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Old 12-24-2011, 09:07 PM
JB
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

T.C. Hollingsworth <tchollingsworth <at> gmail.com> writes:

>
> On Sat, Dec 24, 2011 at 1:21 PM, JB <jb.1234abcd <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> > Anything mounted on /media has to be of actual "type" of that media.
> > Btw, a CD mounted on /media, even if temporarily, represents "a persistent
> > storage device", and certainly NOT "volatile memory" (e.g. of type shm).
> >
> > I think systemd devs need to remove it - it is a pure nonsense.
>
> /media is on tmpfs simply because it's faster to keep the mountpoints
> in memory than on disk. That way, you don't have to hit your root
> disk just to locate something that is almost certainly on another
> disk. It doesn't affect the mounts below it in any way.
>
> -T.C.

Boyz and Girlz,

so this is your understanding of tmpfs ?

Systemd is a result of Windows GNU/Linux devs pretending to be UNIX devs ...
I have already said that when we discussed systemd on Fedora dev list ...

It has to be brought up on dev list immediately.
This is bananas !

JB


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Old 12-24-2011, 09:14 PM
Reindl Harald
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

Am 24.12.2011 23:07, schrieb JB:
> T.C. Hollingsworth <tchollingsworth <at> gmail.com> writes:
>
>> On Sat, Dec 24, 2011 at 1:21 PM, JB <jb.1234abcd <at> gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Anything mounted on /media has to be of actual "type" of that media.
>>> Btw, a CD mounted on /media, even if temporarily, represents "a persistent
>>> storage device", and certainly NOT "volatile memory" (e.g. of type shm).
>>>
>>> I think systemd devs need to remove it - it is a pure nonsense.
>>
>> /media is on tmpfs simply because it's faster to keep the mountpoints
>> in memory than on disk. That way, you don't have to hit your root
>> disk just to locate something that is almost certainly on another
>> disk. It doesn't affect the mounts below it in any way.
>
> Boyz and Girlz,
>
> so this is your understanding of tmpfs ?
>
> Systemd is a result of Windows GNU/Linux devs pretending to be UNIX devs ...
> I have already said that when we discussed systemd on Fedora dev list ...
>
> It has to be brought up on dev list immediately.
> This is bananas !

keep your childish "Boyz and Girlz" for you and please leave us
in peace if you only like to troll AND please stop to assume
others do not know about waht they are talking

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Old 12-24-2011, 09:31 PM
Reindl Harald
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

Am 24.12.2011 23:03, schrieb JB:
> I was wondering about this:
> updatedb.conf(5)
> ...
> PRUNE_BIND_MOUNTS
> One of the strings 0, no, 1 or yes. If PRUNE_BIND_MOUNTS is 1
> or yes, bind mounts are not scanned by updatedb(8). All file
> systems mounted in the subtree of a bind mount are skipped as
> well, even if they are not bind mounts. As an exception, bind
> mounts of a directory on itself are not skipped.
>
> By default, bind mounts are not skipped.
> ...
>
> This is of interest to me:
> ...
> As an exception, bind
> mounts of a directory on itself are not skipped.
>
> I tried to bind mount /media or /media/NETBSD_51 on itself and it did not work.
> Perhaps I am missing something here or the feature does not work ?

yes you are missing topics of many mailing-list posts and
bugreports in the last months while you are believing i
do not know what tmpfs is and about waht i am speaking

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=730138
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=723279

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Old 12-24-2011, 09:31 PM
JB
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

Reindl Harald <h.reindl <at> thelounge.net> writes:

> ...
> >> On Sat, Dec 24, 2011 at 1:21 PM, JB <jb.1234abcd <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Anything mounted on /media has to be of actual "type" of that media.
> >>> Btw, a CD mounted on /media, even if temporarily, represents "a persistent
> >>> storage device", and certainly NOT "volatile memory" (e.g. of type shm).
> >>>
> >>> I think systemd devs need to remove it - it is a pure nonsense.
> >>
> >> /media is on tmpfs simply because it's faster to keep the mountpoints
> >> in memory than on disk. That way, you don't have to hit your root
> >> disk just to locate something that is almost certainly on another
> >> disk. It doesn't affect the mounts below it in any way.
> >
> > Boyz and Girlz,
> >
> > so this is your understanding of tmpfs ?
> >
> > Systemd is a result of Windows GNU/Linux devs pretending to be UNIX devs ...
> > I have already said that when we discussed systemd on Fedora dev list ...
> >
> > It has to be brought up on dev list immediately.
> > This is bananas !
>
> keep your childish "Boyz and Girlz" for you and please leave us
> in peace if you only like to troll AND please stop to assume
> others do not know about waht they are talking
>
>
>
Dear Reindl Harald,
do you like this better ?

You are a clueless TROLL.
Practice your Linux in your neck of the woods, but do not pretend to
understand UNIX and its development.
Stop molesting innocent babies on this Fedora users list :-)

It is no wonder that RH and Fedora each lost almost 50% of its Web deployments
in the last 2 years ...

JB

Fortune cookie:
You can get much further with a kind word and a gun than you can with a kind
word alone.
-- Al Capone
[Also attributed to Johnny Carson. Ed.]


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Old 12-24-2011, 09:37 PM
Reindl Harald
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

Am 24.12.2011 23:31, schrieb JB:
> You are a clueless TROLL.

if you definition of a troll is peopole
knowing more like you - maybe

> Practice your Linux in your neck of the woods, but do not pretend to
> understand UNIX and its development.

i started use unix-systems at times where you was running
around a christmas tree

> It is no wonder that RH and Fedora each lost almost 50% of its Web deployments
> in the last 2 years ...

is saying who?
you? who are you that you think you matter?

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Old 12-24-2011, 10:39 PM
Marko Vojinovic
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

On Saturday 24 December 2011 13:33:57 T.C. Hollingsworth wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 24, 2011 at 11:58 AM, Marko Vojinovic <vvmarko@gmail.com> wrote:
> > (1) What is the proper place to customize this configuration? I want
> > /media to be ext4, so that it doesn't get excluded by updatedb. I know
> > I could reconfigure the /lib/systemd/system/media.mount, but that would
> > probably be overwritten on update or something. How are these things
> > meant to be customized?
>
> Yup, anything in /lib/systemd could get clobbered on update. Files in
> /etc/systemd with the exact same name always override those in /lib,
> and /etc/systemd is for sysadmins only; RPM will never mess with
> anything there. To completely disable something in /lib, you "mask"
> it: just symlink /dev/null to an identically named file in /etc. For
> more information, see:
> http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/three-levels-of-off.html

Great, thanks for the pointer, interesting read. :-)

> So, to disable the /media mount:
> ln -sf /dev/null /etc/systemd/system/media.mount

And we have a winner! :-D This is precisely what I was looking for. After
masking the media.mount, I rebooted the machine and verified that /media is now
just a directory under / (and consequently ext4), and updatedb picks it up and
traverses everything below, just as I wanted.

Marking this as SOLVED. :-)

> > (2) Why is /media being mounted like this? If I reconfigure it back to
> > ext4, is anything else going to break?
>
> For performance reasons. Since /media is intended for temporary
> mounts only, it's faster to keep them in memory (via tmpfs) rather
> than hitting the disk every time you need to look one up.

Makes sense. It seems that this idea just has an (unforseen?) side-effect if
one wants to customize updatedb for /media. :-) But this is of course far from
the intended default behavior, so no arguments from me there. And in my case
performance is not a serious issue.

I just need to remember to keep putting the symlink every time I do a fresh
install from now on... ;-)

> When masking media.mount, /media will revert to being a directory on
> your root fs. So long as it has the appropriate permissions,
> everything will still work fine.

That's nice to know! It would be a very bad thing (for me at least) if tmpfs
was a requirement for some other functionality (that I might need
simultaneously).

Thanks for help goes to T.C. and everyone else who contributed! ;-)

Best, :-)
Marko
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Old 12-24-2011, 10:40 PM
Marko Vojinovic
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

On Saturday 24 December 2011 20:07:20 Reindl Harald wrote:
> Am 24.12.2011 19:58, schrieb Marko Vojinovic:
> > (1) What is the proper place to customize this configuration? I want
> > /media to be ext4, so that it doesn't get excluded by updatedb. I know
> > I could reconfigure the /lib/systemd/system/media.mount, but that would
> > probably be overwritten on update or something. How are these things
> > meant to be customized?
>
> /media is for temporary mounts and this design is OK
> mount your drive somewhere else

Why? This drive *is* a temporary mount, and the system is properly mounting it
under /media. I see no reason to mount it anywhere else --- /media is
precisely the place where this drive should be mounted.

> > (2) Why is /media being mounted like this? If I reconfigure it back to
> > ext4, is anything else going to break?
>
> because it makes no sense to "updatedb" temporary mounts like
> usb-disks, network-mounts and such things since locate-hits
> are normally useless for them and "updatedb" runs forever
> on slow temporary mounts with a hughe amount of files

Maybe it doesn't make sense for you, but there are other people out there with
other usecases, and running updatedb through /media might make sense for them.

This external drive is used as a backup for a laptop. I typically plug it in
every now and then, perform the backup, start updatedb manually once the
backup is done, and remove the drive. The mlocate database stays on the system
for the situations when I lose/modify some local file, and need to know where
it is on the backup, for later retreival. When out in the field, I am often not
in a position to replug the backup disk, and even then it would take a lot of
time to search through 1.5 TB for a single file, on a slow USB disk. The very
purpose of locate and updatedb is to cut this time short.

When I ask how to do something, the only thing I don't want to hear is an
answer on the lines of "only a jackass would want to do that". You should get
out of your own little world and have a more open mind about how other people
use computers, which might be quite different from your own habits.

Or if you are unable to imagine a situation where traversing an external USB
drive might be useful, it is much better to *ask* me about my usecase than
playing smart and telling me that I am doing it all wrong, especially when you
don't have the slightest idea what am I doing in the first place. Such behavior
makes you look very stupid in the eyes of other people.

Please.

Best, :-)
Marko

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Old 12-24-2011, 10:40 PM
Marko Vojinovic
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

On Sunday 25 December 2011 02:14:01 Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> On 12/25/2011 12:28 AM, Marko Vojinovic wrote:
> > (1) What is the proper place to customize this configuration?
>
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Systemd#How_do_I_customize_a_unit_file.2F_add
> _a_custom_unit_file.3F

Thanks for the link, Rahul! :-) I added it to my bookmarks and the TODO list,
to read the whole page eventually.

I just somehow never got around yet to get acquainted with the internals of
systemd. One of these days...

Best, :-)
Marko

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Old 12-24-2011, 10:46 PM
Reindl Harald
 
Default Why updatedb doesn't traverse my external HD?

Am 25.12.2011 00:40, schrieb Marko Vojinovic:
>> /media is for temporary mounts and this design is OK
>> mount your drive somewhere else
>
> Why? This drive *is* a temporary mount, and the system is properly mounting it
> under /media. I see no reason to mount it anywhere else --- /media is
> precisely the place where this drive should be mounted.

and that is why it is not traversed by updatedb

>> because it makes no sense to "updatedb" temporary mounts like
>> usb-disks, network-mounts and such things since locate-hits
>> are normally useless for them and "updatedb" runs forever
>> on slow temporary mounts with a hughe amount of files
>
> Maybe it doesn't make sense for you, but there are other people out there with
> other usecases, and running updatedb through /media might make sense for them.

well so they have the SIMPLE option mount it elsewhere

> When I ask how to do something, the only thing I don't want to hear is an
> answer on the lines of "only a jackass would want to do that". You should get
> out of your own little world and have a more open mind about how other people
> use computers, which might be quite different from your own habits.

the answer was MOUNT IT ELSEWHERE and your problem is solved
what is so difficult there?

MY USECASE does not matter here
the usecase of thousands is plugin any usb-drive temporary without knowing
mlocate at all and this is the big userbase for which traversing these
mounts is useless overhead because it is slow, eating CPU and does
not get used

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