On Wed, 2008-04-23 at 11:39 -0600, Robin Laing wrote:
> Alastair Neil wrote:
> > On Tue, Apr 22, 2008 at 10:23 PM, Ric Moore <firstname.lastname@example.org
> > <mailto:email@example.com>> wrote:
> > On Tue, 2008-04-22 at 13:05 -0700, Francis Earl wrote:
> > > That article ENTIRELY got it wrong. All RedHat said was they won't be
> > > pushing Linux on the consumer desktop for some time. They make their
> > > money from servers, and they are a company, so it's not in their best
> > > interest to have a product they aren't profiting from.
> > OTOH, as I've said for years, desktops beget servers. Who in their right
> > mind would have ever thought that Windows would become a choice as a
> > server platform?? The Windows3.1 users got used to the desktop and it
> > rolled from there. Disregard the desktops of college entry level users,
> > and they'll migrate with their favorite platform and comfort level to
> > using it to admin their future server needs. What's not to understand in
> > this? RedHat could very well be blowing their lead and not seeing it
> > until too late in the game to recover.
> > We (RH) used to have college programs all over the place ...usually
> > promoted as install fests at Universities. I haven't heard of one in the
> > press for years now. Servers are where the money is, no doubt. But, it
> > is better IMHO to have the future admins loyalty through the user
> > desktop by catering to them. I spent years in Marketing. I learned to
> > never EVER disregard the little guy. He might become the next purchasing
> > agent and/or decision maker. My two cents, Ric
> > An where has it got Microsoft? 20 years and countless billions invested
> > in marketing and they still manage only 30% of the server market.
> > True, Novel lost out to WinNT in part because users got used to the
> > Windows interface and wanted a similar experience for managing their
> > servers. I refuse to believe that there is such a gulf between Ubuntu
> > and RHEL in functionality that users would have the same visceral
> > reaction and defect in droves from RH to Ubuntu - because they love
> > brown backgrounds on their Gnome desktops. Red Hat has focused its
> > desktop efforts on crafting a distribution that is best in class for
> > administering servers, just as SUSE is crafting a business productivity
> > centric desktop distribution with an emphasis on Windows
> > interoperability (thus Evolution, Mono/silverlight and "Don't Sue us
> > please Bill!" agreements). These distros have carved their own niches,
> > I don't as yet know what Ubuntu's niche is - windows malcontents? home
> > tinkerers/hobyists? Small Home Office? You could argue that this is
> > exactly the way linux started and who knows in 10 or 20 years maybe they
> > will have a significant enterprise share, however, I doubt it. Being
> > able to play MP3's out of the box rarely makes it onto a enterprise
> > server deployment specification.
> This is an interesting comment. Just a few days ago, I read an article
> about Microsoft pointing out companies that have moved from Linux
> servers due to the desktop support as well as gui management tools. Of
> course I hear that they are now adding more command line tools for
> administration due to demand.
> I see two aspects to this part of the debate.
> If people use Linux at work, they will be more likely to use it at home.
> They will use what they are familiar with. Most computer users are
> not that intelligent to using their computers. Some cannot even figure
> out how to update their computers.
> As for MS not getting a larger server share, this is a strange aspect.
> Part of the issue in the past has been many admins that new Unix found
> it easier to move to Linux from Solaris or other versions. The share of
> Windows servers from what I am reading is increasing. I see this as a
> result of the new point and click mentality. If you cannot click it,
> then you cannot manage it. Damn kids today.
I know thats the mentality, but my god thats bullshit! I'll use cli
anyday for major tasks- try migrating stats support on a IIS server with
400+ sites then you'll know!
> FWIW, this thread has brought out many of the comments that have been
> stated in this article.
> Did Canonical Just Get Punked by Red Hat and Novell?
> Basically, the announcements are to support the server sales.
> I did like this comment though.
> "Curiously, very little attention was paid to Ron Hovespian's comments
> on Novell's similar plans, made before Red Hat's. If I were Novell, I
> would take this as a bad sign. Not only did the mainstream media not
> pick up on Novell's news, but even most of the hard-line Linux
> blogosphere wrote them off with nary so much as a "meh" And if you can't
> get those folks mad, you must be doing something wrong!
> From the people that I know, the reason to move from Fedora is the
> upgrade path being easier. Longer support is appreciated. Some of
> these people are also old time Solaris users as well.
> I will stick with Fedora as long as I can get third party application
> that me and my family use. If they are only available on Ubuntu, then I
> will have to move.
I think it comes down to ease of support as well. If support doesn't
keep up then the software is rendered useless. Ie MPlayer and codecs...
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