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Old 02-11-2010, 02:05 PM
Volker Armin Hemmann
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Dale wrote:
> chrome://messenger/locale/messengercompose/composeMsgs.properties:
> > On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> >> On Thursday 11 February 2010 13:50:54 Walter Dnes wrote:
> >>> On Thu, Feb 11, 2010 at 01:31:26AM +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote
> >>>
> >>>> On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Roy Wright wrote:
> >>>>> IMO, mandatory semantic-desktop is a very good reason to find another
> >>>>> desktop manager (even after being my primary desktop for 7 years).
> >>>>
> >>>> yeah good luck with that. Because gnome is moving in that direction
> >>>> too.
> >>>>
> >>> There are other desktops besides GNOME and KDE. Actually I prefer
> >>> the
> >>>
> >>> ICEWM window manager. I was running a 1999 Dell 450mhz PIII with 128
> >>> megs of *SYSTEM* ram until the summer of 2007. Let's just say that
> >>> GNOME and KDE were out of the question for me. On my current desktop,
> >>> ICEWM flies. But I also have a netbook, and again GNOME and KDE are
> >>> not usable.
> >>>
> >>>> Seriously guys, you start sounding like luddites. Is new, must be bad.
> >>>>
> >>> Correction, is fat, bloated, and slow, must be bad. I wonder if
> >>>
> >>> Microsoft's anti-linux strategy is to have its agents infiltrate the
> >>> linux developer community, and turn linux into bloatware.
> >>
> >> You have been corrected on this point so many times I now think you are
> >> just a stupid ass.
> >>
> >> It is not slow.
> >>
> >> You are the only one saying that. People who do use Nepomuk say that it
> >> is not slow and does not hog resources (initial scan excepted).
> >
> > you can even tell nepomuk how much memory it is allowed to use ...
>
> Can you nice the thing too? That would work. I set emerge to 5 and I
> can't even tell that emerge is running most of the time. There may be
> times when I can but it is rare.
>
> I just don't get this thing that indexing is a resource hog. I notice
> updatedb running at night. I have 329Gbs of "data" and updatedb only
> takes a few minutes. How is that a resource "hog"? My machine is not
> as old as some but it is slow going by the new machines that are out
> now. It's a AMD 2500+ with 2Gbs of ram. I have had Linux on machines
> as slow as 133MHz but never felt the need to disable indexing.
>

when updatedb runs your cache is shot afterwards. That is a known problems.

Nepomuk is only noticable once: the first indexing run. After that it creates
zero load.
 
Old 02-11-2010, 02:21 PM
Mike Edenfield
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

On 2/11/2010 7:00 AM, Walter Dnes wrote:


And if I really wanted a glitzy, bloated,
slow-as-molasses, pointy-clicky-touchy-feely-oowee-GUI, I would've
stayed with Windows, thank you. I started with Blckbox and am now on
ICEWM.


So, to summarize:

* You don't like modern desktop environment design philosophy
* You have no need for all of the convenience and productivity
enhancements they provide

* You are perfectly happy to use your previous window manager
* Your previous window manager continues to work well for you and do
everything you require from a window manager,


and,

* You just really like to complain about things.

--Mike
 
Old 02-11-2010, 02:51 PM
Dale
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

chrome://messenger/locale/messengercompose/composeMsgs.properties:

On Thursday 11 February 2010 16:32:02 Dale wrote:



Can you nice the thing too? That would work. I set emerge to 5 and I
can't even tell that emerge is running most of the time. There may be
times when I can but it is rare.

I just don't get this thing that indexing is a resource hog. I notice
updatedb running at night. I have 329Gbs of "data" and updatedb only
takes a few minutes. How is that a resource "hog"? My machine is not
as old as some but it is slow going by the new machines that are out
now. It's a AMD 2500+ with 2Gbs of ram. I have had Linux on machines
as slow as 133MHz but never felt the need to disable indexing.



No need for any of that.

Walter is just being a prick, talking out of a hole in his arse with the some
total of "truth = 0"

Apologies for the French. I cannot resist. Dimwits annoy me greatly.




Maybe he is trying to run Linux on a Vic-20? I think it was a blazing
4MHz or something like that. Seriously tho, the slowest rig I had Linux
on was 133MHz. It had some really old slow drives in it, something like
15MBs/sec, and I never saw the need to disable updatedb or other
indexing software. It just doesn't use that much.


Anything made in the last few years should be able to handle that with
no problems. Heck, my 6 year old rig does fine.


Dale

:-) :-)
 
Old 02-11-2010, 04:02 PM
Neil Bothwick
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

On Thu, 11 Feb 2010 07:00:27 -0500, Walter Dnes wrote:

> Yes, I can organize my files to the point where I rarely ever use
> find. Just because you can't, is not a reason to slow down everybody
> else's desktop.

Is this ignorance or FUD?

It must be FUD because it has already been stated countless times in this
thread that this service can be switched off.


--
Neil Bothwick

I typed Format SER: and accidentally killed a telephone operator!
 
Old 02-11-2010, 07:55 PM
Roy Wright
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

On Feb 11, 2010, at 11:02 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:

> On Thu, 11 Feb 2010 07:00:27 -0500, Walter Dnes wrote:
>
>> Yes, I can organize my files to the point where I rarely ever use
>> find. Just because you can't, is not a reason to slow down everybody
>> else's desktop.
>
> Is this ignorance or FUD?
>
> It must be FUD because it has already been stated countless times in this
> thread that this service can be switched off.

Just to come full circle, the thread started because the kmail is now requiring the semantic-desktop USE flag. So the consensus seems to be that if you use kmail, then you have to compile the semantic desktop features, then go back and turn off using the semantic desktop.
 
Old 02-11-2010, 08:35 PM
"Zeerak Waseem"
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

On Thu, 11 Feb 2010 21:55:23 +0100, Roy Wright <roy@wright.org> wrote:



On Feb 11, 2010, at 11:02 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:


On Thu, 11 Feb 2010 07:00:27 -0500, Walter Dnes wrote:


Yes, I can organize my files to the point where I rarely ever use
find. Just because you can't, is not a reason to slow down everybody
else's desktop.


Is this ignorance or FUD?

It must be FUD because it has already been stated countless times in
this

thread that this service can be switched off.


Just to come full circle, the thread started because the kmail is now
requiring the semantic-desktop USE flag. So the consensus seems to be
that if you use kmail, then you have to compile the semantic desktop
features, then go back and turn off using the semantic desktop.





Agreed, this thead seems to have been blown out of proportion really.
One thing is if you install a fullblown DE, then having semantic-desktop
is fine, it's also fine that the DE forces you to build it, being that it
can be turned off. However I think that random apps that are a part of the
DE, but can be deselected, shouldn't have to force the users into building
anything that the DE requires. It just seems silly that if you want to use
the newest version of kate, kmail etc. that semantic-desktop is forced
upon you, when you're not interested in having the entire DE.

That's just my take on it anyway.

--
Zeerak
 
Old 02-11-2010, 10:43 PM
Christian Apeltauer
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

Am Thu, 11 Feb 2010 01:18:42 +0000
schrieb Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk>:

> On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 18:03:15 -0600, Roy Wright wrote:
>
> > IMO, mandatory semantic-desktop is a very good reason to find
> > another desktop manager (even after being my primary desktop for 7
> > years).
>
> It's so mandatory it takes a whole mouse click to turn it off
>
>

If you do not want a piece of software, why should you install it?
Installing and not using it instead of not installing it at all, is the
wrong way and (to my opinion) it is defintely not the Gentoo way.
Well, I have drawn the conclusions and got rid of kmail and am on the
verge of migrating the whole desktop. I loved kde-3.5, I seriously
tried kde-4.*, but I could never befriend with it. And one point I
detaste is that "Social Semantic Desktop" thing (as Nepomuk is
characterized on its afore mentioned wikipedia page). For me it is just
another instance of what Kant called "selbstverschuldete
Unmündigkeit" (self-incurred immaturity).
 
Old 02-11-2010, 10:49 PM
Volker Armin Hemmann
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

On Freitag 12 Februar 2010, Christian Apeltauer wrote:
> Am Thu, 11 Feb 2010 01:18:42 +0000
>
> schrieb Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk>:
> > On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 18:03:15 -0600, Roy Wright wrote:
> > > IMO, mandatory semantic-desktop is a very good reason to find
> > > another desktop manager (even after being my primary desktop for 7
> > > years).
> >
> > It's so mandatory it takes a whole mouse click to turn it off
>
> If you do not want a piece of software, why should you install it?
> Installing and not using it instead of not installing it at all, is the
> wrong way and (to my opinion) it is defintely not the Gentoo way.
> Well, I have drawn the conclusions and got rid of kmail and am on the
> verge of migrating the whole desktop. I loved kde-3.5, I seriously
> tried kde-4.*, but I could never befriend with it. And one point I
> detaste is that "Social Semantic Desktop" thing (as Nepomuk is
> characterized on its afore mentioned wikipedia page). For me it is just
> another instance of what Kant called "selbstverschuldete
> Unmündigkeit" (self-incurred immaturity).

sure. Be able to tag and quickly find information is immature.

Question, when you have KDE installed and some app pulls in gconf or gvfs - do
you throw the same temper tamtrum?
 
Old 02-11-2010, 11:07 PM
Dale
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

chrome://messenger/locale/messengercompose/composeMsgs.properties:

On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Dale wrote:


chrome://messenger/locale/messengercompose/composeMsgs.properties:


On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Alan McKinnon wrote:


On Thursday 11 February 2010 13:50:54 Walter Dnes wrote:


On Thu, Feb 11, 2010 at 01:31:26AM +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote



On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Roy Wright wrote:


IMO, mandatory semantic-desktop is a very good reason to find another
desktop manager (even after being my primary desktop for 7 years).


yeah good luck with that. Because gnome is moving in that direction
too.



There are other desktops besides GNOME and KDE. Actually I prefer
the

ICEWM window manager. I was running a 1999 Dell 450mhz PIII with 128
megs of *SYSTEM* ram until the summer of 2007. Let's just say that
GNOME and KDE were out of the question for me. On my current desktop,
ICEWM flies. But I also have a netbook, and again GNOME and KDE are
not usable.



Seriously guys, you start sounding like luddites. Is new, must be bad.



Correction, is fat, bloated, and slow, must be bad. I wonder if

Microsoft's anti-linux strategy is to have its agents infiltrate the
linux developer community, and turn linux into bloatware.


You have been corrected on this point so many times I now think you are
just a stupid ass.

It is not slow.

You are the only one saying that. People who do use Nepomuk say that it
is not slow and does not hog resources (initial scan excepted).


you can even tell nepomuk how much memory it is allowed to use ...


Can you nice the thing too? That would work. I set emerge to 5 and I
can't even tell that emerge is running most of the time. There may be
times when I can but it is rare.

I just don't get this thing that indexing is a resource hog. I notice
updatedb running at night. I have 329Gbs of "data" and updatedb only
takes a few minutes. How is that a resource "hog"? My machine is not
as old as some but it is slow going by the new machines that are out
now. It's a AMD 2500+ with 2Gbs of ram. I have had Linux on machines
as slow as 133MHz but never felt the need to disable indexing.



when updatedb runs your cache is shot afterwards. That is a known problems.

Nepomuk is only noticable once: the first indexing run. After that it creates
zero load.




So cache is bad? Heck, my cache is almost always full anyway. Nothing
new there. If it is not updatedb then it will be something else.


Thing is, I can't tell any difference in my cache before, during or
after. I do have 2Gbs of ram here so maybe I just can't see the
difference. I guess I could always wait until 3:10AM and test this
theory tho.


Dale

:-) :-)
 
Old 02-11-2010, 11:27 PM
Volker Armin Hemmann
 
Default Has semantic-desktop really become compulsatory for kmail?

On Freitag 12 Februar 2010, Dale wrote:
> chrome://messenger/locale/messengercompose/composeMsgs.properties:
> > On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Dale wrote:
> >> chrome://messenger/locale/messengercompose/composeMsgs.properties:
> >>> On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> >>>> On Thursday 11 February 2010 13:50:54 Walter Dnes wrote:
> >>>>> On Thu, Feb 11, 2010 at 01:31:26AM +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On Donnerstag 11 Februar 2010, Roy Wright wrote:
> >>>>>>> IMO, mandatory semantic-desktop is a very good reason to find
> >>>>>>> another desktop manager (even after being my primary desktop for 7
> >>>>>>> years).
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> yeah good luck with that. Because gnome is moving in that direction
> >>>>>> too.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> There are other desktops besides GNOME and KDE. Actually I
> >>>>> prefer the
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ICEWM window manager. I was running a 1999 Dell 450mhz PIII with 128
> >>>>> megs of *SYSTEM* ram until the summer of 2007. Let's just say that
> >>>>> GNOME and KDE were out of the question for me. On my current
> >>>>> desktop, ICEWM flies. But I also have a netbook, and again GNOME
> >>>>> and KDE are not usable.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Seriously guys, you start sounding like luddites. Is new, must be
> >>>>>> bad.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> Correction, is fat, bloated, and slow, must be bad. I wonder if
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Microsoft's anti-linux strategy is to have its agents infiltrate the
> >>>>> linux developer community, and turn linux into bloatware.
> >>>>
> >>>> You have been corrected on this point so many times I now think you
> >>>> are just a stupid ass.
> >>>>
> >>>> It is not slow.
> >>>>
> >>>> You are the only one saying that. People who do use Nepomuk say that
> >>>> it is not slow and does not hog resources (initial scan excepted).
> >>>
> >>> you can even tell nepomuk how much memory it is allowed to use ...
> >>
> >> Can you nice the thing too? That would work. I set emerge to 5 and I
> >> can't even tell that emerge is running most of the time. There may be
> >> times when I can but it is rare.
> >>
> >> I just don't get this thing that indexing is a resource hog. I notice
> >> updatedb running at night. I have 329Gbs of "data" and updatedb only
> >> takes a few minutes. How is that a resource "hog"? My machine is not
> >> as old as some but it is slow going by the new machines that are out
> >> now. It's a AMD 2500+ with 2Gbs of ram. I have had Linux on machines
> >> as slow as 133MHz but never felt the need to disable indexing.
> >
> > when updatedb runs your cache is shot afterwards. That is a known
> > problems.
> >
> > Nepomuk is only noticable once: the first indexing run. After that it
> > creates zero load.
>
> So cache is bad? Heck, my cache is almost always full anyway. Nothing
> new there. If it is not updatedb then it will be something else.

no, cahce is great. That is the problem. Updatedb replaces the cached files
with stuff you probably don't care about. Which is bad.
 

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