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Old 03-31-2010, 01:06 PM
Bruno Wolff III
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 08:38:50 -0400,
Margaret Doll <Margaret_Doll@brown.edu> wrote:
> I did get the Dell E2210H display working on an F2 system. However,
> the display does not fill up the screen properly.
> I managed to get the display working by modifying the Section
> "Screen"/"Display"/Modes "1920x1080". I also modified the
> "Monitor"/"Display Size".
>
> I noticed that the settings that I put into /etc/X11/xorg.conf seem
> to have nothing to do with the gui from System/Display. Those Mode
> entries were "1280x960" and "1024x768" . How is the gui and
> xorg.conf related?

xorg.conf can specify allowed and prefered modes for a device. If you
don't define what a device is capable of doing than some assumptions are
made that will likely be safe. These safe assumptions will generally limit
the frequencies allowed so that you won't be able to use 1920x1080. If
you want that you'll have to provide data on your monitor.

Also even at specific resolutions, you can run at different refresh rates.
At least on some monitors the refresh rate affects how things are centered
on the display. Usually there is a way to adjust the display so that the
output fills up the display.
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Old 03-31-2010, 01:23 PM
"Dave Higton"
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

On 2010-03-31, Bruno Wolff wrote:

> xorg.conf can specify allowed and prefered modes for a device. If you
> don't define what a device is capable of doing than some
> assumptions are
> made that will likely be safe. These safe assumptions will
> generally limit
> the frequencies allowed so that you won't be able to use 1920x1080.

I'd suggest that the assumptions are well out of date and should be
re-thought. They tend to make the display invisible because it's
out of the range of some modern monitors. Who uses 640 * 480
nowadays? Who uses CRT monitors nowadays? (The "safety" issue,
I believe, related to CRT monitors from about 30 years ago that
responded badly if driven slightly out of range.)

Dave


NICE CTI Systems UK Limited ("NICE") is registered in England under company number, 3403044. The registered office of NICE is at Tollbar Way, Hedge End, Southampton, Hampshire SO30 2ZP.

Confidentiality: This communication and any attachments are intended for the above-named persons only and may be confidential and/or legally privileged. Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of NICE. If this communication has come to you in error you must take no action based on it, nor must you copy or show it to anyone; please delete/destroy and inform the sender by e-mail immediately.

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Old 03-31-2010, 01:36 PM
Bruno Wolff III
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 14:23:07 +0100,
Dave Higton <DAVE.HIGTON@nice.com> wrote:
> On 2010-03-31, Bruno Wolff wrote:
>
> > xorg.conf can specify allowed and prefered modes for a device. If you
> > don't define what a device is capable of doing than some
> > assumptions are
> > made that will likely be safe. These safe assumptions will
> > generally limit
> > the frequencies allowed so that you won't be able to use 1920x1080.
>
> I'd suggest that the assumptions are well out of date and should be
> re-thought. They tend to make the display invisible because it's
> out of the range of some modern monitors. Who uses 640 * 480
> nowadays? Who uses CRT monitors nowadays? (The "safety" issue,
> I believe, related to CRT monitors from about 30 years ago that
> responded badly if driven slightly out of range.)

Note the original poster is talking about FC2, so it is really out of date.
With recent versions of Fedora the info is obtained from the monitor, so
that only very old monitors need xorg.conf setup.
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Old 03-31-2010, 01:48 PM
"Dave Higton"
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

On 2010-03-31 Bruno Wolff wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 14:23:07 +0100,
> Dave Higton <DAVE.HIGTON@nice.com> wrote:
> > On 2010-03-31, Bruno Wolff wrote:
> >
> > > xorg.conf can specify allowed and prefered modes for a
> device. If you
> > > don't define what a device is capable of doing than some
> > > assumptions are
> > > made that will likely be safe. These safe assumptions will
> > > generally limit
> > > the frequencies allowed so that you won't be able to use
> 1920x1080.
> >
> > I'd suggest that the assumptions are well out of date and should be
> > re-thought. They tend to make the display invisible because it's
> > out of the range of some modern monitors. Who uses 640 * 480
> > nowadays? Who uses CRT monitors nowadays? (The "safety" issue,
> > I believe, related to CRT monitors from about 30 years ago that
> > responded badly if driven slightly out of range.)
>
> Note the original poster is talking about FC2, so it is
> really out of date.
> With recent versions of Fedora the info is obtained from the
> monitor, so
> that only very old monitors need xorg.conf setup.

Ah, of course.

Dave


NICE CTI Systems UK Limited ("NICE") is registered in England under company number, 3403044. The registered office of NICE is at Tollbar Way, Hedge End, Southampton, Hampshire SO30 2ZP.

Confidentiality: This communication and any attachments are intended for the above-named persons only and may be confidential and/or legally privileged. Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of NICE. If this communication has come to you in error you must take no action based on it, nor must you copy or show it to anyone; please delete/destroy and inform the sender by e-mail immediately.

Monitoring: NICE may monitor incoming and outgoing e-mails.

Viruses: Although we have taken steps toward ensuring that this e-mail and attachments are free from any virus, we advise that in keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
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Old 03-31-2010, 01:54 PM
Margaret Doll
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

Thanks for all the information.

On Mar 31, 2010, at 9:36 AM, Bruno Wolff III wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 14:23:07 +0100,
> Dave Higton <DAVE.HIGTON@nice.com> wrote:
>> On 2010-03-31, Bruno Wolff wrote:
>>
>>> xorg.conf can specify allowed and prefered modes for a device. If
>>> you
>>> don't define what a device is capable of doing than some
>>> assumptions are
>>> made that will likely be safe. These safe assumptions will
>>> generally limit
>>> the frequencies allowed so that you won't be able to use 1920x1080.
>>
>> I'd suggest that the assumptions are well out of date and should be
>> re-thought. They tend to make the display invisible because it's
>> out of the range of some modern monitors. Who uses 640 * 480
>> nowadays? Who uses CRT monitors nowadays? (The "safety" issue,
>> I believe, related to CRT monitors from about 30 years ago that
>> responded badly if driven slightly out of range.)
>
> Note the original poster is talking about FC2, so it is really out
> of date.
> With recent versions of Fedora the info is obtained from the
> monitor, so
> that only very old monitors need xorg.conf setup.
> --
> users mailing list
> users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options:
> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users
> Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines

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Old 03-31-2010, 03:00 PM
Tim
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

On Wed, 2010-03-31 at 14:23 +0100, Dave Higton wrote:
> Who uses CRT monitors nowadays?

I still do, they look better. And I'm not about to throw away monitors
that are working well, for outrageously overpriced, and crappy LCD
monitors that might die off within two years. The hype about lifetimes
of monitors is just hype, we've got CRTs that have been going for many
many years, and LCDs that have crapped out within a couple.

> The "safety" issue, I believe, related to CRT monitors from about 30
> years ago that responded badly if driven slightly out of range.

No, that problem still existed in the 2000s, and probably still does.
I've even read about LCD panels being wrecked by non-spec timing, though
I'm a bit doubtful of it.

--
[tim@localhost ~]$ uname -r
2.6.27.25-78.2.56.fc9.i686

Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored. I
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Old 03-31-2010, 03:13 PM
"Dave Higton"
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

On 2010-03-31 Tim wrote:

> On Wed, 2010-03-31 at 14:23 +0100, Dave Higton wrote:
> > Who uses CRT monitors nowadays?
>
> I still do, they look better. And I'm not about to throw
> away monitors
> that are working well, for outrageously overpriced, and crappy LCD
> monitors that might die off within two years. The hype about
> lifetimes
> of monitors is just hype, we've got CRTs that have been going for many
> many years, and LCDs that have crapped out within a couple.

You're lucky with your CRTs. The ones I've seen that were a few
years old, had bad screen burn, plus a nasty colour cast as one
of the electron guns had lost emission. I was glad to have my
last CRT monitor replaced here (by an LCD) because it had bad
Moiré patterning, which could only be cure by defocussing it
badly.

Having used CRTs and LCDs, I would never go back to CRT without
a fight. Fortunately LCDs are (a) so cheap (I don't understand
your comment about outrageously overpriced LCDs), (b) the only
type commonly available.

(Sorry, OT...)

Dave


NICE CTI Systems UK Limited ("NICE") is registered in England under company number, 3403044. The registered office of NICE is at Tollbar Way, Hedge End, Southampton, Hampshire SO30 2ZP.

Confidentiality: This communication and any attachments are intended for the above-named persons only and may be confidential and/or legally privileged. Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of NICE. If this communication has come to you in error you must take no action based on it, nor must you copy or show it to anyone; please delete/destroy and inform the sender by e-mail immediately.

Monitoring: NICE may monitor incoming and outgoing e-mails.

Viruses: Although we have taken steps toward ensuring that this e-mail and attachments are free from any virus, we advise that in keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
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Old 04-01-2010, 08:57 PM
Matt Domsch
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 03:25:48PM -0400, Margaret Doll wrote:
> We are trying to attach a Dell E2210H monitor to a Dell X260 Optiplex
> which is running 2.6.10-1.771_FC2.
>
> I have found the drivers for Windows but not for Fedora. Where can I
> access monitor drivers for Fedora?

As noted in this thread, there are no separate "drivers" to install
for this monitor.

I did update the hwdata MonitorsDB database file in August 2009 to
include these lines:

Dell; Dell E2210H(Analog); DELD030; 30.0-83.0; 50.0-76.0; 1
Dell; Dell E2210H(Digital); DELD031; 30.0-83.0; 50.0-76.0; 1

On FC2 I couldn't begin to tell you where the MonitorsDB file is
though...

Thanks,
Matt

P.S.: I do periodically grab all the Windows *.inf files for all Dell
monitors, as published on support.dell.com, and update the MonitorsDB
file in the hwdata package with them. On any newish Linux version
though, this data is extracted from talking to the monitor directly,
rather than looked up in the MonitorsDB file. The Windows .inf format
for monitors is fairly limited in terms of describing the various
modes, and in particular, native resolution, of a given LCD; the Linux
MonitorsDB format even more so. Much better to use a newer version of
Xorg that can do the ECC directly.

--
Matt Domsch
Technology Strategist
Dell | Office of the CTO
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Old 04-01-2010, 08:57 PM
Matt Domsch
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 03:25:48PM -0400, Margaret Doll wrote:
> We are trying to attach a Dell E2210H monitor to a Dell X260 Optiplex
> which is running 2.6.10-1.771_FC2.
>
> I have found the drivers for Windows but not for Fedora. Where can I
> access monitor drivers for Fedora?

As noted in this thread, there are no separate "drivers" to install
for this monitor.

I did update the hwdata MonitorsDB database file in August 2009 to
include these lines:

Dell; Dell E2210H(Analog); DELD030; 30.0-83.0; 50.0-76.0; 1
Dell; Dell E2210H(Digital); DELD031; 30.0-83.0; 50.0-76.0; 1

On FC2 I couldn't begin to tell you where the MonitorsDB file is
though...

Thanks,
Matt

P.S.: I do periodically grab all the Windows *.inf files for all Dell
monitors, as published on support.dell.com, and update the MonitorsDB
file in the hwdata package with them. On any newish Linux version
though, this data is extracted from talking to the monitor directly,
rather than looked up in the MonitorsDB file. The Windows .inf format
for monitors is fairly limited in terms of describing the various
modes, and in particular, native resolution, of a given LCD; the Linux
MonitorsDB format even more so. Much better to use a newer version of
Xorg that can do the ECC directly.

--
Matt Domsch
Technology Strategist
Dell | Office of the CTO
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Old 04-05-2010, 12:10 PM
Tim
 
Default Looking for a monitor driver

Dave Higton:

> You're lucky with your CRTs. The ones I've seen that were a few
> years old, had bad screen burn, plus a nasty colour cast as one
> of the electron guns had lost emission. I was glad to have my
> last CRT monitor replaced here (by an LCD) because it had bad
> Moiré patterning, which could only be cure by defocussing it
> badly.
>
> Having used CRTs and LCDs, I would never go back to CRT without
> a fight. Fortunately LCDs are (a) so cheap (I don't understand
> your comment about outrageously overpriced LCDs), (b) the only
> type commonly available.

I've got CRT monitors, here, of 1980s vintage, still with excellent
pictures. Of course, I've seen also seen bad ones, cheap and nasty
monitors which were always crappy, from the word go. And middling ones
which deteriorated in short order. But I'm certainly not going to say
that "CRT monitors are bad" simply because the bad ones were. Only a
few years ago I gave away a valve CRT monitor from the 1960s which still
had a razor sharp image.

I've seen plenty of bad LCDs. Everything from: Only the highest
resolution ones don't look like you're staring at a fluorescent tube
through flywire. Glaringly obvious dead pixels, or even a whole third
of the screen all magenta. The colour response being quite crap
(something that standard TV LCDs go to all sorts of tricks to try and
get around). Very limited angle of view without getting strange
distortions - thankfully that's getting better, but it's still not
there.

While it was still possible to buy both types, it was common to see that
LCDs two or three times the price of a CRT looked worse than the CRT.
The cheap ones really looked crap. Shops stopped setting up side by
side comparisons, because even the untrained eye could see the
difference. To get what I will accept as a decent picture, on an LCD,
I'd have to pay three times as much as what I consider acceptable.

It's the "Emperor's new clothes" all over again.

--
[tim@localhost ~]$ uname -r
2.6.27.25-78.2.56.fc9.i686

Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored. I
read messages from the public lists.



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