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Old 05-19-2010, 07:59 PM
Fabian Köster
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

Hi *,

I am currently trying to use Phonon and PulseAudio and have the following
problem:

When I play some Video with a Non-KDE application like VLC everything is
perfectly directed to the local PulseAudio running on my machine and i have
the expected sound-output.

But when I use a KDE-Application like Kaffeine or Amarok there is no sound
output although the stream is listed by pavucontrol. The volume-indicator for
the stream does not show any activity.

Does anybody have an idea what is causing this misbehavior? Or any hint on
debugging this? When I run pulseaudio -vvv I cannot see any suspicious output
(see below)

Thanks in advance,
Fabian


=== My setup ===

media-sound/pulseaudio-0.9.21.1 was built with the following:
USE="X alsa asyncns avahi bluetooth caps dbus glib ipv6 tcpd udev -doc -gnome
-hal -jack -libsamplerate -lirc (-oss) (-system-wide) -test"

kde-base/phonon-kde-4.4.3 was built with the following:
USE="alsa xine (-aqua) -debug (-kdeenablefinal) (-kdeprefix)"

media-sound/phonon-4.4.1 was built with the following:
USE="alsa pulseaudio xcb xine (-aqua) -debug -gstreamer"

== Output of pulseaudio -vvv when Kaffeine starts playing ===

I: client.c: Created 2 "Native client (UNIX socket client)"
D: protocol-native.c: Protocol version: remote 16, local 16
I: protocol-native.c: Got credentials: uid=1000 gid=100 success=1
D: protocol-native.c: SHM possible: yes
D: protocol-native.c: Negotiated SHM: yes
D: module-augment-properties.c: Looking for .desktop file for kaffeine
I: client.c: Freed 2 "libphonon-probe"
I: protocol-native.c: Connection died.
I: client.c: Created 3 "Native client (UNIX socket client)"
I: client.c: Created 4 "Native client (UNIX socket client)"
D: protocol-native.c: Protocol version: remote 16, local 16
I: protocol-native.c: Got credentials: uid=1000 gid=100 success=1
D: protocol-native.c: SHM possible: yes
D: protocol-native.c: Negotiated SHM: yes
D: module-augment-properties.c: Looking for .desktop file for kaffeine
D: protocol-native.c: Protocol version: remote 16, local 16
I: protocol-native.c: Got credentials: uid=1000 gid=100 success=1
D: protocol-native.c: SHM possible: yes
D: protocol-native.c: Negotiated SHM: yes
D: module-augment-properties.c: Looking for .desktop file for kaffeine
I: module-stream-restore.c: Restoring volume for sink input sink-input-by-
media-role:video.
D: sink.c: Suspend cause of sink alsa_output.pci-0000_00_1b.0.analog-stereo is
0x0000, resuming
D: reserve-wrap.c: Successfully acquired reservation lock on device 'Audio0'
I: alsa-sink.c: Trying resume...
D: alsa-util.c: Maximum hw buffer size is 371 ms
D: alsa-util.c: Set buffer size first (to 16384 samples), period size second (to
8192 samples).
D: alsa-sink.c: hwbuf_unused=0
D: alsa-sink.c: setting avail_min=15502
I: alsa-sink.c: Resumed successfully...
I: alsa-sink.c: Starting playback.
D: alsa-sink.c: Cutting sleep time for the initial iterations by half.
D: module-suspend-on-idle.c: Sink alsa_output.pci-0000_00_1b.0.analog-stereo
becomes idle, timeout in 5 seconds.
D: alsa-sink.c: Cutting sleep time for the initial iterations by half.
D: alsa-sink.c: Cutting sleep time for the initial iterations by half.
D: module-suspend-on-idle.c: Sink alsa_output.pci-0000_00_1b.0.analog-stereo
becomes busy.
I: resampler.c: Using resampler 'speex-float-3'
I: resampler.c: Using float32le as working format.
I: resampler.c: Choosing speex quality setting 3.
D: memblockq.c: memblockq requested: maxlength=33554432, tlength=0, base=4,
prebuf=0, minreq=1 maxrewind=0
D: memblockq.c: memblockq sanitized: maxlength=33554432, tlength=33554432,
base=4, prebuf=0, minreq=4 maxrewind=0
I: sink-input.c: Created input 0 "Audio Stream" on
alsa_output.pci-0000_00_1b.0.analog-stereo with sample spec s16le 2ch 48000Hz
and channel map front-left,front-right
I: sink-input.c: media.name = "Audio Stream"
I: sink-input.c: application.name = "kaffeine"
I: sink-input.c: native-protocol.peer = "UNIX socket client"
I: sink-input.c: native-protocol.version = "16"
I: sink-input.c: media.role = "video"
I: sink-input.c: phonon.streamid =
"{1d2615a1-66ea-43cd-879a-754656791fa3}"
I: sink-input.c: application.process.id = "22783"
I: sink-input.c: application.process.user = "fabian"
I: sink-input.c: application.process.host = "fkoest-nb"
I: sink-input.c: application.process.binary = "kaffeine"
I: sink-input.c: application.language = "de_DE.UTF-8"
I: sink-input.c: window.x11.display = ":0.0"
I: sink-input.c: application.process.machine_id =
"3e11ad7a09a7286cfb0063054bba5809"
I: sink-input.c: application.process.session_id =
"3e11ad7a09a7286cfb0063054bba5809-1274289751.605749-741466757"
I: sink-input.c: module-stream-restore.id = "sink-input-by-media-
role:video"
I: protocol-native.c: Requested tlength=250,00 ms, minreq=20,00 ms
D: protocol-native.c: Traditional mode enabled, modifying sink usec only for
compat with minreq.
D: alsa-sink.c: Cutting sleep time for the initial iterations by half.
D: alsa-sink.c: Cutting sleep time for the initial iterations by half.
D: memblockq.c: memblockq requested: maxlength=4194304, tlength=48000, base=4,
prebuf=44164, minreq=3840 maxrewind=0
D: memblockq.c: memblockq sanitized: maxlength=4194304, tlength=48000, base=4,
prebuf=44164, minreq=3840 maxrewind=0
I: protocol-native.c: Final latency 460,00 ms = 210,00 ms + 2*20,00 ms +
210,00 ms
D: alsa-sink.c: Requested volume: 0: 100% 1: 100%
D: alsa-sink.c: Got hardware volume: 0: 100% 1: 100%
D: alsa-sink.c: Calculated software volume: 0: 100% 1: 100% (accurate-
enough=yes)
D: alsa-sink.c: Cutting sleep time for the initial iterations by half.
D: alsa-sink.c: Latency set to 210,00ms
D: alsa-sink.c: hwbuf_unused=28492
D: alsa-sink.c: setting avail_min=15503
D: alsa-sink.c: Requesting rewind due to latency change.
D: alsa-sink.c: Requested to rewind 65536 bytes.
D: alsa-sink.c: Limited to 61496 bytes.
D: alsa-sink.c: before: 15374
D: alsa-sink.c: after: 15374
D: alsa-sink.c: Rewound 61496 bytes.
D: sink.c: Processing rewind...
D: sink-input.c: Have to rewind 61496 bytes on render memblockq.
D: source.c: Processing rewind...
D: core-subscribe.c: Dropped redundant event due to change event.
D: reserve-wrap.c: Device lock status of reserve-monitor-wrapper@Audio0
changed: not busy
D: protocol-native.c: Requesting rewind due to end of underrun.
D: alsa-sink.c: Requested to rewind 65536 bytes.
D: alsa-sink.c: Limited to 32684 bytes.
D: alsa-sink.c: before: 8171
D: alsa-sink.c: after: 8171
D: alsa-sink.c: Rewound 32684 bytes.
D: sink.c: Processing rewind...
D: sink-input.c: Have to rewind 32684 bytes on render memblockq.
D: source.c: Processing rewind...
 
Old 05-19-2010, 09:56 PM
walt
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

On 05/19/2010 12:59 PM, Fabian Köster wrote:

Hi *,

I am currently trying to use Phonon and PulseAudio and have the following
problem:

When I play some Video with a Non-KDE application like VLC everything is
perfectly directed to the local PulseAudio running on my machine and i have
the expected sound-output.

But when I use a KDE-Application like Kaffeine or Amarok there is no sound
output although the stream is listed by pavucontrol...


Well, since I'm first to answer I get to inject my prejudices first

I think pulse is a very long answer to a very short question and so I did
away with it months ago. And I haven't regretted it.

Truly, I think very few people need pulse outside of professionals who work
in film or music. The main reason others have disagreed with my opinion is
because your silly desktop sounds like beeps and boings and toilets flushing
interrupt the CD you're listening to. Uh, well, yeah, one sound generally
interrupts another, true. So what?

I'll bet your audio would do what you expect it to do if you just removed
every trace of pulse from your machine and run revdep-rebuild with the pulse,
arts, and esd useflags disabled (if those flags still exist).

Contrary opinions will follow shortly

Now
 
Old 05-20-2010, 08:15 AM
Alan McKinnon
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

On Wednesday 19 May 2010 23:56:39 walt wrote:
> On 05/19/2010 12:59 PM, Fabian Köster wrote:
> > Hi *,
> >
> > I am currently trying to use Phonon and PulseAudio and have the following
> > problem:
> >
> > When I play some Video with a Non-KDE application like VLC everything is
> > perfectly directed to the local PulseAudio running on my machine and i
> > have the expected sound-output.
> >
> > But when I use a KDE-Application like Kaffeine or Amarok there is no
> > sound output although the stream is listed by pavucontrol...
>
> Well, since I'm first to answer I get to inject my prejudices first
>
> I think pulse is a very long answer to a very short question and so I did
> away with it months ago. And I haven't regretted it.
>
> Truly, I think very few people need pulse outside of professionals who work
> in film or music. The main reason others have disagreed with my opinion is
> because your silly desktop sounds like beeps and boings and toilets
> flushing interrupt the CD you're listening to. Uh, well, yeah, one sound
> generally interrupts another, true. So what?
>
> I'll bet your audio would do what you expect it to do if you just removed
> every trace of pulse from your machine and run revdep-rebuild with the
> pulse, arts, and esd useflags disabled (if those flags still exist).
>
> Contrary opinions will follow shortly


No, I don't think they will :-)

--
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
 
Old 05-20-2010, 08:40 AM
Nikos Chantziaras
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

On 05/20/2010 11:15 AM, Alan McKinnon wrote:

On Wednesday 19 May 2010 23:56:39 walt wrote:

On 05/19/2010 12:59 PM, Fabian Köster wrote:

Hi *,

I am currently trying to use Phonon and PulseAudio and have the following
problem:

When I play some Video with a Non-KDE application like VLC everything is
perfectly directed to the local PulseAudio running on my machine and i
have the expected sound-output.

But when I use a KDE-Application like Kaffeine or Amarok there is no
sound output although the stream is listed by pavucontrol...


Well, since I'm first to answer I get to inject my prejudices first

I think pulse is a very long answer to a very short question and so I did
away with it months ago. And I haven't regretted it.

Truly, I think very few people need pulse outside of professionals who work
in film or music. The main reason others have disagreed with my opinion is
because your silly desktop sounds like beeps and boings and toilets
flushing interrupt the CD you're listening to. Uh, well, yeah, one sound
generally interrupts another, true. So what?

I'll bet your audio would do what you expect it to do if you just removed
every trace of pulse from your machine and run revdep-rebuild with the
pulse, arts, and esd useflags disabled (if those flags still exist).

Contrary opinions will follow shortly


No, I don't think they will :-)


Well, here is one :P

"Uh, well, yeah, one sound generally interrupts another, true."

That is not true. ALSA (most people use that one) has dmix, which mixes
all sounds from all applications together. You don't need PulseAudio
for that.
 
Old 05-20-2010, 09:10 AM
Fabian Köster
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

> I think pulse is a very long answer to a very short question and so I did
> away with it months ago. And I haven't regretted it.
>
> Truly, I think very few people need pulse outside of professionals who work
> in film or music. The main reason others have disagreed with my opinion is
> because your silly desktop sounds like beeps and boings and toilets
> flushing interrupt the CD you're listening to. Uh, well, yeah, one sound
> generally interrupts another, true. So what?
>
> I'll bet your audio would do what you expect it to do if you just removed
> every trace of pulse from your machine and run revdep-rebuild with the
> pulse, arts, and esd useflags disabled (if those flags still exist).
>
> Contrary opinions will follow shortly

ok.. the reason why I use PulseAudio at all is because I need sound forwarding
over network. I have an IGEPv2 board which is connected using USB-sound to my
amplifier. This works fine by the way, but not using KDE applications..
 
Old 05-20-2010, 11:13 AM
Alan McKinnon
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

On Thursday 20 May 2010 10:40:33 Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
> On 05/20/2010 11:15 AM, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> > On Wednesday 19 May 2010 23:56:39 walt wrote:


[snip]

> >> Well, since I'm first to answer I get to inject my prejudices first
> >>
> >> I think pulse is a very long answer to a very short question and so I
> >> did away with it months ago. And I haven't regretted it.
> >>
> >> Truly, I think very few people need pulse outside of professionals who
> >> work in film or music. The main reason others have disagreed with my
> >> opinion is because your silly desktop sounds like beeps and boings and
> >> toilets flushing interrupt the CD you're listening to. Uh, well, yeah,
> >> one sound generally interrupts another, true. So what?
> >>
> >> I'll bet your audio would do what you expect it to do if you just
> >> removed every trace of pulse from your machine and run revdep-rebuild
> >> with the pulse, arts, and esd useflags disabled (if those flags still
> >> exist).
> >>
> >> Contrary opinions will follow shortly
> >
> > No, I don't think they will :-)
>
> Well, here is one :P
>
> "Uh, well, yeah, one sound generally interrupts another, true."
>
> That is not true. ALSA (most people use that one) has dmix, which mixes
> all sounds from all applications together. You don't need PulseAudio
> for that.

PulseAudio does indeed have it's uses. Some folks really do want fine-grained
control over each daemon using the sound system, but those folks are not the
set of average users.

Feature-wise, ALSA pretty much does everything the *average* user wants, and
that user does not really want to schlepp sound over the network or tweak
every individual thing making noises.

Now ALSA may or may not have good-quality code in it but that's another
matter. We are discussing features.

Like an earlier poster suggested, PulseAudio looks like a hammer in search of
a nail.

--
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
 
Old 05-20-2010, 05:30 PM
Canek Peláez Valdés
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 6:13 AM, Alan McKinnon <alan.mckinnon@gmail.com> wrote:
[snip]
> Like an earlier poster suggested, PulseAudio looks like a hammer in search of
> a nail.

I have a bluetooth headset. I set it up with gnome-bluetooth, and with
PulseAudio I can dynamically redirect the output in my laptop from the
speakers to the headset and back; it also redirects it automatically
when my headset gets disconnected or runs out of battery.

Good luck doing that with ALSA.

PulseAudio is here to stay, and for a very good reason I say. It's not
"too complicated" or "overkill"; a modern sound architecture for
desktop computers was in dire need for Linux, and PulseAudio was the
first complete and (more important) correct designed solution. Don't
even mention OSS4; the sound architecture goes in user space, not the
kernel.

This is why *ALL* the Linux based mobile phones use PulseAudio: it
*works*, and it *makes sense* from a technical point of view. It
sucked for a long time? Indeed it did; just like KDE 4.0 sucked
immediately afer KDE 3.5; just like X.org sucked at the very
beginning; just like ALSA sucked when it replaced OSS; just like GNOME
2.0 sucked. Innovation is expensive.

I have PulseAudio running perfectly in my laptop, my desktop, *and* my
MediaCenter connected to my 5.1 system. Via HDMI, by the way. I thank
for PulseAudio; now, after the initial (and very annoying) problems,
it works, it doesn't get in the way, and it's flexible enough to adapt
to new hardware and new sound solutions. Bluetooth headsets it's just
one example (but a very good one I believe; everything is going
wireless); there are USB sound cards, transparently output the music
from my laptop to my MediaCenter, and, of course, little beeps from
the GUI when I click a menu item.

I repeat: PulseAudio is here to stay. You can purge it out of your
system, but more and more applications will make use of it, and
eventually you will not be able to have a desktop without it. Right
now it works flawlessly in the majority of hardware; I highly
recommend to start using it now (it's stable in Gentoo since a couple
of months ago, I believe); and better get used to it.

Because it's not going anywhere.
--
Canek Peláez Valdés
Instituto de Matemáticas
Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
 
Old 05-20-2010, 05:57 PM
Nikos Chantziaras
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

On 05/20/2010 08:30 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:

Don't
even mention OSS4; the sound architecture goes in user space, not the
kernel.


I don't care where they go (why the hell should I?), for as long as they
work.
 
Old 05-20-2010, 06:44 PM
Canek Peláez Valdés
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 12:57 PM, Nikos Chantziaras <realnc@arcor.de> wrote:
> On 05/20/2010 08:30 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>>
>> *Don't
>> even mention OSS4; the sound architecture goes in user space, not the
>> kernel.
>
> I don't care where they go (why the hell should I?), for as long as they
> work.

You should care, because if it breaks inside the kernel, it probably
takes away the whole operating system. And then you lose work and
you're sad.

But don't take my word for it; Intel+Nokia are using PulseAudio in
MeeGo, and Google it's doing the same with Android. They are making an
opinion with their wallets.

(And doesn't really matters, but I haven't heard that it's possible to
switch audio from internal speakers to bluetooth headset with OSS4, so
as far as I'm concerned, it doesn't work.)

Regards.
--
Canek Peláez Valdés
Instituto de Matemáticas
Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
 
Old 05-20-2010, 06:45 PM
Canek Peláez Valdés
 
Default Phonon + PulseAudio Problem

On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés <caneko@gmail.com> wrote:
[snip
> (And doesn't really matters, but I haven't heard that it's possible to
> switch audio from internal speakers to bluetooth headset with OSS4, so
> as far as I'm concerned, it doesn't work.)

With just a few clicks, I should add.

Regards.
--
Canek Peláez Valdés
Instituto de Matemáticas
Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
 

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