FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
» Video Reviews

» Linux Archive

Linux-archive is a website aiming to archive linux email lists and to make them easily accessible for linux users/developers.


» Sponsor

» Partners

» Sponsor

Go Back   Linux Archive > Gentoo > Gentoo User

 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
 
Old 08-28-2008, 09:30 PM
James
 
Default KDE 4.1...

Alan McKinnon <alan.mckinnon <at> gmail.com> writes:


> It's far from fixed here. Admittedly better than 173.*, but the vast majority
> of work remains to be done:

What ever happened to all of those folks that said Nvidia is the
superior video vendor?

I took quite a beating (on this list) for backing/promoting ATI,
because I believe that AMD would do the right thing for the Linux
community.


Apologies accepted (in advance) from all of those Nvidia pundits.


AMD (and now ATI) rules..... methinks



James
 
Old 08-28-2008, 10:01 PM
Volker Armin Hemmann
 
Default KDE 4.1...

On Donnerstag, 28. August 2008, James wrote:
> Alan McKinnon <alan.mckinnon <at> gmail.com> writes:
> > It's far from fixed here. Admittedly better than 173.*, but the vast
> > majority of work remains to be done:
>
> What ever happened to all of those folks that said Nvidia is the
> superior video vendor?

once upon a time that was true.

and some people say that the new beta drivers rock. I can't check it myself -
I sold my nvidia card and bought ati.

>
>
> Apologies accepted (in advance) from all of those Nvidia pundits.

I want to apologise if I ever bashed you.

>
>
> AMD (and now ATI) rules..... methinks

their binary drivers are so-so. But their open source driver initiative is
great.
 
Old 08-29-2008, 12:57 AM
James
 
Default KDE 4.1...

Volker Armin Hemmann <volker.armin.hemmann <at> tu-clausthal.de> writes:


> I want to apologise if I ever bashed you.

Nope and it does not matter, I never remember those things anyway.

> > AMD (and now ATI) rules..... methinks

> their binary drivers are so-so. But their open source driver initiative is
> great.

If you follow AMD, they 'get it'. I have had high hopes for ATI once AMD
took over. Patiences is difficult, but, I believe that AMD (ATI)
will do the Linux community right, particularly if they want
to keep selling hardware to us when Intel has a (current) technical
advantage.


Intel is the other sleeper. With the best physics (smallest processes)
it's only a matter of time before they have a graphic chip, that can be
put on the same substrate as the CPU and they'll be competitive,
particularly from a price point perspective.

The real battle is who's GPU becomes the easiest processor to use with the
cisc/risc processors as a generic part of the OS.

We'll just have to wait on this, but, my money is on AMD, because
they're more likely to do something cool for the greater Linux
community than Intel, imho.

Nvidia, without a CPU partner, is dying on the vine, as we speak.
Look for their stock to plung, if they do not find a (CPU) company to
buy and soon. They should have picked up the PPC before Apple ditched
it for Intel, imho.

cheers!
James
 
Old 08-29-2008, 06:23 AM
Alan McKinnon
 
Default KDE 4.1...

On Thursday 28 August 2008 23:30:54 James wrote:
> Alan McKinnon <alan.mckinnon <at> gmail.com> writes:
> > It's far from fixed here. Admittedly better than 173.*, but the vast
> > majority of work remains to be done:
>
> What ever happened to all of those folks that said Nvidia is the
> superior video vendor?

That used to be true, and nVidia historically did have the better performance
and support. But two things have changed:

The newer GPUs (starting with 8xxx and 9xxx series) do not have 2D
acceleration in hardware anymore, it's all done in the driver. Some Linux apps
and especially KDE4 use X technologies in ways that nVidia's driver is not
especially good at. Remember that the Linux driver is essentially a port of
the logic in the Windows driver together with the guts of OpenGL ripped out of
X and replaced with nVidia's stuff, this leads to a bit of an oops. nVidia is
actively working on the problem with reasonably frequent beta driver releases,
but it certainly appears to be way more deep rooted and trickier to handle
than it might appear.

If they could just open source the drivers, then an entire army of coders
would step in and help devise good code that runs well. But they don't, so
nVidia is stuck with the 2 maybe 3 people they have on the Linux port.

And there's also the fiasco with the construction of apparently their entire
line of recent GPUs. They don't react well to thermal stress and are failing
in alarmingly large numbers

> I took quite a beating (on this list) for backing/promoting ATI,
> because I believe that AMD would do the right thing for the Linux
> community.

It appears you were more right than those others were wrong :-)

Thumbs up to AMD for taking the first steps and releasing some decent docs


--
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
 
Old 08-29-2008, 06:27 AM
Alan McKinnon
 
Default KDE 4.1...

On Thursday 28 August 2008 23:25:20 Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
> On Donnerstag, 28. August 2008, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> > On Thursday 28 August 2008 21:03:28 Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:

[snip]

> > > well, it was mostly fixed with their latest beta drivers.
> >
> > You mean 177.68 right?

[snip]

> they released 177.70 today

I wonder what happened at nVidia recently, did their Head of Technical
Research, Planning and Release Schedules die and get replaced with a bot
running OSS? :-)

That's three betas in less than 10 days...

'scuse me, I'm off to emerge --sync

--
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
 
Old 08-29-2008, 07:00 AM
Thomas Kahle
 
Default KDE 4.1...

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi,
as your post turned into the usual kde 4 is good/bad flamewar I will
just try to answer the question:

The people working on the overlay plan to bringt kde 4.1.1(not 4.1.0)
into the tree. This will be released on next week and enter the tree
hopefully shortly after that.

Also this page
http://skrypuch.com/kde4/
and bug http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=234773
might give you an idea of the progress

have fun
Tom

BRM wrote:
| I have been trying to hold out for KDE 4.1 entering the main gentoo
portage tree, and some kind of announcement on the list; however, I
haven't seen any and it's been a while since KDE 4.1 was
released...(longer I think than it took for KDE 4.0.1 to get into the
main portage tree.)
|
| I am not one for wanting to try doing the overlay's yet, so I have
been waiting for it to enter the main portage. I haven't even seen it in
as a hard mask yet.
| So, I just wanted to check to see if there was any known timeline for
when KDE 4.1 might enter the main portage tree, when might it go to the
testing branch?
|
| I'd very much like to try it out when it gets to testing; and just
wanted to get an idea of how long I might still need to wait. (As I
said, I'm not quite up to using the overlay trees yet, of which I've
seen a lot of activity regarding KDE 4.1 per the user's and AMD64 lists.)
|
| Any how...just curious when it will come.
|
| Thanks,
|
| Ben
|

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iEYEARECAAYFAki3npAACgkQrpEWPKIUt7MypgCeOhO17TgLBt/01LPm2jaKsYXh
jT0AoJF8frS/kIFsjtMK73Gt1gR/iIhe
=8+cw
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
 
Old 08-29-2008, 09:46 AM
Dale
 
Default KDE 4.1...

Alan McKinnon wrote:

On Thursday 28 August 2008 23:30:54 James wrote:


Alan McKinnon <alan.mckinnon <at> gmail.com> writes:


It's far from fixed here. Admittedly better than 173.*, but the vast
majority of work remains to be done:


What ever happened to all of those folks that said Nvidia is the
superior video vendor?



That used to be true, and nVidia historically did have the better performance
and support. But two things have changed:


The newer GPUs (starting with 8xxx and 9xxx series) do not have 2D
acceleration in hardware anymore, it's all done in the driver. Some Linux apps
and especially KDE4 use X technologies in ways that nVidia's driver is not
especially good at. Remember that the Linux driver is essentially a port of
the logic in the Windows driver together with the guts of OpenGL ripped out of
X and replaced with nVidia's stuff, this leads to a bit of an oops. nVidia is
actively working on the problem with reasonably frequent beta driver releases,
but it certainly appears to be way more deep rooted and trickier to handle
than it might appear.


If they could just open source the drivers, then an entire army of coders
would step in and help devise good code that runs well. But they don't, so
nVidia is stuck with the 2 maybe 3 people they have on the Linux port.


And there's also the fiasco with the construction of apparently their entire
line of recent GPUs. They don't react well to thermal stress and are failing
in alarmingly large numbers




I took quite a beating (on this list) for backing/promoting ATI,
because I believe that AMD would do the right thing for the Linux
community.



It appears you were more right than those others were wrong :-)

Thumbs up to AMD for taking the first steps and releasing some decent docs





I have not been keeping up with this news about the new Nvidia cards so
let me see if I get this right. I have a old FX-5200 card right now but
if I wanted to get a nice new video card, say a new puter build, then I
should get a ATI card instead?


Also, what is the latest card that has 2D in hardware? Sounds like
things went south not long after I got my 5200.


Dale

:-) :-)
 
Old 08-29-2008, 10:05 AM
Dave Oxley
 
Default KDE 4.1...

Thomas Kahle wrote:

Hi,
as your post turned into the usual kde 4 is good/bad flamewar I will
just try to answer the question:

The people working on the overlay plan to bringt kde 4.1.1(not 4.1.0)
into the tree. This will be released on next week and enter the tree
hopefully shortly after that.

Also this page
http://skrypuch.com/kde4/
and bug http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=234773
might give you an idea of the progress

have fun
Tom
Thanks for the update. Slightly OT and planning ahead slightly, any
ideas how easy it will be to upgrade from the kdesvn-portage overlay to
the official ebuilds?


Cheers,
Dave.
 
Old 08-29-2008, 10:37 AM
Alan McKinnon
 
Default KDE 4.1...

On Friday 29 August 2008 11:46:55 Dale wrote:
> I have not been keeping up with this news about the new Nvidia cards so
> let me see if I get this right. *I have a old FX-5200 card right now but
> if I wanted to get a nice new video card, say a new puter build, then I
> should get a ATI card instead?

Yes. Even if nVidia get the drivers right for their new stuff, there's not
much they can do about the faulty silicon that has already been shipped and is
failing in worrying numbers.

--
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com
 
Old 08-29-2008, 10:45 AM
Dale
 
Default KDE 4.1...

Alan McKinnon wrote:

On Friday 29 August 2008 11:46:55 Dale wrote:


I have not been keeping up with this news about the new Nvidia cards so
let me see if I get this right. I have a old FX-5200 card right now but
if I wanted to get a nice new video card, say a new puter build, then I
should get a ATI card instead?



Yes. Even if nVidia get the drivers right for their new stuff, there's not
much they can do about the faulty silicon that has already been shipped and is
failing in worrying numbers.





< Dale goes to have a good cry > I always liked Nvidia. I have a
couple old cards here. :'(


Dale

:-) :-)
 

Thread Tools




All times are GMT. The time now is 03:16 PM.

VBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO ©2007, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright 2007 - 2008, www.linux-archive.org