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Old 04-23-2008, 06:55 PM
"Arthur Pemberton"
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

2008/4/23 Paul Shaffer <ace_wizard@yahoo.com>:
> This is the attitude that will eventually marginalize Fedora into a
> non-issue:

Who's going to push so much of the cross distro OSS development then>?

> --- On Tue, 4/22/08, Francis Earl <lunitik@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> No. I was the person that stated that this is EXACTLY why people like
> Ubuntu, they're lazy. Such things are available, but Joe User doesn't
> care to figure out where to get it.
>
> If you want these modules in the Fedora kernel, ask upstream to include
> it, else it's not going into Fedora. Even file bugs to request they be
> included upstream within the Fedora bugzilla.
>
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>
>
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Old 04-23-2008, 07:00 PM
Les Mikesell
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

Heitor Moraes wrote:

It's impossible to say that.
We will never know.


Maybe there is a philosophical sense where you can't know anything
absolutely, but there is a very causal event here where Sun gave
OpenOffice an open source license that it didn't have before. Without
the open source licensing, it's a pretty sure bet that it wouldn't be in
fedora and we wouldn't be discussing it now. (And without it's
commercial history it probably wouldn't be something you'd want to use,
either).


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Old 04-23-2008, 10:35 PM
"Heitor Moraes"
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

I really believe that the owners of Star Division were only waiting to
be purchased by a "global player".
It could be IBM, Red Hat, Sun, Novell...

On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 4:00 PM, Les Mikesell <lesmikesell@gmail.com> wrote:
> Heitor Moraes wrote:
>
> > It's impossible to say that.
> > We will never know.
> >
>
> Maybe there is a philosophical sense where you can't know anything
> absolutely, but there is a very causal event here where Sun gave OpenOffice
> an open source license that it didn't have before. Without the open source
> licensing, it's a pretty sure bet that it wouldn't be in fedora and we
> wouldn't be discussing it now. (And without it's commercial history it
> probably wouldn't be something you'd want to use, either).
>
> --
>
> Les Mikesell
> lesmikesell@gmail.com
>
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Old 04-23-2008, 10:42 PM
"Arthur Pemberton"
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 5:35 PM, Heitor Moraes <heitor.moraes@gmail.com> wrote:
> I really believe that the owners of Star Division were only waiting to
> be purchased by a "global player".
> It could be IBM, Red Hat, Sun, Novell...

I would really appreciate if every one bottom posted, its much easier to read.

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Old 04-23-2008, 11:29 PM
Les Mikesell
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

Heitor Moraes wrote:

I really believe that the owners of Star Division were only waiting to
be purchased by a "global player".
It could be IBM, Red Hat, Sun, Novell...


In that case you should believe that those other players weren't willing
to do it. But I believe that they just couldn't compete with the
Microsoft monopoly that has been fostered by GPL-encumbered code that
attracts and entraps free development work into something that can't
ever be complete enough for commercial success.


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Old 04-23-2008, 11:29 PM
Paul Shaffer
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

Just to clarify, I don't disagree with Fedora's approach to the licensing and software patent issues at all.* In fact, I think it's quite admirable.* Just maybe not the best way to build user base for a distro that is ostensibly for "lazy" users.

I suspect the target users are not really the vast majority of potential users at all.* The more advanced users and administrators who can effectively diagnose problems and submit bug reports would seem much more amenable to Fedora's real strategy.* What a brilliant way to sustain a virtual army of qualified beta testers and push their business associates and cients towards the $$ lines.

The whole open source/upstream/patent debate is just a sideshow.* Brilliant.



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Old 04-23-2008, 11:35 PM
"Heitor Moraes"
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

i believe... you believe... As I said... We will never know.

PS: I prefer bottom post only for lists of questions.

On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 8:29 PM, Les Mikesell <lesmikesell@gmail.com> wrote:
> Heitor Moraes wrote:
>
> > I really believe that the owners of Star Division were only waiting to
> > be purchased by a "global player".
> > It could be IBM, Red Hat, Sun, Novell...
> >
>
> In that case you should believe that those other players weren't willing to
> do it. But I believe that they just couldn't compete with the Microsoft
> monopoly that has been fostered by GPL-encumbered code that attracts and
> entraps free development work into something that can't ever be complete
> enough for commercial success.
>
> --
>
> Les Mikesell
> lesmikesell@gmail.com
>
>
> --
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> fedora-list@redhat.com
> To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list
>

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Old 04-23-2008, 11:37 PM
"max bianco"
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

2008/4/23 Paul Shaffer <ace_wizard@yahoo.com>:
> Just to clarify, I don't disagree with Fedora's approach to the licensing
> and software patent issues at all. In fact, I think it's quite admirable.
> Just maybe not the best way to build user base for a distro that is
> ostensibly for "lazy" users.
>
Lazy? where does it say Fedora is for lazy users? not that its that
hard to navigate if you have a grain of sense.
> I suspect the target users are not really the vast majority of potential
> users at all.
I suspect Fedora is aimed at people who like their software like they
like their sex : FREE


Max

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Old 04-24-2008, 03:27 AM
Ric Moore
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

On Wed, 2008-04-23 at 17:42 -0500, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 5:35 PM, Heitor Moraes <heitor.moraes@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I really believe that the owners of Star Division were only waiting to
> > be purchased by a "global player".
> > It could be IBM, Red Hat, Sun, Novell...
>
> I would really appreciate if every one bottom posted, its much easier to read.

Thank you, Arthur. +1

--
================================================
My father, Victor Moore (Vic) used to say:
"There are two Great Sins in the world...
..the Sin of Ignorance, and the Sin of Stupidity.
Only the former may be overcome." R.I.P. Dad.
Linux user# 44256 Sign up at: http://counter.li.org/
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Old 04-24-2008, 03:37 AM
Ric Moore
 
Default Fedora Desktop future- RedHat moves

On Wed, 2008-04-23 at 16:29 -0700, Paul Shaffer wrote:
> Just to clarify, I don't disagree with Fedora's approach to the
> licensing and software patent issues at all. In fact, I think it's
> quite admirable. Just maybe not the best way to build user base for a
> distro that is ostensibly for "lazy" users.
>
> I suspect the target users are not really the vast majority of
> potential users at all. The more advanced users and administrators
> who can effectively diagnose problems and submit bug reports would
> seem much more amenable to Fedora's real strategy. What a brilliant
> way to sustain a virtual army of qualified beta testers and push their
> business associates and cients towards the $$ lines.
>
> The whole open source/upstream/patent debate is just a sideshow.
> Brilliant.
>
> I agree to a point. It would be telling to show just how many of us
> chucked in the $29 for the first Bob's living room boxed sets of
> RedHat?? Let's face it, in the very early days of Linux, getting a
> desktop to work at all was no small miracle. A CD drive was almost 500
> bucks. How many did their first install from a stack of floppies with
> Slackware?? How many ran the very first single floppy that tested to
> see if your machine would handle Linux at all, by just by booting it
> to see?? Looking back, the assertion that the Desktop first user
> becomes the Server Admin user, is probably valid marketing-wise and
> not to be dismissed lightly. Food for thought, Ric
>
>

--
================================================
My father, Victor Moore (Vic) used to say:
"There are two Great Sins in the world...
..the Sin of Ignorance, and the Sin of Stupidity.
Only the former may be overcome." R.I.P. Dad.
Linux user# 44256 Sign up at: http://counter.li.org/
http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/oar
http://www.wayward4now.net <---down4now too
================================================

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