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Old 05-30-2008, 10:07 PM
Donnie Berkholz
 
Default RFC: --as-needed to default LDFLAGS (Was: RFC: Should preserve-libs be enabled by default?)

On 22:53 Fri 30 May , Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Sat, 31 May 2008 00:47:44 +0300
> Mart Raudsepp <leio@gentoo.org> wrote:
> > The story that matters here is, that a C++ corner case that does not
> > work on 0.01% of packages with --as-needed and breaks on non-ELF
> > platforms, should not cause good things for our users to be shot down.
>
> You could say the same thing for -ffast-math...

When there's a feature that only breaks one package that we know of,
wouldn't it make more sense to enable it globally and add an exception
than to do it the other way around?

I see that a number of packages in the tree explicitly filter
-ffast-math.

Thanks,
Donnie
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Old 05-31-2008, 06:25 AM
Peter Volkov
 
Default RFC: --as-needed to default LDFLAGS (Was: RFC: Should preserve-libs be enabled by default?)

В Птн, 30/05/2008 в 20:28 -0700, Brian Harring пишет:
> Either way, basically it's coming down to if gentoo wants to follow
> the definition of 'academic' right, or 'pragmatic' right. Exempting
> ciaran, vote seems to be pragmatic.

Well, although I've asked about problems with having --as-needed by
default, I'd better go with academic. C++ is quite common language to
ignore its design problems and in the end it's not hard to define
LDFLAGS in make.conf.

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Peter.

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Old 05-31-2008, 10:35 AM
Luca Barbato
 
Default RFC: --as-needed to default LDFLAGS (Was: RFC: Should preserve-libs be enabled by default?)

Peter Volkov wrote:

В Птн, 30/05/2008 в 20:28 -0700, Brian Harring пишет:
Either way, basically it's coming down to if gentoo wants to follow
the definition of 'academic' right, or 'pragmatic' right. Exempting
ciaran, vote seems to be pragmatic.


Well, although I've asked about problems with having --as-needed by
default, I'd better go with academic. C++ is quite common language to
ignore its design problems and in the end it's not hard to define
LDFLAGS in make.conf.



To clarify:

- static initializers (as in __attribute__((constructor), so no, it
isn't a C++ only feature) have nothing wrong with --as-needed.


- ugly code that refers to undefined symbols that are resolved to ones
from the main binary and written in the constructor is broken already in
systems not allowing undefined refs.


- you don't have guarantees about the order in witch the .init sections
are parsed and constructor function are called, they can be called in
parallel and you have no means to have a predictable behavior, all you
know is that everything will be called right before main() or as the
first thing in dlopen().


- doing such stuff is uncommon since it isn't the simplest thing to do,
doesn't work in every place, you have to be particular perverse and
convoluted even to think about this.


- making such thing go away is good for security, maintainability and
sanity.


lu

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Luca Barbato
Gentoo Council Member
Gentoo/linux Gentoo/PPC
http://dev.gentoo.org/~lu_zero

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