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Old 01-16-2010, 05:52 PM
Peter Hjalmarsson
 
Default layman storage location (again)

lör 2010-01-16 klockan 19:16 +0100 skrev Sebastian Pipping:
> On 01/16/10 05:39, Mike Frysinger wrote:
> > On Friday 15 January 2010 20:55:18 Sebastian Pipping wrote:
> >> On 01/16/10 02:45, Mike Frysinger wrote:
> >>> the better idea
> >>> though would be to split your stuff along the proper lines.
> >>>
> >>> cache files = /var/cache/layman/
> >>
> >> as i said: it's not a "normal" cache.
> >
> > you said but didnt explain why it's "special". these are merely caches of
> > external overlays and xml caches of overlay lists.
>
> to me cache is something that speeds up operation but does not hold
> content of real value. with layman overlay "checkouts" that's a bit
> different. let's say a host overlay is taken offline: now the layman
> copy is my only source. Page [1] describes /var/cache as
> "Long term data which can be regenerated". so to me it's not a cache
> because there might be data in there that we cannot regenerate.
>
>
That is for the overlays, yeah?
But hov about the cache_*.xml files?

I think what he meant was that should layman really only has one
directory? One for cache (downloaded/downloadable lists of overlays?
in /var/cache/layman/?), one for the make.conf and overlay.xml
(/etc/layman/?) and maybe one more directory for the overlays
(/var/lib/layman/?).

That make.conf/overlay.xml may not go as cache, nor do the overlays
themselves, but as I said, should really it all be in the same
directory?
 
Old 01-16-2010, 05:57 PM
Peter Hjalmarsson
 
Default layman storage location (again)

lör 2010-01-16 klockan 19:31 +0100 skrev Jörg Schaible:
> dev-random@mail.ru wrote:
>
> > On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 01:57:38PM +0100, Ben de Groot wrote:
> >> 2010/1/16 Peter Volkov <pva@gentoo.org>:
> >> > layman cache is nfs distributable. Also it's good idea to have it close
> >> > to PORTDIR. Thus I'd like to keep it somewhere at /usr.
> >>
> >> I'd like both to be under /var/
> >>
> >
> > I _use_ both under /var/. In my config PORTDIR_OVERLAY="/var/repos/{many
> > directories}" and PORTDIR="/var/repos/gentoo". /usr/ is too crazy place
> > for ebuilds. IMHO.
>
> Same for me. I have PORTDIR also beneath /var ...
>
> - Jörg
>

Me too. I consider /usr/portage as one of those design flaws/thinkos
that are left behind since noone are ready to take the blame and flames
of all those who do not want to read elog-messages/announces and alike
and want to raise hell if somethings changes they are note prepared for.
 
Old 01-16-2010, 06:38 PM
Michael Higgins
 
Default layman storage location (again)

On Sat, 16 Jan 2010 19:57:39 +0100
Peter Hjalmarsson <xake@rymdraket.net> wrote:

> lör 2010-01-16 klockan 19:31 +0100 skrev Jörg Schaible:
> > dev-random@mail.ru wrote:
> >
> > > On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 01:57:38PM +0100, Ben de Groot wrote:
> > >> 2010/1/16 Peter Volkov <pva@gentoo.org>:
> > >> > layman cache is nfs distributable. Also it's good idea to have
> > >> > it close to PORTDIR. Thus I'd like to keep it somewhere
> > >> > at /usr.
> > >>
> > >> I'd like both to be under /var/
> > >>
> > >
> > > I _use_ both under /var/. In my config
> > > PORTDIR_OVERLAY="/var/repos/{many directories}" and
> > > PORTDIR="/var/repos/gentoo". /usr/ is too crazy place for
> > > ebuilds. IMHO.
> >
> > Same for me. I have PORTDIR also beneath /var ...
> >
> > - Jörg
> >
>
> Me too. I consider /usr/portage as one of those design flaws/thinkos
> that are left behind since noone are ready to take the blame and
> flames of all those who do not want to read elog-messages/announces
> and alike and want to raise hell if somethings changes they are note
> prepared for.
>

Yes, PORTDIR default location under /usr was a totally stupid thing.
Please don't repeat it...

I have all portage under it's own partition, but /var/portage is
probably a more acceptable default, IMO.

--
| /| | | ~ ~
| / | |---| `|` ?
| |ichael | |iggins ^ /
michael.higgins[at]evolone[dot]org
 
Old 01-16-2010, 08:37 PM
Antoni Grzymala
 
Default layman storage location (again)

Ben de Groot dixit (2010-01-16, 00:41):

> 2010/1/15 Dawid Węgliński <cla@gentoo.org>:
> > On Friday 15 January 2010 20:44:43 Alex Legler wrote:
> >> > Â* /var/lib/layman
> >> >
> >> > do well?
> >>
> >> +1
> >>
> > -1, /usr/local/layman?
>
> /usr/local/ is a location the system should avoid. Somewhere in /var/
> seems to be the logical place.

I always thought /usr/portage/local was the logical place. If not, I'd
also say, that /var/layman/<whatever> makes sense.

--
[a]
 
Old 01-16-2010, 08:37 PM
Antoni Grzymala
 
Default layman storage location (again)

Mike Frysinger dixit (2010-01-15, 20:45):

> On Friday 15 January 2010 20:24:38 Sebastian Pipping wrote:
> > On 01/16/10 00:33, Jorge Manuel B. S. Vicetto wrote:
> > > - From the alternatives, /var/lib/layman doesn't sound right. If
> > > /var/cache/layman doesn't work, what about /var/spool/layman instead?
> >
> > Okay, how about
> >
> > /var/spool/layman
> >
> > then? Any objections?
>
> /var/spool/ is a terrible idea -- these are not jobs being queued waiting to
> be processed by a daemon and then removed.
>
> if you want to keep all of layman's stuff together, then about your only
> option is to create your own tree at like /var/layman/. the better idea
> though would be to split your stuff along the proper lines.
>
> cache files = /var/cache/layman/
> config files = /etc/layman/

Layman-added trees are not much different altogether from the main
portage tree. Putting it in a location *totally* unrelated to the main
portage tree is, to put it mildly, *strange*. We still haven't heard in
this thread what was wrong with the original (${PORTDIR}/local/)
location. Despite all the propositions in the thread it still feels like
a best place to me. I'm sure the change to /usr/local/portage has been
discussed elsewhere previously, but maybe a pointer to some older
discussion would be handy.

I'm all for going back to the original location (based on ${PORTDIR}).

Best,

--
[a]
 
Old 01-16-2010, 09:46 PM
Benedikt Böhm
 
Default layman storage location (again)

On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 8:38 PM, Michael Higgins <linux@evolone.org> wrote:
> Yes, PORTDIR default location under /usr was a totally stupid thing.
> Please don't repeat it...

One thing all you /usr naggers forget is, that /var cannot be shared
read-only via nfs (or bind mounts in case of virtual servers). most
single-machine users probably don't care, but there is more out there
than just your workstations. so putting portage into /usr is perfectly
valid. The only thing that violates the FHS is that "Large software
packages must not use a direct subdirectory under the /usr hierarchy."
A location beneath /usr/share probably would have been more compliant.

Anyway, since i'll keep my overlays in /usr/local regardless of the
outcome this thread has, i don't care

Bene
 
Old 01-16-2010, 10:55 PM
Sebastian Pipping
 
Default layman storage location (again)

On 01/16/10 23:46, Benedikt Böhm wrote:
> One thing all you /usr naggers forget is, that /var cannot be shared
> read-only via nfs (or bind mounts in case of virtual servers).

Why is that? Please tell more.



Sebastian
 
Old 01-17-2010, 12:27 AM
Mike Frysinger
 
Default layman storage location (again)

On Saturday 16 January 2010 17:46:08 Benedikt Böhm wrote:
> On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 8:38 PM, Michael Higgins <linux@evolone.org> wrote:
> > Yes, PORTDIR default location under /usr was a totally stupid thing.
> > Please don't repeat it...
>
> One thing all you /usr naggers forget is, that /var cannot be shared
> read-only via nfs (or bind mounts in case of virtual servers). most
> single-machine users probably don't care, but there is more out there
> than just your workstations. so putting portage into /usr is perfectly
> valid.

and good thing there is a config file for you to change it to suite your weird
needs. /var is a better default than /usr here.
-mike
 
Old 01-17-2010, 07:19 AM
Benedikt Böhm
 
Default layman storage location (again)

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 12:55 AM, Sebastian Pipping <sping@gentoo.org> wrote:
> On 01/16/10 23:46, Benedikt Böhm wrote:
>> One thing all you /usr naggers forget is, that /var cannot be shared
>> read-only via nfs (or bind mounts in case of virtual servers).
>
> Why is that? *Please tell more.

Maybe you should actually read the FHS. You can of course share
specific subdirectories of /var read-only and still be compliant, but
/usr is specifically designed to be completely shareable read-only.
 
Old 01-17-2010, 08:01 AM
Ciaran McCreesh
 
Default layman storage location (again)

2010/1/15 Sebastian Pipping <sping@gentoo.org>:
> By default layman currently stores overlays into
>
> */usr/local/portage/layman
>
> (was /usr/portage/local/layman before that).
> As of bug 253725 [1] that's not without problems.
>
> I would like to get it right with the next switch.

I realise this is a lost cause, but... Repositories are databases, so
/var/db/ is your friend.

--
Ciaran McCreesh
 

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