, 02:17 PM
Dale
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

Aaron Clark wrote:

Dale wrote:



Little addition to XFS, I tried it once a while ago. Every time the
power failed, it would never boot again. I can say from personal
experience and from what I have read from others, if you plan to use
XFS, have a good UPS hooked up. It does not like power failures at
all. YMMV




In the YMMV category, I've used XFS on pretty much every file
server I've had in the last 4-5 years and it's never given me any
trouble despite pretty much never having a UPS hooked up and a decent
number of power outages. Granted, I never used it on my root
filesystem, only storage partitions.


Aaron


Good idea not to use it on the / file system. LOL I was using Mandriva
for my ex's Mom. After about three or four tries, I went back to
reiserfs. It would crash but it would boot right back up again.
Nothing lost that I know of.


I just never trusted it again. I have also been told, and read
elsewhere, that it is a pretty well known thing that it doesn't like
power failures. It has its good points tho, which is why I was trying
it out.


Dale

:-) :-)
--

gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org mailing list
 
Old 02-15-2008, 02:17 PM
Dale
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

Aaron Clark wrote:

Dale wrote:



Little addition to XFS, I tried it once a while ago. Every time the
power failed, it would never boot again. I can say from personal
experience and from what I have read from others, if you plan to use
XFS, have a good UPS hooked up. It does not like power failures at
all. YMMV




In the YMMV category, I've used XFS on pretty much every file
server I've had in the last 4-5 years and it's never given me any
trouble despite pretty much never having a UPS hooked up and a decent
number of power outages. Granted, I never used it on my root
filesystem, only storage partitions.


Aaron


Good idea not to use it on the / file system. LOL I was using Mandriva
for my ex's Mom. After about three or four tries, I went back to
reiserfs. It would crash but it would boot right back up again.
Nothing lost that I know of.


I just never trusted it again. I have also been told, and read
elsewhere, that it is a pretty well known thing that it doesn't like
power failures. It has its good points tho, which is why I was trying
it out.


Dale

:-) :-)
--

gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org mailing list
 
Old 02-15-2008, 02:20 PM
"Strong Cypher"
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

Ok guy thanks for answer ...
For my use, mix of ext2/ext3 in partition (lvm) and sparse file could speed up my system ...
I think it could not at the same point of reiser4 but* support in case of crash could really be better ...


Thanks for answer

It's not easy to create filesystem that's is perfect for all case I see ... perhaps one day (I can dream, or make it)

2008/2/15, Dale <dalek1967@bellsouth.net>:
Aaron Clark wrote:
> Dale wrote:
>>
>>
>> Little addition to XFS, I tried it once a while ago.**Every time the
>> power failed, it would never boot again.**I can say from personal

>> experience and from what I have read from others, if you plan to use
>> XFS, have a good UPS hooked up.**It does not like power failures at
>> all.**YMMV
>>
>
> **In the YMMV category, I've used XFS on pretty much every file

> server I've had in the last 4-5 years and it's never given me any
> trouble despite pretty much never having a UPS hooked up and a decent
> number of power outages.**Granted, I never used it on my root

> filesystem, only storage partitions.
>
> Aaron


Good idea not to use it on the / file system.**LOL**I was using Mandriva
for my ex's Mom.**After about three or four tries, I went back to

reiserfs.**It would crash but it would boot right back up again.
Nothing lost that I know of.

I just never trusted it again.**I have also been told, and read
elsewhere, that it is a pretty well known thing that it doesn't like

power failures.**It has its good points tho, which is why I was trying
it out.


Dale

:-)**:-)

--
gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org mailing list
 
Old 02-15-2008, 02:20 PM
"Strong Cypher"
 
Default Ext4 status - Alternative to ext2/3 for gentoo portage and more

Ok guy thanks for answer ...
For my use, mix of ext2/ext3 in partition (lvm) and sparse file could speed up my system ...
I think it could not at the same point of reiser4 but* support in case of crash could really be better ...


Thanks for answer

It's not easy to create filesystem that's is perfect for all case I see ... perhaps one day (I can dream, or make it)

2008/2/15, Dale <dalek1967@bellsouth.net>:
Aaron Clark wrote:
> Dale wrote:
>>
>>
>> Little addition to XFS, I tried it once a while ago.**Every time the
>> power failed, it would never boot again.**I can say from personal

>> experience and from what I have read from others, if you plan to use
>> XFS, have a good UPS hooked up.**It does not like power failures at
>> all.**YMMV
>>
>
> **In the YMMV category, I've used XFS on pretty much every file

> server I've had in the last 4-5 years and it's never given me any
> trouble despite pretty much never having a UPS hooked up and a decent
> number of power outages.**Granted, I never used it on my root

> filesystem, only storage partitions.
>
> Aaron


Good idea not to use it on the / file system.**LOL**I was using Mandriva
for my ex's Mom.**After about three or four tries, I went back to

reiserfs.**It would crash but it would boot right back up again.
Nothing lost that I know of.

I just never trusted it again.**I have also been told, and read
elsewhere, that it is a pretty well known thing that it doesn't like

power failures.**It has its good points tho, which is why I was trying
it out.


Dale

:-)**:-)

--
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