On Sunday 13 January 2008 22:11, Karl Larsen wrote:
> Craig White wrote:
> > On Sun, 2008-01-13 at 14:20 -0600, Les Mikesell wrote:
> >> Craig White wrote:
> >>> On Sun, 2008-01-13 at 11:46 -0700, Karl Larsen wrote:
> >>>> Nigel Henry wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks Nigel. I guess the lesson learned is to not use yum to
> >>>> remove.
> >>>
> >>> ----
> >>> what yum giveth, yum can taketh away and vice versa.
> >>>
> >>> It doesn't really matter because you can add it back in again anyway.
> >>>
> >>> yum install alsa-plugins-pulseaudio
> >>>
> >>> gets all of it back.
> >>>
> >>> Not only am I sure that using yum to remove a package wasn't a case of
> >>> a lesson to be learned, I am convinced that you have learned nothing of
> >>> significant value at all. That you believe that you can draw
> >>> significant conclusions based upon a lack of knowledge seems to be the
> >>> lesson that eludes you most of all.
> >>
> >> If you are trying to teach something here, get down to the basics. This
> >> has nothing to do with yum itself. How does someone know that the
> >> correct thing to remove/add is alsa-plugins-pulseaudio instead of
> >> pulseaudio? I don't see anything intuitive there, so where do you find
> >> that piece of information?
> >
> > ----
> > do you mean other than the fact that this has been covered many times on
> > the list?
> >
> > I suppose if you need an HTML link to this info, see here...
> >
> > http://www.fedoraguide.info/index.php/Main_Page
> >
> > but it has been covered many times right here on this list
> >
> > Craig
>
> Yes many times and the problem is not that. The problem is I can't
> yum install vlc and that is a HUGE problem to me. here it is again for
> you Craig:
>
> Resolving Dependencies
> --> Running transaction check
> ---> Package vlc.i386 0:0.8.6d-3.lvn8 set to be updated
> --> Processing Dependency: libwx_gtk2u_core-2.6.so.0(WXU_2.6.2) for
> package: vlc
> --> Processing Dependency: libwx_baseu-2.6.so.0(WXU_2.6) for package: vlc
> --> Processing Dependency: libwx_baseu-2.6.so.0 for package: vlc
> --> Processing Dependency: libwx_gtk2u_core-2.6.so.0 for package: vlc
> --> Processing Dependency: vlc-core for package: vlc
> --> Processing Dependency: libwx_gtk2u_adv-2.6.so.0 for package: vlc
> --> Processing Dependency: libwx_gtk2u_adv-2.6.so.0(WXU_2.6) for
> package: vlc
> --> Processing Dependency: libwx_gtk2u_core-2.6.so.0(WXU_2.6) for
> package: vlc
> --> Processing Dependency: libvlc.so.0 for package: vlc
> --> Running transaction check
> ---> Package vlc-core.i386 0:0.8.6d-3.lvn8 set to be updated
> --> Processing Dependency: libpostproc.so.51 for package: vlc-core
> --> Processing Dependency: libavformat.so.51 for package: vlc-core
> --> Processing Dependency: libSDL-1.2.so.0 for package: vlc-core
> --> Processing Dependency: libmpeg2.so.0 for package: vlc-core
> --> Processing Dependency: libavutil.so.49 for package: vlc-core
> --> Processing Dependency: libavcodec.so.51 for package: vlc-core
> --> Processing Dependency: libSDL_image-1.2.so.0 for package: vlc-core
> --> Processing Dependency: libx264.so.56 for package: vlc-core
> ---> Package compat-wxGTK26.i386 0:2.6.4-0.8 set to be updated
> --> Running transaction check
> ---> Package ffmpeg-libs.i386 0:0.4.9-0.41.20071011.lvn8 set to be updated
> --> Processing Dependency: libx264.so.56 for package: ffmpeg-libs
> ---> Package SDL.i386 0:1.2.12-5.fc8 set to be updated
> --> Processing Dependency: libpulse-simple.so.0 for package: SDL
> --> Processing Dependency: libpulse.so.0 for package: SDL
> ---> Package vlc-core.i386 0:0.8.6d-3.lvn8 set to be updated
> --> Processing Dependency: libx264.so.56 for package: vlc-core
> ---> Package mpeg2dec.i386 0:0.4.1-3.lvn8 set to be updated
> ---> Package SDL_image.i386 0:1.2.6-3.fc8 set to be updated
> --> Running transaction check
> ---> Package ffmpeg-libs.i386 0:0.4.9-0.41.20071011.lvn8 set to be updated
> --> Processing Dependency: libx264.so.56 for package: ffmpeg-libs
> ---> Package vlc-core.i386 0:0.8.6d-3.lvn8 set to be updated
> --> Processing Dependency: libx264.so.56 for package: vlc-core
> ---> Package pulseaudio-libs.i386 0:0.9.7-0.17.svn20071017.fc8 set to be
> updated
> --> Finished Dependency Resolution
> Error: Missing Dependency: libx264.so.56 is needed by package vlc-core
> Error: Missing Dependency: libx264.so.56 is needed by package ffmpeg-libs
> [root@localhost ~]#
>
> I see the problems. How does an expert fix these?
>
> Karl

Hi Karl. Not sure what the fix is. My VLC on F8 was installed from freshrpms
repo. libx264.so.56 doesn't exist on my F8. I do have /usr/lib/libx264.so.55
though. This comes from the package x234-0.0.0-0.3.20070529.fc7. (ignore the
fc7 suffix, as that's just the latest version of x234 that is on F8)

On the face of it, it looks like VLC from the Livna repo is looking for a
newer version of the x234 package.

I don't really like suggesting this, but it may be worth disabling the Livna
repo, and re-enabling the freshrpms one, and trying to install VLC from
there.

As I say, I have VLC installed ok from Freshrpms repo on F8, and it works with
no problems.

Do you remember where you installed VLC from originally?


All the best.

Nigel.

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Hello!

Could you please help me with a Pulseaudio problem:

My setup is a Fedora 9 system on a laptop IBM X61, installed from
a livecd. My default init level is 3, and I use console most of the
time.

When I do # init 5; I get the following errors, and I have no sound
under GNOME:

Nov 10 11:57:48 lapx pulseaudio[3321]: polkit.c: Cannot set UID on
session obj
t.
Nov 10 11:57:48 lapx pulseaudio[3321]: main.c: setrlimit(RLIMIT_NICE,
(31, 31)
failed: Operation not permitted
Nov 10 11:57:48 lapx pulseaudio[3321]: main.c:
setrlimit(RLIMIT_RTPRIO, (9, 9)
failed: Operation not permitted
Nov 10 11:57:50 lapx gdm-simple-greeter[3244]: WARNING: Unable to
parse histor
(null) 25#012
Nov 10 12:00:25 lapx pulseaudio[3454]: alsa-util.c: Error opening PCM
device h
0: No such file or directory
Nov 10 12:00:25 lapx pulseaudio[3454]: module.c: Failed to load
module "module-
alsa-sink" (argument: "device_id=0
sink_name=alsa_output.pci_8086_284b_sound_car
d_0_alsa_playback_0"): initialization failed.
Nov 10 12:00:25 lapx pulseaudio[3454]: alsa-util.c: Error opening PCM
device hw:
0: No such file or directory
Nov 10 12:00:25 lapx pulseaudio[3454]: module.c: Failed to load
module "module-
alsa-source" (argument: "device_id=0
source_name=alsa_input.pci_8086_284b_sound_
card_0_alsa_capture_0"): initialization failed.

In my /etc/selinux/conf, I have 'SELINUX=disabled'.

I've set gdm and lrs (the latter is my only real user) to be members of
pulse-rt group.

What could I try to solve this problem?

Lars

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Hello!

I'm still working at the same problem. I've now uninstall pulseaudio,
and sound works properly on console, but not in GNOME. I cannot see
any log output about that in /var/log/messages. Could someone please
explain to me how to get sound working in GNOME without pulseaudio?

Lars

lars.bjorndal@broadpark.no (Lars Bjørndal) writes:

> Hello!
>
> Could you please help me with a Pulseaudio problem:
>
> My setup is a Fedora 9 system on a laptop IBM X61, installed from
> a livecd. My default init level is 3, and I use console most of the
> time.
>
> When I do # init 5; I get the following errors, and I have no sound
> under GNOME:
>
> Nov 10 11:57:48 lapx pulseaudio[3321]: polkit.c: Cannot set UID on
> session obj
> t.
> Nov 10 11:57:48 lapx pulseaudio[3321]: main.c: setrlimit(RLIMIT_NICE,
> (31, 31)
> failed: Operation not permitted
> Nov 10 11:57:48 lapx pulseaudio[3321]: main.c:
> setrlimit(RLIMIT_RTPRIO, (9, 9)
> failed: Operation not permitted
> Nov 10 11:57:50 lapx gdm-simple-greeter[3244]: WARNING: Unable to
> parse histor
> (null) 25#012
> Nov 10 12:00:25 lapx pulseaudio[3454]: alsa-util.c: Error opening PCM
> device h
> 0: No such file or directory
> Nov 10 12:00:25 lapx pulseaudio[3454]: module.c: Failed to load
> module "module-
> alsa-sink" (argument: "device_id=0
> sink_name=alsa_output.pci_8086_284b_sound_car
> d_0_alsa_playback_0"): initialization failed.
> Nov 10 12:00:25 lapx pulseaudio[3454]: alsa-util.c: Error opening PCM
> device hw:
> 0: No such file or directory
> Nov 10 12:00:25 lapx pulseaudio[3454]: module.c: Failed to load
> module "module-
> alsa-source" (argument: "device_id=0
> source_name=alsa_input.pci_8086_284b_sound_
> card_0_alsa_capture_0"): initialization failed.
>
> In my /etc/selinux/conf, I have 'SELINUX=disabled'.
>
> I've set gdm and lrs (the latter is my only real user) to be members of
> pulse-rt group.
>
> What could I try to solve this problem?

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On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 10:28 AM, Ng Oon-Ee <ngoonee@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> If you want to read up on the different sound components, just do a
> google search. There's tons of articles out there, some very good,
> mostly a bit crap. Lennart Pottering (dev for Pulse) has a
> particularly good one I recall. Most on Arch wouldn't like his
> conclusions though.
>

I collected some article/blogs about pulseaudio, in case anyone is interested.

1) PA detractor (both articles have been slashdotted)
http://insanecoding.blogspot.com/2007/05/sorry-state-of-sound-in-linux.html
http://insanecoding.blogspot.com/2009/06/state-of-sound-in-linux-not-so-sorry.html

2) PA defenders
interview of Lennart Poettering (PA dev at redhat)
http://jaboutboul.blogspot.com/2009/05/sound-of-fedora-11.html
his blog : http://0pointer.de/blog/projects
Many info about PA there, just one example :
http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/guide-to-sound-apis.html

blog of colin guthr (another PA dev) : http://colin.guthr.ie/tag/pulseaudio/
Also many interesting articles, for example :
http://colin.guthr.ie/2009/08/sound-on-linux-anti-fud-calm-certainty-and-confidence/
(answer to 1))
http://colin.guthr.ie/2009/08/sound-on-linux-is-confusing-defuzzing-part-1-alsa/
http://colin.guthr.ie/2009/08/sound-on-linux-is-confusing-defuzzing-part-2-pulseaudio/

------------------
If you are just interested about getting PA working, and not about the
how and why, you should probably just read the following wiki, instead
of all the links above :
http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PulseAudio
http://www.pulseaudio.org/wiki/PerfectSetup

A last newbie posting.

I surfed the devel mailing list archive.
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-studio-devel/2010-February/002220.html
For 64 Studio (AFAIK it's the only audio distro beside Ubuntu Studio,
that is based on a .deb system and supports amd64 architecture, but only
i386), PulseAudio is disabled. It's making things much easier for users.

OT: To have the choice between JACK1 and JACK2 would be good to, AFAIK
there's no distro supporting this.

- Ralf


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Well Morgan Gangwere

since all of us Arch users understand this greatly important need to play a 13
year game on an 11 year old machine, we should rollback all changes and send
pulseaudio in AUR where it belongs.

I mean, we can't leave behind every cheap computer user who can't be bothered
to buy even a 5 years old used machine, can we? I mean, Linux is about
supporting antics isn't it?

We should accomondate those needs, because we might lose this kind of user. He
might just go and install Windows 7 on his coppermine. I mean, Windows always
supported 11 year old pcs, why Arch wont?

Please developers, reconsider.

Excerpts from christos.kotsaris's message of 2010-11-29 08:05:40 +0100:
> On a more serious mode now:
>
> As the devs themselves said, pulseaudio is optional, unless you are using
> GNOME, which requires Pulseaudio upstream. There is nothing clearer than that.
> Go blame GNOME developers.
>
> There is something i noticed. Morgan Gandwere is a Debian convert... That
> explains a lot of things actually.
>
> Debian is known to modify every possible package, since Debian maintainers are
> more wise and of course they know better than upstream developers about
> upstream software.
>
> Debian is known to fork a package when some upstream developer does not accept
> a debian maintainer's POS patch. Then the package is left to rott and die,
> since the debian maintainer is not able to develop it.
>
> Debian users are used to this mentality. That explains why someone with this
> background believes that a distribution should modify upstream to fit its
> maintainers whims.
>
> Sometimes there have been packages i wanted that didn't make part of Arch,
> even though in my opinion they should. For example, libxft-lcd was in
> community, while lib32-libxft-lcd was not. I asked in the forum to include
> that too, but instead, libxft-lcd went to AUR also. I didn't bitch about it, i
> just use AUR and that's it. One can't expect a whole distribution to
> accomondate his personal needs.
>
> So pulseaudio haters, since pulseaudio is optional, the only reason you
> complain is that you don't want it in extra, you don't want to install
> libpulse since you cant afford 1MB disk space, and you also don't want media
> packages compiled with pulse support because of a purely theoritical bloat.
>
> Well, you can't expect the distro to remain behind the times and not include
> proper (optional) pulse support for these reasons. If 1 mb of disk space and
> tiny bits of memory bloat in executables is such a waste for you, you could
> recompile those packages, or even better, try Gentoo. I hear Gentoo is really
> fast and without bloat. After 60 hours of compiling your apps start 5ns
> faster. Great!

I guess I am one of those pulse-haters. I don't care whether it's in
[extra], some other official repo or not since I simply don't need it.
But now mplayer pulls in libpulse, and I have no idea which consequences
this could have. I don't see why I need to have libs for a
soundserver that I have no use for floating around on my machine. It is
at best unnecessary and does nothing, at worst.. I don't know. I hope I
don't need to install GNOME to turn it off or something.. (gconf and
stuff).

On Mon, 2010-11-29 at 10:09 +0100, Philipp Überbacher wrote:
> I guess I am one of those pulse-haters. I don't care whether it's in
> [extra], some other official repo or not since I simply don't need it.
> But now mplayer pulls in libpulse, and I have no idea which consequences
> this could have. I don't see why I need to have libs for a
> soundserver that I have no use for floating around on my machine. It is
> at best unnecessary and does nothing, at worst.. I don't know. I hope I
> don't need to install GNOME to turn it off or something.. (gconf and
> stuff).

Sorry, but this is plain.
When GNOME switched to pulse, we made the choice to boycot it and patch
our applications to use GStreamer instead. We still do that with our
GNOME packages, as we still don't want to force pulseaudio on systems.
The reason for libpulse is that without pulseaudio installed, it will
not have any function besides offering optional support for pulseaudio.
No pulseaudio with libpulse just means no pulseaudio.
We are the first binary distribution that offers you the complete choice
of pulse or not. There's not any binary distribution out there that
dares to implement pulseaudio this way. Either they force it up your ass
completely, which is the way upstream wants, or the don't support it at
all, which we used to do before.

If you don't want that tiny lib on your system, be my guest, recompile
all your mediaplayers to get rid of all those optional codecs for media
you don't use. Those are useless libs too, but somehow nobody complains
about that.

On Mon, 2010-11-29 at 10:21 +0100, Jan de Groot wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-11-29 at 10:09 +0100, Philipp Überbacher wrote:
> > I guess I am one of those pulse-haters. I don't care whether it's in
> > [extra], some other official repo or not since I simply don't need it.
> > But now mplayer pulls in libpulse, and I have no idea which consequences
> > this could have. I don't see why I need to have libs for a
> > soundserver that I have no use for floating around on my machine. It is
> > at best unnecessary and does nothing, at worst.. I don't know. I hope I
> > don't need to install GNOME to turn it off or something.. (gconf and
> > stuff).
>
> Sorry, but this is plain.
> When GNOME switched to pulse, we made the choice to boycot it and patch
> our applications to use GStreamer instead. We still do that with our
> GNOME packages, as we still don't want to force pulseaudio on systems.
> The reason for libpulse is that without pulseaudio installed, it will
> not have any function besides offering optional support for pulseaudio.
> No pulseaudio with libpulse just means no pulseaudio.
> We are the first binary distribution that offers you the complete choice
> of pulse or not. There's not any binary distribution out there that
> dares to implement pulseaudio this way. Either they force it up your ass
> completely, which is the way upstream wants, or the don't support it at
> all, which we used to do before.
>
> If you don't want that tiny lib on your system, be my guest, recompile
> all your mediaplayers to get rid of all those optional codecs for media
> you don't use. Those are useless libs too, but somehow nobody complains
> about that.
>
Good luck getting pulse-haters to understand that a 1.14 MB package
isn't going to kill their system though.

Thanks JGC for your work on this. I didn't think it was possible to have
such choice, and it looks like you've jumped through quite a few
packaging hoops to get here.

On Mon, 2010-11-29 at 17:25 +0800, Ng Oon-Ee wrote:
> Good luck getting pulse-haters to understand that a 1.14 MB package
> isn't going to kill their system though.
>
> Thanks JGC for your work on this. I didn't think it was possible to
> have
> such choice, and it looks like you've jumped through quite a few
> packaging hoops to get here.

I haven't done anything in this, as I have always avoided pulse like the
plague. It was Jan Steffens who did all the work. I brought him on the
team to take over GNOME together with Ionut, so I can focus on Xorg with
my limited time.