Robin Laing wrote:
> I would like the option to rolling release or upgrade. I say this
> because of my family. My wife is not with the install and I have to
> think of her. My daughter installed F12 herself on a new laptop.
>
> My wife was running FC7 until I re-installed to F12 but moving to 12 I
> would rather she be able to use a rolling update.

This is perhaps better accomplished by using a separate partition
for your data and system. IOW, perhaps you should put /home, and
perhaps /usr/local and /opt, on separate partitions. This is a good
idea, anyway, because then if you have the room, you can have two
"root" partitions, and upgrade/install on only one of them. If the
new system has some problems, then you can revert which one you boot.

[...]

> I guess what I am saying is there needs to be a way for the new user to
> keep their machine updated without all the headaches. This is why some
> will stick with Windows. Only needs to be re-installed every year.
> And you have to pay for any upgrades.

Well, if you don't like churn, then FC is possibly not the best distro
for you.

Mike
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On Tue, 2010-03-23 at 13:56 -0600, Mike McCarty wrote:

> This is perhaps better accomplished by using a separate partition
> for your data and system. IOW, perhaps you should put /home, and
> perhaps /usr/local and /opt, on separate partitions. This is a good
> idea, anyway, because then if you have the room, you can have two
> "root" partitions, and upgrade/install on only one of them. If the
> new system has some problems, then you can revert which one you boot.

That's not quite as easy as it sounds, because when you log in to a new
version of GNOME (and presumably KDE as well), it will alter the files
in your home directory in ways that may be incompatible with going back
to the old version. For that reason, I usually create a new user account
to log in as under the new OS until I am sure it is working correctly,
and only then log in with my normal account on the new OS.

These days, I have had very good luck with just doing an in-place
upgrade, so that's what I usually do now. That worked with no issues
when I went from F10 to F11, and again to go from F11 to F12.

--Greg


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Greg Woods wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-03-23 at 13:56 -0600, Mike McCarty wrote:
>
>> This is perhaps better accomplished by using a separate partition
>> for your data and system. IOW, perhaps you should put /home, and

[...]

> That's not quite as easy as it sounds, because when you log in to a new
> version of GNOME (and presumably KDE as well), it will alter the files
> in your home directory in ways that may be incompatible with going back
> to the old version. For that reason, I usually create a new user account
> to log in as under the new OS until I am sure it is working correctly,
> and only then log in with my normal account on the new OS.

That's good advice. Another piece of advice is

NEVER alter your system unless you have a verified good
full backup + incremental (or delta).

Mike
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On 03/23/2010 01:25 PM, Greg Woods wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-03-23 at 13:56 -0600, Mike McCarty wrote:
>
>> This is perhaps better accomplished by using a separate partition
>> for your data and system. IOW, perhaps you should put /home, and
>> perhaps /usr/local and /opt, on separate partitions. This is a good
>> idea, anyway, because then if you have the room, you can have two
>> "root" partitions, and upgrade/install on only one of them. If the
>> new system has some problems, then you can revert which one you boot.
>
> That's not quite as easy as it sounds, because when you log in to a new
> version of GNOME (and presumably KDE as well), it will alter the files
> in your home directory in ways that may be incompatible with going back
> to the old version. For that reason, I usually create a new user account
> to log in as under the new OS until I am sure it is working correctly,
> and only then log in with my normal account on the new OS.

Which is another reason to back up your system. REGULARLY! If the
defecation hits the impeller, you can restore.

> These days, I have had very good luck with just doing an in-place
> upgrade, so that's what I usually do now. That worked with no issues
> when I went from F10 to F11, and again to go from F11 to F12.

Provided the /boot partition was big enough, yes. The default disk
partitioning left the /boot partition just a tad too small for many
people to use yum to upgrade.

Fedora is the sharp edge of development for Red Hat. You will get
hurt by it eventually. With F12, you're dancing on the edge of a
sword--but at least you have shoes on! With F13-beta and F14-rawhide,
you're barefoot and the sword has been sharpened. :-p

If your system is mission-critical or you need stability, you stick
with RHEL or CentOS and recognize it'll be a bit stodgy, but pretty
reliable. You won't have all the whiz bang toys, but it won't bite you
(often or too hard).
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On Tue, 2010-03-23 at 14:27 -0700, Rick Stevens wrote:

> Provided the /boot partition was big enough, yes. The default disk
> partitioning left the /boot partition just a tad too small for many
> people to use yum to upgrade.

I didn't use yum, I booted off the new DVD and did an upgrade from
there. I never ran into the "/boot too small" issue.

--Greg


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On 03/24/2010 02:57 AM, Rick Stevens wrote:
>
> Provided the /boot partition was big enough, yes. The default disk
> partitioning left the /boot partition just a tad too small for many
> people to use yum to upgrade.
>

That's not the case anymore. The new default for /boot in Fedora 13
will be 500 MB.

Rahul

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On 03/23/2010 03:11 PM, Greg Woods wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-03-23 at 14:27 -0700, Rick Stevens wrote:
>
>> Provided the /boot partition was big enough, yes. The default disk
>> partitioning left the /boot partition just a tad too small for many
>> people to use yum to upgrade.
>
> I didn't use yum, I booted off the new DVD and did an upgrade from
> there. I never ran into the "/boot too small" issue.

Yeah, the small boot actually only gets hit if you "yum --preupgrade"
(or whatever the appropriate parlance is...I forget offhand).
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On Tuesday 23 March 2010, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
>On 03/24/2010 02:57 AM, Rick Stevens wrote:
>> Provided the /boot partition was big enough, yes. The default disk
>> partitioning left the /boot partition just a tad too small for many
>> people to use yum to upgrade.
>
>That's not the case anymore. The new default for /boot in Fedora 13
>will be 500 MB.
>
>Rahul
>
Thank you thank you thank you thank you, and before I forget it thank you
very much.

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On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 13:56:08 -0600, Mike McCarty wrote:

>> I guess what I am saying is there needs to be a way for the new user to
>> keep their machine updated without all the headaches. This is why some
>> will stick with Windows. Only needs to be re-installed every year.
>> And you have to pay for any upgrades.
>
> Well, if you don't like churn, then FC is possibly not the best distro
> for you.

Exactly why I no longer run FC. The sole reason I use ubuntu is that you
can upgrade without re-installing. Why hasn't this been implemented in
FC yet?


-Thufir

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On 03/23/2010 11:49 PM, Thufir wrote:
> Exactly why I no longer run FC. The sole reason I use ubuntu is that you
> can upgrade without re-installing. Why hasn't this been implemented in
> FC yet?
>

Probably because Fedora Core isn't maintained anymore


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