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Old 09-02-2012, 05:19 AM
Arnav Kalra
 
Default Improve Fedora Project

We need to have more ways to interact with users.

Ask fedora is a good way to solve problems.

Now we need a way for users to tell fedora what to do.

We can have mods whose job is to remove all useless suggestions

We also need liaisons from different groups to respond to users' suggestions.

What should we call it?

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Old 09-02-2012, 05:47 PM
Kevin Fenzi
 
Default Improve Fedora Project

On Sun, 2 Sep 2012 01:08:19 +0100
Álvaro Castillo <netsys@fedoraproject.org> wrote:

> Yes, maybe get in touch on board and ask, Why not or Why yes about
> each suggestions....

ok, let me throw in my input here on your suggestions.
I think some of them might better to (re)posted to the board list or
devel lists or other places. I tried to note those in each one.

Note that this is just me, I'm not talking for anyone else.

1. Control panel. This sounds interesting. Perhaps you could contact
the owners of the various 'system-config' tools and see if they might
work on something? See also, this feature which wasn't ready for f18:

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/SystemConfigCleanup

2. Tool to disable selinux

I think the selinux troubleshoot tools are pretty good. Does the 'allow
this' setting in there not work for these cases?

3. Multilingual support in Fedora

This has been driven by two things: space on media is very limited. If
we added languages it would grow to large to easily distribute. If
we dropped cd's and looked at 1gb as a target perhaps these would have
space? Secondly, Gnome has moved away from letting you choose a
language on login, they have you login then choose language. That would
be something to take up with gnome design folks.

4. K3B Setup

I've not heard of these issues. If this is a bug, we should just fix
it. Logged in users should have permissions to burn cds.

5. Gparted on LiveCD

I think it would be good to include all those tools on the live media.
I'll mention it to the spins group...

6. Spins program utilities, Fedora

We cannot include other repos in things we ship in Fedora for legal
reasons, so I don't think thats going to happen. Anyone is welcome to
revive revisor, but It will take some developer work to get it back up
and running.

7. Apper problems

Have you reported this to the apper/kde developers?

8. GNOME Shell on Fedora

including gnome-tweak-tool has been suggested to the desktop folks
several times, but they do not wish it to be included. You can try
asking again on the desktop list. They feel the 'out of box' setup is
right, and they don't want to encourage people to 'tweak' it.

If you wish something besides gnome to be the default offering, feel
free to bring it up on the board list. LXDE and Xfce are great, but
they have a LOT less manpower than KDE or Gnome.

9. Kernel profiles

This would be a query for the fedora kernel list. I know they would not
want to carry non upstreamed patches, but perhaps there are things they
would want to enable. If you had benchmarks that would be even
better. http://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/kernel

10. Mobile platform

I think a Fedora app would be cool. You would need to find people to
write it. I'm not sure if it could be an iOS app, as I think they
refuse open source programs, but we could offer it somewhere ourselves.
It could tie into all kinds of places in Fedora...

11. Documentation, guides, volumes...et

Docs can always be improved. I'm not sure I follow your full suggestion
here, can you expand on it?

12. Mobile Web Portal adapted.

This would be a great suggestion for the websites team.
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/websites

13. See all downloads

The design of the website was to not smother people with too many
choices. So, the default is to just offer the default things. If we
make the all page show first some people will become confused at all
the options. You could bring this up to websites though.
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/websites

14. Promote Koji (OBS)

Sure, we could promote koji more. People could use it for scratch
builds. However, we don't want them using it for non free stuff, and
koji only makes rpms, not other formats.

15. Announce SUGAR

Agreed. More press around our sugar offering would be good.

16. Video of Fedora (Marketing)

There was a fedora video group working on this:
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Video perhaps they could start working on
marketing type videos.

kevin
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Old 09-02-2012, 06:12 PM
Arnav Kalra
 
Default Improve Fedora Project

1. Control panel. This sounds interesting. Perhaps you could contact

the owners of the various 'system-config' tools and see if they might

work on something? See also, this feature which wasn't ready for f18:



https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/SystemConfigCleanup
Mandriva/ROSA/Mageia have a nice control panel. Even Opensuse has one. We should implement this.



*


2. Tool to disable selinux



I think the selinux troubleshoot tools are pretty good. Does the 'allow

this' setting in there not work for these cases?
I agree. Disabling SElinux is usually not needed.






3. Multilingual support in Fedora



This has been driven by two things: space on media is very limited. If

we added languages it would grow to large to easily distribute. If

we dropped cd's and looked at 1gb as a target perhaps these would have

space?
We can have 2 images or maybe 2 cds. I doubt people use languages other than english.
*

5. Gparted on LiveCD



I think it would be good to include all those tools on the live media.

I'll mention it to the spins group...

*Very important.
*

8. GNOME Shell on Fedora



including gnome-tweak-tool has been suggested to the desktop folks

several times, but they do not wish it to be included. You can try

asking again on the desktop list. They feel the 'out of box' setup is

right, and they don't want to encourage people to 'tweak' it.



If you wish something besides gnome to be the default offering, feel

free to bring it up on the board list. LXDE and Xfce are great, but

they have a LOT less manpower than KDE or Gnome.
Lxde can be made to look great. I am currently typing this from rosa lxde and it looks awesome. I have never tried mint lxde but i think it also looks good. I think we should focus on a light de like lxde or xfce in addition to a heavy de like gnome.




I also think we should have a portal where people can request new programmes to be packaged for fedora.


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Old 09-03-2012, 03:55 PM
Kevin Fenzi
 
Default Improve Fedora Project

On Sun, 2 Sep 2012 23:42:34 +0530
Arnav Kalra <arnavkalra007@gmail.com> wrote:

> >
> > 1. Control panel. This sounds interesting. Perhaps you could contact
> > the owners of the various 'system-config' tools and see if they
> > might work on something? See also, this feature which wasn't ready
> > for f18:
> >
> > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/SystemConfigCleanup
> >
> Mandriva/ROSA/Mageia have a nice control panel. Even Opensuse has
> one. We should implement this.

Yeah, provided there's developers willing to do the work I think it
sounds like a nice idea.

> > 3. Multilingual support in Fedora
> >
> > This has been driven by two things: space on media is very limited.
> > If we added languages it would grow to large to easily
> > distribute. If we dropped cd's and looked at 1gb as a target
> > perhaps these would have space?
> >
> We can have 2 images or maybe 2 cds. I doubt people use languages
> other than english.

Its not just 2 images tho.

There are currently 11 approved spins:
design-suite desktop kde lxde security soas xfce robotics
scientific-kde electronic-lab games

Each one is made for 32bit and 64 bit. Thats 22.

We have netinstall and dvd install isos. Thats 4 more.

We have multi-live and multi-install, thats 4 more.

Thats 30 images. Producing 30 more would be a pretty large burden on QA
and Release engineering. So, if we are going to make changes, we should
make them on the base images IMHO.

> I also think we should have a portal where people can request new
> programmes to be packaged for fedora.

we do have:
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Package_maintainers_wishlist

kevin
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Old 09-03-2012, 04:05 PM
Álvaro Castillo
 
Default Improve Fedora Project

On Sep 3, 2012 4:56 PM, "Kevin Fenzi" <kevin@scrye.com> wrote:

>

> On Sun, 2 Sep 2012 23:42:34 +0530

> Arnav Kalra <arnavkalra007@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> > >

> > > 1. Control panel. This sounds interesting. Perhaps you could contact

> > > the owners of the various 'system-config' tools and see if they

> > > might work on something? See also, this feature which wasn't ready

> > > for f18:

> > >

> > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/SystemConfigCleanup

> > >

> > Mandriva/ROSA/Mageia have a nice control panel. Even Opensuse has

> > one. We should implement this.

>

> Yeah, provided there's developers willing to do the work I think it

> sounds like a nice idea.

>

> > > 3. Multilingual support in Fedora

> > >

> > > This has been driven by two things: space on media is very limited.

> > > If we added languages it would grow to large to easily

> > > distribute. If we dropped cd's and looked at 1gb as a target

> > > perhaps these would have space?

> > >

> > We can have 2 images or maybe 2 cds. I doubt people use languages

> > other than english.

>

> Its not just 2 images tho.

>

> There are currently 11 approved spins:

> design-suite desktop kde lxde security soas xfce robotics

> scientific-kde electronic-lab games

>

> Each one is made for 32bit and 64 bit. Thats 22.

>

> We have netinstall and dvd install isos. Thats 4 more.

>

> We have multi-live and multi-install, thats 4 more.

>

> Thats 30 images. Producing 30 more would be a pretty large burden on QA

> and Release engineering. So, if we are going to make changes, we should

> make them on the base images IMHO.

>


How do Ubuntu or others distros added multilingual supports on CDs?


> > I also think we should have a portal where people can request new

> > programmes to be packaged for fedora.

>

> we do have:

> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Package_maintainers_wishlist

>

> kevin

>

> --

> marketing mailing list

> marketing@lists.fedoraproject.org

> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing



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Old 09-03-2012, 04:06 PM
Álvaro Castillo
 
Default Improve Fedora Project

Is not just too that each time I want to show Fedora is only on english. Always asking is too on spanish while others distros has got menu to boot on any language.

On Sep 3, 2012 4:56 PM, "Kevin Fenzi" <kevin@scrye.com> wrote:
On Sun, 2 Sep 2012 23:42:34 +0530

Arnav Kalra <arnavkalra007@gmail.com> wrote:



> >

> > 1. Control panel. This sounds interesting. Perhaps you could contact

> > the owners of the various 'system-config' tools and see if they

> > might work on something? See also, this feature which wasn't ready

> > for f18:

> >

> > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/SystemConfigCleanup

> >

> Mandriva/ROSA/Mageia have a nice control panel. Even Opensuse has

> one. We should implement this.



Yeah, provided there's developers willing to do the work I think it

sounds like a nice idea.



> > 3. Multilingual support in Fedora

> >

> > This has been driven by two things: space on media is very limited.

> > If we added languages it would grow to large to easily

> > distribute. If we dropped cd's and looked at 1gb as a target

> > perhaps these would have space?

> >

> We can have 2 images or maybe 2 cds. I doubt people use languages

> other than english.



Its not just 2 images tho.



There are currently 11 approved spins:

design-suite desktop kde lxde security soas xfce robotics

scientific-kde electronic-lab games



Each one is made for 32bit and 64 bit. Thats 22.



We have netinstall and dvd install isos. Thats 4 more.



We have multi-live and multi-install, thats 4 more.



Thats 30 images. Producing 30 more would be a pretty large burden on QA

and Release engineering. So, if we are going to make changes, we should

make them on the base images IMHO.



> I also think we should have a portal where people can request new

> programmes to be packaged for fedora.



we do have:

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Package_maintainers_wishlist



kevin


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Old 09-03-2012, 04:30 PM
Álvaro Castillo
 
Default Improve Fedora Project

On Sep 2, 2012 6:47 PM, "Kevin Fenzi" <kevin@scrye.com> wrote:

>

> On Sun, 2 Sep 2012 01:08:19 +0100

> Álvaro Castillo <netsys@fedoraproject.org> wrote:

>

> > Yes, maybe get in touch on board and ask, Why not or Why yes about

> > each suggestions....

>

> ok, let me throw in my input here on your suggestions.

> I think some of them might better to (re)posted to the board list or

> devel lists or other places. I tried to note those in each one.

>

> Note that this is just me, I'm not talking for anyone else.

>

> 1. Control panel. This sounds interesting. Perhaps you could contact

> the owners of the various 'system-config' tools and see if they might

> work on something? See also, this feature which wasn't ready for f18:

>

> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/SystemConfigCleanup

>

> 2. Tool to disable selinux

>

> I think the selinux troubleshoot tools are pretty good. Does the 'allow

> this' setting in there not work for these cases?


System-settings is gui tools. I know how to disable SELinux from terminal too. YaST provide option to manipulate AppArmor with GUI or ncurses tools.

>

> 3. Multilingual support in Fedora

>

> This has been driven by two things: space on media is very limited. If

> we added languages it would grow to large to easily distribute. If

> we dropped cd's and looked at 1gb as a target perhaps these would have

> space? Secondly, Gnome has moved away from letting you choose a

> language on login, they have you login then choose language. That would

> be something to take up with gnome design folks.

>


Some linux distros such as openSUSE or ubuntu providing multilingual support on CD.


> 4. K3B Setup

>

> I've not heard of these issues. If this is a bug, we should just fix

> it. Logged in users should have permissions to burn cds.

>

> 5. Gparted on LiveCD

>

> I think it would be good to include all those tools on the live media.

> I'll mention it to the spins group...

>

> 6. Spins program utilities, Fedora

>

> We cannot include other repos in things we ship in Fedora for legal

> reasons, so I don't think thats going to happen. Anyone is welcome to

> revive revisor, but It will take some developer work to get it back up

> and running.

>


Ok, maybe legal reasons. But I talk about add button for any user of Fedora can add your own repo as do Revisor tool. Not have on repos dir...et not. Button to add repo only. Each users are responsible of use do of these tool.



> 7. Apper problems

>

> Have you reported this to the apper/kde developers?

>


I see on openSUSE passes too. Seem backend of zypper. I guees could backend yum too.


> 8. GNOME Shell on Fedora

>

> including gnome-tweak-tool has been suggested to the desktop folks

> several times, but they do not wish it to be included. You can try

> asking again on the desktop list. They feel the 'out of box' setup is

> right, and they don't want to encourage people to 'tweak' it.

>


By error of some builders, all pay by they? (talking about of GNOME). If a lot users wants include these tool, dont see for other way. Is not community value that defend Fedora. Gnome tweak tool should stay on Desktop edition. I guess.



> If you wish something besides gnome to be the default offering, feel

> free to bring it up on the board list. LXDE and Xfce are great, but

> they have a LOT less manpower than KDE or Gnome.

>

> 9. Kernel profiles

>

> This would be a query for the fedora kernel list. I know they would not

> want to carry non upstreamed patches, but perhaps there are things they

> would want to enable. If you had benchmarks that would be even

> better. http://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/kernel


I will see. Thanks!


>

> 10. Mobile platform

>

> I think a Fedora app would be cool. You would need to find people to

> write it. I'm not sure if it could be an iOS app, as I think they

> refuse open source programs, but we could offer it somewhere ourselves.

> It could tie into all kinds of places in Fedora...

>


Only not exists iOS. Can see Android too.


> 11. Documentation, guides, volumes...et

>

> Docs can always be improved. I'm not sure I follow your full suggestion

> here, can you expand on it?

>


For example, need show I guess that Fedora can brings is innovates. I think that bit people known that Fedora run as compatibility environment on BSD systems such as FreeBSD, OpenBSD and PC-BSD. Or Fedora first provided -PAE branch kernel, uses first PulseAudio, uses SELinux tool to have a good protection, Fedora and Sugar environment selectes by OLPC project.. And more. And more on lack spanish too..



> 12. Mobile Web Portal adapted.

>

> This would be a great suggestion for the websites team.

> http://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/websites


Will ask here, thanks


>

> 13. See all downloads

>

> The design of the website was to not smother people with too many

> choices. So, the default is to just offer the default things. If we

> make the all page show first some people will become confused at all

> the options. You could bring this up to websites though.

> http://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/websites

>

> 14. Promote Koji (OBS)

>

> Sure, we could promote koji more. People could use it for scratch

> builds. However, we don't want them using it for non free stuff, and

> koji only makes rpms, not other formats.

>


I know that Koji is only build on RPM and is good choice. Libux standard base promotes.RPM as default system package. However, all packagers of Fedora not known Koji exist or some body wants uses it for build packages.



> 15. Announce SUGAR

>

> Agreed. More press around our sugar offering would be good.

>

> 16. Video of Fedora (Marketing)

>

> There was a fedora video group working on this:

> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Video perhaps they could start working on

> marketing type videos.

>

> kevin

>

> --

> marketing mailing list

> marketing@lists.fedoraproject.org

> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing


Out of this. will be interesting know thinks people officialy of Fedora using an plataform as Ubuntu brain storm or Dell... where all can vote your suggestions or ideas.



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Old 09-03-2012, 09:59 PM
Arnav Kalra
 
Default Improve Fedora Project

>Thats 30 images. Producing 30 more would be a pretty large burden on QA

>and Release engineering. So, if we are going to make changes, we should

>make them on the base images IMHO.


Oh, this is a very difficult task. Ubuntu has an office and multilang support inside one cd. How are they able to do it?
Would it be possible for us to add an image which contains only locales? Then this image can be used with any other image. Or maybe we can make the locales available for download on our website.




>For example, need show I guess that Fedora can brings is innovates. I think that bit people known that Fedora run as compatibility environment on BSD >systems such as FreeBSD, OpenBSD and PC-BSD. Or Fedora first provided -PAE branch kernel, uses first PulseAudio, uses SELinux tool to have a >good protection, Fedora and Sugar environment selectes by OLPC project.. And more. And more on lack spanish too..

I think this is done by the marketing group.

*Rosa control center looks better and is integrated with the rest of the system. You can configure samba/nfs shares, proxies and a lot of other things using one application.




> 8. GNOME Shell on Fedora

>

> including gnome-tweak-tool has been suggested to the desktop folks

> several times, but they do not wish it to be included. You can try

> asking again on the desktop list. They feel the 'out of box' setup is

> right, and they don't want to encourage people to 'tweak' it.

>


>By error of some builders, all pay by they? (talking about of
GNOME). If a lot users wants include these tool, dont see for other way.
Is not community >value that defend Fedora. Gnome tweak tool should stay on Desktop edition. I guess.
I cannot even change the sleep settings for my laptop without using gnome tweak tools and these guys think that the out of box setup is right. In kde i can configure all aspects of power management out of the box and in gnome i am not able to do so. Why?

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