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Old 07-07-2012, 12:23 AM
Richard Vickery
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 4:51 PM, Antonio Olivares <olivares14031@yahoo.com> wrote:

> When are we going to decide not to respond to this guy. Send

> him no mail

> in response to his rambling and he will stop rambling and/or

> go away.

> --



Can we really decide?



I beg to differ. *I for one see that some folks are angry about his postings. *He has the right to post/complain/rant/.../etc. *Or am I mistaken?

Are we under a new law? *a new world government where people cannot speak their minds?



<OT>

I am sure that there are other things that would cause more trouble, take ObamaCare for instance. *SCOTUS ruled that it was constitutional and allowed under the Taxing power of the US congress. *Can we repeal it? and make it go away? *It will tax the hell out of working people(even worse than the legend of Robin Hood), so others who do nothing get to have free Health care.


</OT>



Eventually this thread will die off, but I wish I could say the same of ObamaCare. *Fedora will live on unless it is part of the 2012 Apocalypse and all servers will stop hosting and yum updates on Dec 21, 2012?



My $0.02 because I have run out of ``Hope and Change' as Mr. Obama promised in 2008



Regards,





Antonio



Antonio:
There is a large part of your population that actually like what you term as ObamaCare; It is mirrored on a package that Romney developed for his state as governor. There are also a*significant*percentage that dislike the legislation. What would you replace it with? Sometimes policy like that in question is cheaper for everybody; doctors visits turn out to be cheaper.
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Old 07-07-2012, 01:32 AM
suvayu ali
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

Hi Antonio,

On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 1:51 AM, Antonio Olivares
<olivares14031@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I beg to differ. I for one see that some folks are angry about his
> postings. He has the right to post/complain/rant/.../etc. Or am I
> mistaken? Are we under a new law? a new world government where people
> cannot speak their minds?

I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, however I feel many
posters are angry because the OP has consistently insulted the community
starting from the very first post to this thread. Thinly veiled indirect
insults are still insults, and against list guidelines.

I witheld from posting to this thread so far, but your message
supporting(?) the OP seemed to deserve an explanation from my side why
even a passive reader might feel offended and bear some resentment
towards the OP.

Hope to help each other in a more productive thread,

--
Suvayu

Open source is the future. It sets us free.
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Old 07-07-2012, 01:41 AM
Richard Vickery
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 6:32 PM, suvayu ali <fatkasuvayu+linux@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Antonio,



On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 1:51 AM, Antonio Olivares

<olivares14031@yahoo.com> wrote:

>

> I beg to differ. I for one see that some folks are angry about his

> postings. He has the right to post/complain/rant/.../etc. Or am I

> mistaken? Are we under a new law? a new world government where people

> cannot speak their minds?



I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, however I feel many

posters are angry because the OP has consistently insulted the community

starting from the very first post to this thread. Thinly veiled indirect

insults are still insults, and against list guidelines.



I witheld from posting to this thread so far, but your message

supporting(?) the OP seemed to deserve an explanation from my side why

even a passive reader might feel offended and bear some resentment

towards the OP.



Hope to help each other in a more productive thread,



--

Suvayu



Open source is the future. It sets us free.

--

Clarification please: OP*
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Old 07-07-2012, 02:01 AM
Robert Myers
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 9:32 PM, suvayu ali <fatkasuvayu+linux@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Antonio,
>
> On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 1:51 AM, Antonio Olivares
> <olivares14031@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> I beg to differ. I for one see that some folks are angry about his
>> postings. He has the right to post/complain/rant/.../etc. Or am I
>> mistaken? Are we under a new law? a new world government where people
>> cannot speak their minds?
>
> I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, however I feel many
> posters are angry because the OP has consistently insulted the community
> starting from the very first post to this thread. Thinly veiled indirect
> insults are still insults, and against list guidelines.
>
> I witheld from posting to this thread so far, but your message
> supporting(?) the OP seemed to deserve an explanation from my side why
> even a passive reader might feel offended and bear some resentment
> towards the OP.
>

Some might feel offended? I'm shocked. Glad you told me. Over and
over and over again. Otherwise, I might never have known.

The self-righteousness. The need for self-justification. You don't
fix such things by beating other people up, whether literally or
figuratively.

I've stayed partly to confirm to myself that, yes, indeed, people can
and do behave this way.

Here's a rule for you. If you are in a group situation and someone
has been singled out for repeated criticism or abuse, either stay out
of it or step in and stop it. Otherwise, you are just another bully,
and this group is filled with them.

Rationalize from now until doomsday, and you won't change the
conclusion. A single person might be 100% wrong on any given issue,
but a mob is *never* right. One person being wrong is just one person
being wrong. What difference does it make?

If, on the other hand, you don't understand how dangerous,
destructive, and repulsive mob behavior is, then, as I have suggested
already, get some help. You are a menace to a peacefully-functioning
society.

Robert Myers
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Old 07-07-2012, 02:08 AM
Richard Vickery
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 7:01 PM, Robert Myers <rbmyersusa@gmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 9:32 PM, suvayu ali <fatkasuvayu+linux@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Antonio,

>

> On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 1:51 AM, Antonio Olivares

> <olivares14031@yahoo.com> wrote:

>>

>> I beg to differ. I for one see that some folks are angry about his

>> postings. He has the right to post/complain/rant/.../etc. Or am I

>> mistaken? Are we under a new law? a new world government where people

>> cannot speak their minds?

>

> I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, however I feel many

> posters are angry because the OP has consistently insulted the community

> starting from the very first post to this thread. Thinly veiled indirect

> insults are still insults, and against list guidelines.

>

> I witheld from posting to this thread so far, but your message

> supporting(?) the OP seemed to deserve an explanation from my side why

> even a passive reader might feel offended and bear some resentment

> towards the OP.

>



Some might feel offended? *I'm shocked. *Glad you told me. *Over and

over and over again. *Otherwise, I might never have known.



The self-righteousness. *The need for self-justification. You don't

fix such things by beating other people up, whether literally or

figuratively.



I've stayed partly to confirm to myself that, yes, indeed, people can

and do behave this way.



Here's a rule for you. *If you are in a group situation and someone

has been singled out for repeated criticism or abuse, either stay out

of it or step in and stop it. *Otherwise, you are just another bully,

and this group is filled with them.



Rationalize from now until doomsday, and you won't change the

conclusion. *A single person might be 100% wrong on any given issue,

but a mob is *never* right. *One person being wrong is just one person

being wrong. *What difference does it make?



If, on the other hand, you don't understand how dangerous,

destructive, and repulsive mob behavior is, then, as I have suggested

already, get some help. *You are a menace to a peacefully-functioning

society.



Robert Myers



Remember, Robert, that you brought it on yourself with your negative speak.*


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Old 07-07-2012, 02:11 AM
Antonio Olivares
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

--- On Fri, 7/6/12, Richard Vickery <richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Richard Vickery <richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out
To: "Community support for Fedora users" <users@lists.fedoraproject.org>
Date: Friday, July 6, 2012, 6:41 PM

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 6:32 PM, suvayu ali <fatkasuvayu+linux@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Antonio,



On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 1:51 AM, Antonio Olivares

<olivares14031@yahoo.com> wrote:

>

> I beg to differ. I for one see that some folks are angry about his

> postings. He has the right to post/complain/rant/.../etc. Or am I

> mistaken? Are we under a new law? a new world government where people

> cannot speak their minds?



I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, however I feel many

posters are angry because the OP has consistently insulted the community

starting from the very first post to this thread. Thinly veiled indirect

insults are still insults, and against list guidelines.



I witheld from posting to this thread so far, but your message

supporting(?) the OP seemed to deserve an explanation from my side why

even a passive reader might feel offended and bear some resentment

towards the OP.



Hope to help each other in a more productive thread,



--

Suvayu



Open source is the future. It sets us free.

--

Clarification please: OP*

-----Inline Attachment Follows-----

--

Which OP? My post or the True original OP?

Here's original post

http://www.spinics.net/linux/fedora/fedora-users/msg419911.html

My post was to suggest that he had a right to post what he posted.
Other users don't agree.

The guidelines here:

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines

I don't know which one he violated, other than all CAPS word HOWEVER.
He appears to not insult the (Red Hat)community since he posted:

``I've been using Red Hat and then Fedora for a long time. The only
reason I've stuck with Fedora this long is that I am very grateful to
Red Hat for its contribution to the community. '

I don't know if there is anything wrong here. I just see that some users are not appreciative of his words or that he is upset with Fedora Development, and he has his right of stating what he stated.

If it is me that needs to respond, please let me know and I will clarify my statements.

Suvayu,

I did not notice any insults in the first post. The others or responses, then have generated some back n 4th dialogue, and I also agree with your statement:

``Hope to help each other in a more productive thread,'

Regards,


Antonio
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Old 07-07-2012, 02:47 AM
"Eddie G.O'Connor Jr-I"
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

To place my two cents in this: I'm going to capitalize the most
important words in my statement so that there's no confusion: In MY
PERSONAL OPINION I feel that anyone who wishes to voice THEIR OPINION on
this mailing list should be ALLOWED to do so, UNLESS it DETRACTS from
the QUALITY & CONTENT of this mailing list. I also PERSONALLY feel that
if two or more people wish to have a DISCUSSION concerning their
PERSONAL BELIEFS...CONVICTIONS and OPINIONS, they should be JUST AS FREE
to do so without INVOLVING THE ENTIRE MAILING LIST! But please.....once
again bear in mind this is MY PERSONAL OPINION and as such it should be
TREATED as such and not be given enough weight to cause someone to feel
impelled to respond!





EGO II



On 07/06/2012 10:11 PM, Antonio Olivares wrote:

--- On Fri, 7/6/12, Richard Vickery <richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Richard Vickery <richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out
To: "Community support for Fedora users" <users@lists.fedoraproject.org>
Date: Friday, July 6, 2012, 6:41 PM

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 6:32 PM, suvayu ali <fatkasuvayu+linux@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Antonio,



On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 1:51 AM, Antonio Olivares

<olivares14031@yahoo.com> wrote:


I beg to differ. I for one see that some folks are angry about his
postings. He has the right to post/complain/rant/.../etc. Or am I
mistaken? Are we under a new law? a new world government where people
cannot speak their minds?



I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, however I feel many

posters are angry because the OP has consistently insulted the community

starting from the very first post to this thread. Thinly veiled indirect

insults are still insults, and against list guidelines.



I witheld from posting to this thread so far, but your message

supporting(?) the OP seemed to deserve an explanation from my side why

even a passive reader might feel offended and bear some resentment

towards the OP.



Hope to help each other in a more productive thread,



--

Suvayu



Open source is the future. It sets us free.

--

Clarification please: OP

-----Inline Attachment Follows-----




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Old 07-07-2012, 04:38 AM
Richard Vickery
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 7:47 PM, Eddie G.O'Connor Jr-I <eoconnor25@gmail.com> wrote:

To place my two cents in this: I'm going to capitalize the most important words in my statement so that there's no confusion: In MY PERSONAL OPINION I feel that anyone who wishes to voice THEIR OPINION on this mailing list should be ALLOWED to do so, UNLESS it DETRACTS from the QUALITY & CONTENT of this mailing list. I also PERSONALLY feel that if two or more people wish to have a DISCUSSION concerning their PERSONAL BELIEFS...CONVICTIONS and OPINIONS, they should be JUST AS FREE to do so without INVOLVING THE ENTIRE MAILING LIST! But please.....once again bear in mind this is MY PERSONAL OPINION and as such it should be TREATED as such and not be given enough weight to cause someone to feel impelled to respond!










EGO II







On 07/06/2012 10:11 PM, Antonio Olivares wrote:


--- On Fri, 7/6/12, Richard Vickery <richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com> wrote:



From: Richard Vickery <richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com>

Subject: Re: Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

To: "Community support for Fedora users" <users@lists.fedoraproject.org>

Date: Friday, July 6, 2012, 6:41 PM



On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 6:32 PM, suvayu ali <fatkasuvayu+linux@gmail.com> wrote:



Hi Antonio,







On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 1:51 AM, Antonio Olivares



<olivares14031@yahoo.com> wrote:




I beg to differ. I for one see that some folks are angry about his

postings. He has the right to post/complain/rant/.../etc. Or am I

mistaken? Are we under a new law? a new world government where people

cannot speak their minds?






I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, however I feel many



posters are angry because the OP has consistently insulted the community



starting from the very first post to this thread. Thinly veiled indirect



insults are still insults, and against list guidelines.







I witheld from posting to this thread so far, but your message



supporting(?) the OP seemed to deserve an explanation from my side why



even a passive reader might feel offended and bear some resentment



towards the OP.







Hope to help each other in a more productive thread,







--



Suvayu







Open source is the future. It sets us free.



--



Clarification please: OP



-----Inline Attachment Follows-----






Eddie: I don't think anyone wants to read the Myers negative choice of words. Some like myself would prefer it if Myers chooses positive frames in which to place his ideas. I don't think anybody likes a negative attitude. If you don't like Fedora of Linux generally, then don't use it.

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Old 07-07-2012, 05:26 AM
Alan Evans
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 12:35 PM, Robert Myers wrote:
> I've been using the Internet since when it was Arpanet, I've seen
> hackers at work when hacking meant standing at a telephone with a tone
> generator and reading the Bell System Technical Journal, and I know
> very well how a mailing-list works. If I didn't want to tell the
> entire world I think you an intrusive busybody, I would have mailed
> you privately.
>
> As to what your actual technical capabilities might be, I'm sure I
> wouldn't be competent to judge them, just as I am quite certain that
> you are not competent to judge mine--and I really don't care, anyway.

You don't happen to know Karl Larsen, do you? You two are like
brothers separated at birth.
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Old 07-07-2012, 05:32 AM
Paul Allen Newell
 
Default Please Relax was: And don't let the door hit you on the way out

On 7/6/2012 10:26 PM, Alan Evans wrote:

On Fri, Jul 6, 2012 at 12:35 PM, Robert Myers wrote:

I've been using the Internet since when it was Arpanet, I've seen
hackers at work when hacking meant standing at a telephone with a tone
generator and reading the Bell System Technical Journal, and I know
very well how a mailing-list works. If I didn't want to tell the
entire world I think you an intrusive busybody, I would have mailed
you privately.

As to what your actual technical capabilities might be, I'm sure I
wouldn't be competent to judge them, just as I am quite certain that
you are not competent to judge mine--and I really don't care, anyway.

You don't happen to know Karl Larsen, do you? You two are like
brothers separated at birth.


+1 ... its taken that door being open way too long and too much hot air
coming in to finally get something worth smiling about


Paul

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