Rahul Sundaram wrote:

Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:


So I'm going to ask this question to you, the friendly Fedora
marketing team.


But first, a history lesson:

http://lwn.net/Articles/83360/

This is pretty much the most accurate depiction of how the great brand
gulf between Fedora and Red Hat started. And in many people's minds,
that gulf has grown to such an extent that many don't have any way of
associating Red Hat with Fedora *at all*.


So let me ask you:

If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red
Hat" with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel
about that?


A bit of a odd thing going on here. I just suggested a very similar idea
very recently in the list and two people quoted you to show why I
shouldn't do this. Apparently now that you are for it, I guess it is ok.




Co-branding though is something completely different then putting a cute
little Shadowman in some corner saying truthful things.


Kind regards,

Jeroen van Meeuwen
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Jeroen van Meeuwen wrote:

Rahul Sundaram wrote:

Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:


So I'm going to ask this question to you, the friendly Fedora
marketing team.


But first, a history lesson:

http://lwn.net/Articles/83360/

This is pretty much the most accurate depiction of how the great
brand gulf between Fedora and Red Hat started. And in many people's
minds, that gulf has grown to such an extent that many don't have any
way of associating Red Hat with Fedora *at all*.


So let me ask you:

If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red
Hat" with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all
feel about that?


A bit of a odd thing going on here. I just suggested a very similar
idea very recently in the list and two people quoted you to show why I
shouldn't do this. Apparently now that you are for it, I guess it is ok.




Co-branding though is something completely different then putting a cute
little Shadowman in some corner saying truthful things.


I even gave the same wording "sponsored by Red Hat" so maybe your
interpretations are different. Read the last sentence of my mail.


Rahul

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On Tue, 1 Apr 2008, Francesco Ugolini wrote:


> i will quote GregdeKoenigsberg:
>
> "The Fedora brand must evolve separately from Red Hat's brand. Fedora is very
> important to Red Hat, but Fedora is not Red Hat. It's really crucial to
> understand that distinction."
>
> so -1 again.

+1 to Joerg, and -1 to co-branding.


OK, then, let me propose something different and a bit less intrusive:
maybe we could put a "corporate sponsorship" slide into the Anaconda
install flow? "Thanks to our corporate sponsors". With a big Shadowman,
and then smaller logos from lots of other companies. Since it would just
be a single slide, we could make it as NASCAR-y as we wanted.


--g

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...from him much shall be asked"

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Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:

On Tue, 1 Apr 2008, Francesco Ugolini wrote:


> i will quote GregdeKoenigsberg:
>
> "The Fedora brand must evolve separately from Red Hat's brand.
Fedora is very
> important to Red Hat, but Fedora is not Red Hat. It's really
crucial to

> understand that distinction."
>
> so -1 again.

+1 to Joerg, and -1 to co-branding.


OK, then, let me propose something different and a bit less intrusive:
maybe we could put a "corporate sponsorship" slide into the Anaconda
install flow? "Thanks to our corporate sponsors". With a big
Shadowman, and then smaller logos from lots of other companies. Since
it would just be a single slide, we could make it as NASCAR-y as we wanted.


If you are going to say thanks and you got space, thank the community
too. Even Red Hat Linux Anaconda did that and so did the RHEL 5 promo.


Rahul

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Rahul Sundaram wrote:
I even gave the same wording "sponsored by Red Hat" so maybe your
interpretations are different. Read the last sentence of my mail.


Rahul



There's enough nuance in the subject line to let the last line look
completely different then you may have intended.


Co-branding !== Showing gratefulness independently

-Jeroen

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Jeroen van Meeuwen wrote:

Rahul Sundaram wrote:
A bit of a odd thing going on here. I just suggested a very similar
idea very recently in the list and two people quoted you to show why I
shouldn't do this. Apparently now that you are for it, I guess it is ok.




Co-branding though is something completely different then putting a cute
little Shadowman in some corner saying truthful things.


Yeh co-branding is sort of putting the two brands at the same level or
even combining them into one (E.g. AT&T Wireless & Cingular in the US).
That is what I thought you had brought up earlier.


What Greg is asking about now is a bit different as the RH brand in the
proposed case would be, sort of how when you do a conference T-shirt the
main brand is the conference logo and the sponsors are much much smaller
brands on the back.


~m

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Jeroen van Meeuwen wrote:

Rahul Sundaram wrote:
I even gave the same wording "sponsored by Red Hat" so maybe your
interpretations are different. Read the last sentence of my mail.


Rahul



There's enough nuance in the subject line to let the last line look
completely different then you may have intended.


Co-branding !== Showing gratefulness independently


The example I gave along with the wikipedia reference which talks about
a form of co-branding showing sponsorship information should have made
clear what I meant, and this seems to be nitpicking. Anyway, if you
agree with the example I gave, then we can just move ahead.


Rahul

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Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:


OK, then, let me propose something different and a bit less intrusive:
maybe we could put a "corporate sponsorship" slide into the Anaconda
install flow? "Thanks to our corporate sponsors". With a big
Shadowman, and then smaller logos from lots of other companies. Since
it would just be a single slide, we could make it as NASCAR-y as we wanted.


Memories... I remember the time when I used to sit trough the install to
read the Anaconda slides: a bit of fun, a bit of Red Hat history, a bit
of marketing. Entertaining stuff.


If we get such slides back (I wonder who would to the job to create
them), I think it absolutely make sense to have one about Red Hat.


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2008/4/1, Máirín Duffy <duffy@fedoraproject.org>:

> What Greg is asking about now is a bit different as the RH brand in the
> proposed case would be, sort of how when you do a conference T-shirt the
> main brand is the conference logo and the sponsors are much much smaller
> brands on the back.

I think we have to pay attention not to be misunderstood, many times i
read in the magazines Red Hat Fedora reviews, not Fedora ones, or
people that ask me how to work in RH (O O,) not how to join Fedora
Project.

I agree to underline the important role of RH in the community and
software development (i just expressed my feelingsi days before), but
keep attention to not increase such confusion.

If you will integrate the logo (the majority express their agreement)
please underline "sposored by" or "heavy sponsored by" RH.

That's only a suggestion.

Regards

Francesco Ugolini

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Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:


OK, then, let me propose something different and a bit less intrusive:
maybe we could put a "corporate sponsorship" slide into the Anaconda
install flow? "Thanks to our corporate sponsors". With a big
Shadowman, and then smaller logos from lots of other companies. Since
it would just be a single slide, we could make it as NASCAR-y as we wanted.




I wonder if this will bring back the original reason why we got rid of
the various pictures in Anaconda. Because we can thank someone, only to
have other people we left out upset. We will never remember every
individual or company involved. Also how do you justify thanking only
corporations and not individuals by name?


Just playing devil's advocate here. I'm one of the catalysts leading to
Greg's question in this thread.


Warren Togami
wtogami@redhat.com

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