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Old 02-14-2008, 10:08 PM
Neil Walker
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
I can find a lot of cards that are almost what I want. But I have an
external drive, and a PCI-X motherboard. Not internal, and not
PCI-E. Anybody know of such a beast


A quick Google led to this:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124003


Be lucky,

Neil


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Old 02-14-2008, 10:40 PM
Jerry McBride
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

On Thursday 14 February 2008 06:08:23 pm Neil Walker wrote:
> Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
> > I can find a lot of cards that are almost what I want. But I have an
> > external drive, and a PCI-X motherboard. Not internal, and not
> > PCI-E. Anybody know of such a beast
>
> A quick Google led to this:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124003
>
> Be lucky,
>
> Neil
>


I'm confused... what is the diff between pi-x pci-e and pci? The card that
Neil pointed to is a PCI card. Is that what he wanted?





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Old 02-14-2008, 11:37 PM
Volker Armin Hemmann
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

On Freitag, 15. Februar 2008, Jerry McBride wrote:

> I'm confused... what is the diff between pi-x pci-e and pci? The card that
> Neil pointed to is a PCI card. Is that what he wanted?

pci is a parallel bus. 32bit, 33mhz

pci-x is an 64bit, 66mhz enhancement of the pci bus - backwards compatible. If
you are lucky.

pci-e is a serial point-to-point interface. Not compatible.

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Old 02-15-2008, 04:12 AM
Dale
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

Neil Walker wrote:

Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
I can find a lot of cards that are almost what I want. But I have an
external drive, and a PCI-X motherboard. Not internal, and not
PCI-E. Anybody know of such a beast


A quick Google led to this:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124003


Be lucky,

Neil




Dale makes a note of this. Questions: If I buy this card and a SATA
hard drive, will I notice faster transfer speed on the drive or will the
PCI bus limit it somehow? I currently get 40 to 50 MBs/sec on my IDE
drives. Would this setup be any faster?


Thanks

Dale

:-) :-)
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Old 02-15-2008, 10:01 AM
Florian Philipp
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

On Thu, 2008-02-14 at 23:12 -0600, Dale wrote:
> Neil Walker wrote:
> > Kevin O'Gorman wrote:
> >> I can find a lot of cards that are almost what I want. But I have an
> >> external drive, and a PCI-X motherboard. Not internal, and not
> >> PCI-E. Anybody know of such a beast
> >
> > A quick Google led to this:
> > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124003
> >
> > Be lucky,
> >
> > Neil
> >
> >
>
> Dale makes a note of this. Questions: If I buy this card and a SATA
> hard drive, will I notice faster transfer speed on the drive or will the
> PCI bus limit it somehow? I currently get 40 to 50 MBs/sec on my IDE
> drives. Would this setup be any faster?
>
> Thanks
>
> Dale
>
> :-) :-)

Short answer: no.

Long answer:
You'd need to flood your PCI-bus with data to see any drop in speed.
Ways to do it? Buy four disks and build a RAID1 using Linux device
mapper. Since the data sent to the devices is not replicated on a
RAID-controller (e.g. after transfer through PCI) but in software, you'd
send four times the amount of data through your poor old PCI-bus.
 
Old 02-15-2008, 01:14 PM
Stroller
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

On 15 Feb 2008, at 05:12, Dale wrote:


Dale makes a note of this. Questions: If I buy this card and a
SATA hard drive, will I notice faster transfer speed on the drive
or will the PCI bus limit it somehow? I currently get 40 to 50 MBs/
sec on my IDE drives. Would this setup be any faster?


If you want faster throughput then onboard controllers or PCI-express
(PCI-e) are the way to go.


I'm not sure how the bandwidth of regular old PCI compares to (i.e.
limits) that of an SATA harddrive, but you can come across PCI's
performance limitations if using a RAID array. PCI-express has
_signifcantly_ more capacity than regular old PCI - I read recently
that regular old PCI may be unable to keep up with a gigabit network
card & that onboard gigbit network ports are faster.


I tend to think of PCI-X just as "long PCI" or only-a-bit-faster-than
PCI. It might be (say?) double the speed of short PCI, but it doesn't
match PCI-e's several-times (?) performance. PCI-X may be useful when
trying to get the best performance out of an older motherboard, or if
you're trying to save money by picking up an expensive hardware-RAID
card cheaper secondhand, but I would try to avoid investing too much
money in it until you've done the maths - a new motherboard / CPU /
RAM might even be cheaper & faster.


Stroller.
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Old 02-15-2008, 01:43 PM
Dale
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

Stroller wrote:


On 15 Feb 2008, at 05:12, Dale wrote:


Dale makes a note of this. Questions: If I buy this card and a SATA
hard drive, will I notice faster transfer speed on the drive or will
the PCI bus limit it somehow? I currently get 40 to 50 MBs/sec on my
IDE drives. Would this setup be any faster?


If you want faster throughput then onboard controllers or PCI-express
(PCI-e) are the way to go.


I'm not sure how the bandwidth of regular old PCI compares to (i.e.
limits) that of an SATA harddrive, but you can come across PCI's
performance limitations if using a RAID array. PCI-express has
_signifcantly_ more capacity than regular old PCI - I read recently
that regular old PCI may be unable to keep up with a gigabit network
card & that onboard gigbit network ports are faster.


I tend to think of PCI-X just as "long PCI" or only-a-bit-faster-than
PCI. It might be (say?) double the speed of short PCI, but it doesn't
match PCI-e's several-times (?) performance. PCI-X may be useful when
trying to get the best performance out of an older motherboard, or if
you're trying to save money by picking up an expensive hardware-RAID
card cheaper secondhand, but I would try to avoid investing too much
money in it until you've done the maths - a new motherboard / CPU /
RAM might even be cheaper & faster.


Stroller.


So basically I need to build a new rig with newer stuff? I have a old
Abit NF7-2.0 mobo right now. I want to build a rig with dual CPUs and
all the "new" stuff. Got to save up some serious cash first tho. Being
disabled makes that take a little time.


Thanks for the info.

Dale

:-) :-) :-)
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Old 02-15-2008, 02:57 PM
Volker Armin Hemmann
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

On Freitag, 15. Februar 2008, Stroller wrote:
PCI-express has
> _signifcantly_ more capacity than regular old PCI - I read recently
> that regular old PCI may be unable to keep up with a gigabit network
> card & that onboard gigbit network ports are faster.

PCI = 133mb/sec theoretical. 100mb with a good chipset (ie not nforce).
PCIE = 250mb/sec theoretical

>
> I tend to think of PCI-X just as "long PCI" or only-a-bit-faster-than
> PCI.

you think wrong.


> It might be (say?) double the speed of short PCI, but it doesn't
> match PCI-e's several-times (?) performance.

PCI-X is A LOT faster than PCI, faster than PCIE 1x, 2x

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI-X

PCI-X 1.0 = 1GB/sec
PCI-X 2 = 2GB/sec
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Old 02-15-2008, 10:41 PM
Stroller
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

On 15 Feb 2008, at 15:57, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:

...

I tend to think of PCI-X just as "long PCI" or only-a-bit-faster-than
PCI.


you think wrong.
...
PCI-X is A LOT faster than PCI, faster than PCIE 1x, 2x



Ooops.


Hi Volker,

My apologies for posting misleadingly & my thanks to you for
correcting my embarrassingly-incorrect understanding.


I think I must've misread "64-bit PCI" for PCI-X on this table when I
was doing my homework a few weeks ago:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_device_bandwidths#Computer_buses


Looking at the 3ware / AMCC high-end RAID controller cards (which are
excellently supported under Linux) I find that the manufacturer seems
to currently be abandoning PCI-X for PCIe. Why is this, in the case?



I also read that:
... while standard PCI-X (133 MHz 64 bit) and PCIe x4 have roughly
the same data transfer rate, PCIe x4 will give better performance
if multiple device pairs are communicating simultaneously or if
communication within a single device pair is bidirectional.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI_Express#Overview>

I'd guess that few motherboards have many PCIe x4 and x8 slots, and -
apart from graphics cards - few devices utilise them fully. Don't you
think, however, that this is likely to become a lot more common in
the next couple of years? Are manufacturers currently announcing
brand new products based on PCI-X?


Stroller.
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Old 02-15-2008, 10:58 PM
Mark Kirkwood
 
Default Looking for PCI-X external SATA controller

Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:



PCI = 133mb/sec theoretical. 100mb with a good chipset (ie not nforce).
PCIE = 250mb/sec theoretical




I think 64-bit 66Mhz PCI will actually do 526Mb/s theoretical maximum
... I can achieve 220Mb/s real I/O bandwidth (4 disk array) on my gear
here. (old Supermicro P4TDER).


Cheers

Mark
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