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Old 10-08-2011, 04:29 PM
JD
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On 10/07/2011 03:21 PM, Fernando Cassia wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 07:42, JD<jd1008@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I vote for an upgrade script for all the steps
>> suggested on
>> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Upgrading_Fedora_using_yum
> Wow, progress being made!.
>
> I remember suggesting here that the Linux community should embrace
> scripts, instead of posting "howto" recipes that the users then have
> to cut and paste, and got some string opinions thrown at me.
>
> This example is just what I meant... more scripts, less "howtos" please.
>
> +1
> FC
Right. Newbs and non-techies need scripts.
Of course no one is forcing the techies to use them

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Old 10-08-2011, 07:52 PM
JD
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On 10/07/2011 03:21 PM, Fernando Cassia wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 07:42, JD<jd1008@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I vote for an upgrade script for all the steps
>> suggested on
>> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Upgrading_Fedora_using_yum
> Wow, progress being made!.
>
> I remember suggesting here that the Linux community should embrace
> scripts, instead of posting "howto" recipes that the users then have
> to cut and paste, and got some string opinions thrown at me.
>
> This example is just what I meant... more scripts, less "howtos" please.
>
> +1
> FC
OK - here I report what happened when I tried to
follow the instructions at
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Upgrading_Fedora_using_yum
to perform a live upgrade.

0. ran all the steps specified on the URL.
1. running yum to do distro-sync failed to resolve
conflicts with several of the existing fc14 packages.
2. yum update failed for the same reason.

Conclusion: F16 Beta not ready for live upgrades and/or
I just have too many packages installed (more than
4000).

So, I restored back from saved partition image
and rebooted back to F14.

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Old 10-08-2011, 08:13 PM
Rahul Sundaram
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On 10/07/2011 02:47 PM, JD wrote:

> Seems to me that the upgrade process itself
> should be better scripted on the release DVD/CD
> to take care of such problems, including cleaning
> up of orphaned packages, and synching of packages.
> Such a script would be a great help to newbs and
> non-techies.
> I hope someone on the fedoraproject's release engineering
> team notices this post.

You dont need any scripts. If you upgrade, the previous settings will
be preserved and there is no need to change unless you want to. In any
case, writing these scripts is not release engineering's job. If
needed, it should be part of something like preupgrade. Everyone is
welcome to volunteer and get it done.

Rahul

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Old 10-08-2011, 09:22 PM
JD
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On 10/08/2011 01:13 PM, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> On 10/07/2011 02:47 PM, JD wrote:
>
>> Seems to me that the upgrade process itself
>> should be better scripted on the release DVD/CD
>> to take care of such problems, including cleaning
>> up of orphaned packages, and synching of packages.
>> Such a script would be a great help to newbs and
>> non-techies.
>> I hope someone on the fedoraproject's release engineering
>> team notices this post.
> You dont need any scripts. If you upgrade, the previous settings will
> be preserved and there is no need to change unless you want to. In any
> case, writing these scripts is not release engineering's job. If
> needed, it should be part of something like preupgrade. Everyone is
> welcome to volunteer and get it done.
>
> Rahul
>
I was addressing a live upgrade.
A live upgrade does indeed need to
be a script so that newbs and non-techies
will be able to perform without having
to read a how-to procedure and make
accidental mistakes, no matter who
creates it and submits it for inclusion
in the repos.


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Old 10-08-2011, 10:49 PM
Rahul Sundaram
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On 10/09/2011 02:52 AM, JD wrote:

> I was addressing a live upgrade.
> A live upgrade does indeed need to
> be a script so that newbs and non-techies
> will be able to perform without having
> to read a how-to procedure and make
> accidental mistakes, no matter who
> creates it and submits it for inclusion
> in the repos.

No. it doesn't need to be a script. There is no technical reason it
should be.

Rahul

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Old 10-08-2011, 10:56 PM
JD
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On 10/08/2011 03:49 PM, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> On 10/09/2011 02:52 AM, JD wrote:
>
>> I was addressing a live upgrade.
>> A live upgrade does indeed need to
>> be a script so that newbs and non-techies
>> will be able to perform without having
>> to read a how-to procedure and make
>> accidental mistakes, no matter who
>> creates it and submits it for inclusion
>> in the repos.
> No. it doesn't need to be a script. There is no technical reason it
> should be.
>
> Rahul
>
But there is every reason to make the
live upgrade of fedora as user friendly as possible.
Your opinion sounds rather insensitive to newbs
and non-techies, who would like to perform such
a live upgrade.
Clearly, Fedora needs more people who are
willing to address this issue to give fedora
a wider appeal and make it more user friendly.

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Old 10-08-2011, 11:09 PM
Rahul Sundaram
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On 10/09/2011 04:26 AM, JD wrote:

> But there is every reason to make the
> live upgrade of fedora as user friendly as possible.
> Your opinion sounds rather insensitive to newbs
> and non-techies, who would like to perform such
> a live upgrade.
> Clearly, Fedora needs more people who are
> willing to address this issue to give fedora
> a wider appeal and make it more user friendly.

You haven't given any single reason why it should be a script. What
exactly does such a live upgrade do that preupgrade doesn't and why
can't be it be a part of preupgrade?

Rahul
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Old 10-09-2011, 12:49 AM
JD
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On 10/08/2011 04:09 PM, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> On 10/09/2011 04:26 AM, JD wrote:
>
>> But there is every reason to make the
>> live upgrade of fedora as user friendly as possible.
>> Your opinion sounds rather insensitive to newbs
>> and non-techies, who would like to perform such
>> a live upgrade.
>> Clearly, Fedora needs more people who are
>> willing to address this issue to give fedora
>> a wider appeal and make it more user friendly.
> You haven't given any single reason why it should be a script. What
> exactly does such a live upgrade do that preupgrade doesn't and why
> can't be it be a part of preupgrade?
>
> Rahul
Well, for one, I have tried pre-upgrade and it simply
did not yield the expected result - system was left
with many unresolved conflicts.
Also, a good live upgrade requires just one reboot
and the machine is then running the new version.

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Old 10-09-2011, 01:41 AM
Craig White
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On Sat, 2011-10-08 at 17:49 -0700, JD wrote:
> On 10/08/2011 04:09 PM, Rahul Sundaram wrote:

> > You haven't given any single reason why it should be a script. What
> > exactly does such a live upgrade do that preupgrade doesn't and why
> > can't be it be a part of preupgrade?
> >
> > Rahul
> Well, for one, I have tried pre-upgrade and it simply
> did not yield the expected result - system was left
> with many unresolved conflicts.
> Also, a good live upgrade requires just one reboot
> and the machine is then running the new version.
----
of course you made a bug report so you could help fix whatever didn't
work in pre-upgrade so it was fixed right?

Craig


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Old 10-10-2011, 01:48 AM
Craig White
 
Default Upgrading to F16 Beta

On Sun, 2011-10-09 at 06:35 -0300, Fernando Cassia wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 8, 2011 at 19:49, Rahul Sundaram <metherid@gmail.com> wrote:
> > No. it doesn't need to be a script. There is no technical reason it
> > should be.
> >
> > Rahul
>
> Keep reasoning like this.
> Microsoft needs more people like you,
----
that you should equate an opinion to anything remotely related to
Microsoft says nothing about Rahul but loads about Fernando's logic.

Considering that Rahul is a tireless ambassador for Fedora and puts up
with stupid comments like the above is exactly what Fedora needs more of
and less of people who only see things a lens of 'us and them'.

Craig


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