On 08/18/2010 10:20 AM, Elmar Hinz wrote:
> From the windows user point of view I want to come to a small setup
> skript, that fetches all from the net, then compiles and runs it until
> gedit pops up, in our example.
>
> First it downloads a Posix environment, then a minimal Gentoo base
> including a compiler. Than it can starts compiling using emerge and
> prefix. By this cross-compilation would not be necessary for all, but
> only for the minimal startup base.
>
> I don't know the exact steps and time such a skript would need. Before
> digging deeper into it, I wanted to know if it is possible at all and
> if that kind of skript already exists.
Well, for Windows you might be in some luck (thanks to mduft):
What does exist already is (not a script, but) an ISO image (DVD) with some nice
GUI installer, that can set up both Interix and Gentoo Prefix on your Windows box.
You can find it via http://prefix.gentoo.org/bootstrap.xml
/haubi/
--
Michael Haubenwallner
Gentoo on a different level
08-18-2010, 07:19 PM
Peter Abrahamsen
You too? youtoo!
On Aug 18, 2010, at 4:39 AM, Michael Haubenwallner wrote:Well, for Windows you might be in some luck (thanks to mduft):
What does exist already is (not a script, but) an ISO image (DVD) with some nice
GUI installer, that can set up both Interix and Gentoo Prefix on your Windows box.
You can find it viaÂ*http://prefix.gentoo.org/bootstrap.xml
Bootstrapping is about as much fun as standing in line at the post office. If Prefix would like to compete with fink, darwinports, or whatever else people are using on various platforms, then the experience for the first-time user should be as easy as what Elmar describes. I can't think of any reason it shouldn't be that easy–pretty much everyone runs bootstrap-prefix.sh the same way, except when they copy the commands wrong or out of order.
The easiest and most portable approach is to write a shell script that runs the commands in the docs to bootstrap to a given location, wrapping bootstrap-prefix.sh. Elmar, it sounds like this is what you're after, and if you want to build it, you should feel free. As Jeremy says, use Prefix for a while and get used to the tools before you start trying to improve it. I don't think it would be a huge amount of work, but it will need to be maintained over time.
The most pleasant user experience would be a platform-specific installer that either unpacks a usable stage4 tarball to a preset location, or runs through the bootstrap stages. I haven't used the Windows installer, but from a quick browse it looks like it does this, and it looks professional. If our company were to expand significantly, we would consider building something like this to deploy and maintain Prefix installations for developers and designers. I'm thinking of a "Gentoo" System Preferences pane here.
Peter
08-19-2010, 07:45 AM
Michael Haubenwallner
You too? youtoo!
On 08/18/10 21:19, Peter Abrahamsen wrote:
> On Aug 18, 2010, at 4:39 AM, Michael Haubenwallner wrote:
>
>> Well, for Windows you might be in some luck (thanks to mduft):
>> What does exist already is (not a script, but) an ISO image (DVD) with
>> some nice
>> GUI installer, that can set up both Interix and Gentoo Prefix on your
>> Windows box.
>> You can find it via http://prefix.gentoo.org/bootstrap.xml
>
> Bootstrapping is about as much fun as standing in line at the post
> office. If Prefix would like to compete with fink, darwinports, or
> whatever else people are using on various platforms, then the experience
> for the first-time user should be as easy as what Elmar describes. I
> can't think of any reason it shouldn't be that easy–pretty much everyone
> runs bootstrap-prefix.sh the same way, except when they copy the
> commands wrong or out of order.
Well, yes - there is another thing, called prefix-launcher[1].
It does provide a script called eprefix-bootstrap[2].
Although we use it here to bootstrap on aix/hpux/linux/solaris/interix,
its documentation could need some love: In the early days there was some
wiki, but I didn't manage to get this content to SF's new wiki system.
/haubi/
--
Michael Haubenwallner
Gentoo on a different level
08-19-2010, 11:46 AM
Elmar Hinz
You too? youtoo!
>
> Well, for Windows you might be in some luck (thanks to mduft):
> What does exist already is (not a script, but) an ISO image (DVD) with some nice
> GUI installer, that can set up both Interix and Gentoo Prefix on your Windows box.
> You can find it via http://prefix.gentoo.org/bootstrap.xml
>
Thank, you. That is good starting point. I took a look into the docs
pdf. Looks quite welldone.
However, I couldn't even test it because it requires windows enterprise.
Than it is done in C#, which is not that portable.
Researches for me:
1.) Can I set it up with the Cygwin compatibility layer?
There are no positive reports so far.
2.) Can I strip it down to a more lightweight tool?
3.) Which language to make the installer more portable?
The Java stack would offer a solution, but is heavy itself.
At least it is already installed on many machines.
Python? Ruby?
08-19-2010, 02:33 PM
Jonathan Callen
You too? youtoo!
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> 1.) Can I set it up with the Cygwin compatibility layer?
>
> There are no positive reports so far.
I personally, as well as other people, have attempted to port Gentoo
Prefix to work on Cygwin. Unfortunately, these attempts have not been
very successful, in part due to how Cygwin lays out its libraries.
As an example, for a library named libfoo the following files would be
installed:
Please note that the .dll file is installed in bin/ not lib/, as
cygfoo-1.dll needs to be found in a directory listed in the $PATH
environment variable (note: that's not LD_LIBRARY_PATH, but PATH -- the
same variable used to find executables). Also, the .exe suffix on
executables can cause other issues as well, as it is (sometimes)
optional, and some packages can get confused about that.
- --
Jonathan Callen
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2010/8/19 Jonathan Callen <abcd@gentoo.org>:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
>> 1.) Can I set it up with the Cygwin compatibility layer?
>>
>> There are no positive reports so far.
>
> I personally, as well as other people, have attempted to port Gentoo
> Prefix to work on Cygwin. *Unfortunately, these attempts have not been
> very successful, in part due to how Cygwin lays out its libraries.
>
> As an example, for a library named libfoo the following files would be
> installed:
>
> Linux * * * * * *Cygwin
> - ----- * * * * * *------
> lib/libfoo.a * * lib/libfoo.a
> lib/libfoo.so * *lib/libfoo.dll.a
> lib/libfoo.so.1 *bin/cygfoo-1.dll
>
> Please note that the .dll file is installed in bin/ not lib/, as
> cygfoo-1.dll needs to be found in a directory listed in the $PATH
> environment variable (note: that's not LD_LIBRARY_PATH, but PATH -- the
> same variable used to find executables). *Also, the .exe suffix on
> executables can cause other issues as well, as it is (sometimes)
> optional, and some packages can get confused about that.
>
> - --
> Jonathan Callen
Thank you for that report.
Maybe it's the end of my investigations, maybe it is the challenge.
I first have to dig a little deeper into Prefix. Still I am exercising
the gentoo setup.
Meanwhile it takes me less than an hour until I have genkernel and
wifi up and running.
Time to start with Prefix.
Al
08-20-2010, 07:11 AM
Elmar Hinz
You too? youtoo!
As I first sketch I did a shell script called "metoo". It runs the
normal genkernel installation.
I do it from an ubuntu partition. It does not install a bootloader, as
grub is already available from this ubuntu installation.
Let`s see if this list allows to attach a file. Have a look into it.
If you want to try it, you need at least an empty partition of 5 GB
and a swap partition. It accepts an additional partition for the
portage tree.
On my machine it has a duration of 45 minutes.
Regards
Al
08-20-2010, 08:24 AM
Michael Haubenwallner
You too? youtoo!
On 08/20/2010 09:11 AM, Elmar Hinz wrote:
> As I first sketch I did a shell script called "metoo". It runs the
> normal genkernel installation.
>
> I do it from an ubuntu partition. It does not install a bootloader, as
> grub is already available from this ubuntu installation.
>
> Let`s see if this list allows to attach a file. Have a look into it.
> If you want to try it, you need at least an empty partition of 5 GB
> and a swap partition. It accepts an additional partition for the
> portage tree.
I'm wondering what you're after now:
Gentoo Prefix is _not_ a complete operating system, but "just another
program" on top of some running OS. So it does _not_ need an "empty"
partition, and especially not a swap partition.
It just requires some free disk space, which _can_ be on a separate
partition, but it must contain at least a filesystem already mounted
into your OS.
/haubi/
--
Michael Haubenwallner
Gentoo on a different level
08-20-2010, 08:30 AM
Elmar Hinz
You too? youtoo!
It is not prefix. It is just a first step of research.
Al
08-21-2010, 09:26 PM
Elmar Hinz
You too? youtoo!
The next steps are done. I have the prototype of a USB stick that I
can run on Ubuntu, Fedora and Suse.
1.) Testing Gentoo and writing an installer script: DONE
2.) Testing Prefix and writing a bootstrap script: DONE
3.) Testing Prefix on a symlink: DONE
4.) Testing bootstrapped Prefix on USB with 3 major Linux distros: DONE
5.) Discussing a Prefix distro for major Linux Distros: TODO
6.) Testing Prefix with Cygwin or similar on windows: TODO
7.) Writing windows bootstrap script: TODO
8.) Testing bootstrapped Prefix on USB with different windows: TODO
9.) Get "youtoo" project started either within Gentoo Prefix or indepent: TODO
10.) Bringing the results to Mac: TODO
11.) Turning back to my original goal "the freelancer tool" based on
the results.: TODO
You too? youtoo!
