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Old 02-27-2013, 05:26 AM
Josť Fournier
 
Default Date problem

Hi everybody,

I am new on your list and I am trying to update the French handbook but
I feel uncomfortable with some aspects in the translation/publication
process. I take an example to illustrate my point.


Consider the file /doc/en/handbook/hb-install-x86+amd64-medium.xml.

According to
http://sources.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/gentoo/xml/htdocs/doc/en/,
the last EN version committed is 1.28, committed 3 months ago.
It is also the one I translated and that Sven nicely committed for me a
few days ago. Till now, everything seems OK.


Nevertheless, going to the Gentoo site and reading the page I can see :
"Page updated on Feb 11, 2013" and for the French counterpart "Last
update 1Nov 12, 2012, an original version dated Feb 11, 2013 exist (in
French on the page of course).


My question is why this discrepancy ? The files are the same, the
version and date tags are identical, but the French user is made
uncomfortable, thinking what he is reading is out of date !
If something newer exists somewhere, not already committed, there should
be the same warning on both pages. Isn't it ? What seems very important
to me, is that the French ( or any non English) reader is made aware
that the French (non English) and English versions of the text match
perfectly, releasing him/she from any doubt. Is there something I missed ?




Thank you in advance for explanation

Best regards

Josť
 
Old 02-27-2013, 12:42 PM
Tobias Heinlein
 
Default Date problem

Hi,

On 27.02.2013 07:26, Josť Fournier wrote:

My question is why this discrepancy ? The files are the same, the
version and date tags are identical [..]


Yes, the version and date tags of the file you mentioned
(hb-install-x86+amd64-medium.xml) are identical. But if you append
"&passthru" to the URL, e.g. :

http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handbook-amd64.xml?part=1&chap=2&passthru

you can see that there are other files involved as well. The XML code
you get there is from doc/en/handbook/handbook-amd64.xml which has
<date>2013-02-11</date>. That's the date the warning talks about.

You get the warning because doc/fr/handbook/handbook-amd64.xml wasn't
updated yet: It has <date>2010-07-19</date>. However, the date displayed
on the french webpage is indeed the date from
doc/fr/handbook/hb-install-x86+amd64-medium.xml. I suppose the date that
appears on the rendered page is the newest one of the dates of all the
files that are involved, thus ensuring that *every* part is updated.

Regards,
Tobias
 
Old 02-27-2013, 02:04 PM
Josť Fournier
 
Default Date problem

On 02/27/13 14:42, Tobias Heinlein wrote:

Hi,

On 27.02.2013 07:26, Josť Fournier wrote:

My question is why this discrepancy ? The files are the same, the
version and date tags are identical [..]


Yes, the version and date tags of the file you mentioned
(hb-install-x86+amd64-medium.xml) are identical. But if you append
"&passthru" to the URL, e.g. :

http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handbook-amd64.xml?part=1&chap=2&passthru



you can see that there are other files involved as well. The XML code
you get there is from doc/en/handbook/handbook-amd64.xml which has
<date>2013-02-11</date>. That's the date the warning talks about.

You get the warning because doc/fr/handbook/handbook-amd64.xml wasn't
updated yet: It has <date>2010-07-19</date>. However, the date displayed
on the french webpage is indeed the date from
doc/fr/handbook/hb-install-x86+amd64-medium.xml. I suppose the date that
appears on the rendered page is the newest one of the dates of all the
files that are involved, thus ensuring that *every* part is updated.

Regards,
Tobias



Hi Tobias,

Thank you very much for answering.
If I understand well what you are saying the warning doesn't work on a
per page basis, but rather on a per book basis.
Despite this I still have trouble understanding the strangeness of the
dates that appear even on my local copy where a larger amount of file is
updated (including doc/fr/handbook/handbook-amd64.xml). I think that
with time I will grasp the mechanism better thanks to your remark.


Whatever it is, this seems to mean that, from the user point of view, it
is impossible to trust a translated page, even important, as long as, a
trivial detail on one page of all the book is not translated. Rather
difficult, if my understanding is good, for a translator to convey
confidence to his readers !


Regards

Josť
 
Old 03-14-2013, 09:57 AM
Josť Fournier
 
Default Date problem

(Sorry for linked words in this mail probably due to a bug in my config)

Hi,

Can somebody tell me how to be allowed to translate pages of the
official wiki ?
I tried but I was told you are not allowed to translate. Clicking the
"request permission" button lead me to a Project:Translator empty page !


Regards

Josť
 
Old 03-14-2013, 06:24 PM
Sven Vermeulen
 
Default Date problem

On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 11:57:35AM +0100, Josť Fournier wrote:
> Can somebody tell me how to be allowed to translate pages of the
> official wiki ?
> I tried but I was told you are not allowed to translate. Clicking the
> "request permission" button lead me to a Project:Translator empty page !

The wiki mentions that you can ask on #gentoo-wiki or through the
wiki@gentoo.org address. I'm not sure if many wiki folks are on the
gentoo-doc mailinglist.

Wkr,
Sven Vermeulen
 

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