Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:


So I'm going to ask this question to you, the friendly Fedora marketing
team.


But first, a history lesson:

http://lwn.net/Articles/83360/

This is pretty much the most accurate depiction of how the great brand
gulf between Fedora and Red Hat started. And in many people's minds,
that gulf has grown to such an extent that many don't have any way of
associating Red Hat with Fedora *at all*.


So let me ask you:

If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red
Hat" with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel
about that?


A bit of a odd thing going on here. I just suggested a very similar idea
very recently in the list and two people quoted you to show why I
shouldn't do this. Apparently now that you are for it, I guess it is ok.


Rahul

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On Mon, 2008-03-31 at 17:26 -0400, Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:
>
> If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red Hat"
> with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel about
> that?

I think I'm OK in principle, but can or should we leave the door open to
list other folks here that also sponsor the Fedora project? Dell, IBM
to name a couple, HP/Intel in the ia64 space, Sun in the sparc space,
Marvell in the ARM space, etc... I'm all for having a little more
shadowman in the branding, but I don't want to make it seem like Red Hat
is the only one throwing resources behind the project. Then again, I
also don't want our artwork to start looking like a NASCAR car.

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Hi all
If Fedora really needs a Red Hat logo, son roll back to old redhat versions (i.e Red Hat Community Edition) and thats it...
Things will not change because of Fedora takes a more biggest shadowman logo.
*
IHMO
Pablo Barrera
Fedora Ambassador


*
2008/3/31, Jesse Keating <jkeating@j2solutions.net>:
On Mon, 2008-03-31 at 17:26 -0400, Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:
>
> If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red Hat"

> with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel about
> that?

I think I'm OK in principle, but can or should we leave the door open to
list other folks here that also sponsor the Fedora project?**Dell, IBM

to name a couple, HP/Intel in the ia64 space, Sun in the sparc space,
Marvell in the ARM space, etc...**I'm all for having a little more
shadowman in the branding, but I don't want to make it seem like Red Hat

is the only one throwing resources behind the project.**Then again, I
also don't want our artwork to start looking like a NASCAR car.

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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:

| So let me ask you:
|
| If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red
| Hat" with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel
| about that?

isn't this similar to what
https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-marketing-list/2008-March/msg00212.html
. that thread was against it (or somewhat against) is what i concluded




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Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:


So let me ask you:

If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red
Hat" with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel
about that?


But lately we did work to remove the Fedora "bubble" logo from such
screens and un-brand the graphics to make the life easier for derivative
distros.
I can understand both approaches, but I think we should choose one and
stick with it.


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On Mon, Mar 31, 2008 at 11:26 PM, Greg DeKoenigsberg <gdk@redhat.com> wrote:



So I'm going to ask this question to you, the friendly Fedora marketing

team.



But first, a history lesson:



http://lwn.net/Articles/83360/



This is pretty much the most accurate depiction of how the great brand

gulf between Fedora and Red Hat started. *And in many people's minds, that

gulf has grown to such an extent that many don't have any way of

associating Red Hat with Fedora *at all*.



So let me ask you:



If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red Hat"

with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel about

that?
I fully understand what Redhat has done, rather doing a lot to keep alive Fedora, but i am still confused why we need to mention Redhat's affiliation with Fedora through putting its logo or some complementary statements...?


while on the other hand we are trying for Fedora's NPO to put it independent project. For a layman prospective i d'nt get idea why a user should know about affiliation of a strong/big company to an open source project...in addition there is a lot in media/press about this affiliation, even in Fedora's history page already mentioned, we as Ambassadors do talk about it as well...


In my personal opinion i would rather wish to see Fedora a completely independent project in all aspects, rather known by its parent company.

from my side -1

thanks





--g



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...from him much shall be asked"



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2008/4/1, JoergSimon <jsimon@fedoraproject.org>:
> Am Montag, 31. März 2008 23:26:33 schrieb Greg DeKoenigsberg:
>
> > If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red Hat"
> > with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel about
> > that?
>
>
> Let me answer with a mail i answered to Rahul with a reply from Paul Frields.
> I understand it from the RedHat view. But i don´t like this idea!
>
> cu Joerg
>
>
>
> --
> Jörg Simon
> jsimon@fedoraproject.org
> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JoergSimon
> Key Fingerprint:
> 3691 0989 2DCA 58A2 8D1F 2CAC C823 558E 5B5B 5688
>
>
> ---------- Messaggio inoltrato ----------
> From: "Paul W. Frields" <stickster@gmail.com>
> To: fedora-ambassadors-list@redhat.com
> Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2008 12:10:19 -0400
> Subject: Re: [Ambassadors] Re: Co-branding?
> On Wed, 2008-03-26 at 11:55 +0100, JoergSimon wrote:
> > Am Mittwoch, 26. März 2008 11:18:33 schrieb Rahul Sundaram:
> > > Branding is more concerned with marketing. Besides if ambassadors are
> > > not subscribed to the marketing list, they are not following the
> > > recommend procedure at
> > >
> > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/Join
> >
> > yes
> >
> > > We don't
> > > want to cross post either. Refer
> > > http://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-marketing-list/2007-March/msg00007.ht
> > >ml
> >
> > I know the guidelines very well! It was only to shift it to the people who
> > must deal with the consequences of this issue.
> > And if you want play this odd guideline game, then you must admit, we don´t
> > want discuss the same topics again and again! (There are a lot more ... )
> > https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-marketing-list/2007-July/msg00086.html
> >
> > I want to stop this, because there was enough confusion in the past. And there
> > are clear guidelines that we are not RedHat - and we don´t want.
> >
> > i will quote GregdeKoenigsberg:
> >
> > "The Fedora brand must evolve separately from Red Hat's brand. Fedora is very
> > important to Red Hat, but Fedora is not Red Hat. It's really crucial to
> > understand that distinction."
> >
> > so -1 again.
>
> +1 to Joerg, and -1 to co-branding.
>
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>

+ 1

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On Mon, 31 Mar 2008, Jon Stanley wrote:


Go for it! Maybe we can attempt to repair some of the past "damage"
to the brand. I help in correcting lots of people's perceptions that
things are still how they were in the past.

Now the question is: Is rh_legal OK with this?


I haven't asked yet. But here's the thing:

I CARE A LOT MORE ABOUT WHAT YOU THINK THAT ABOUT WHAT RH LEGAL THINKS.
Because without your support, the Fedora brand is meaningless.


Therefore, if I have mostly +1s from you guys, the next stop is probably
the Fedora Board -- and then, and *only* then, will I go to RH internal
brand / legal folks.


--g

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...from him much shall be asked"

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On Tue, 1 Apr 2008, Rahul Sundaram wrote:


Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:


So I'm going to ask this question to you, the friendly Fedora marketing
team.


But first, a history lesson:

http://lwn.net/Articles/83360/

This is pretty much the most accurate depiction of how the great brand gulf
between Fedora and Red Hat started. And in many people's minds, that gulf
has grown to such an extent that many don't have any way of associating Red
Hat with Fedora *at all*.


So let me ask you:

If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red Hat"
with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel about
that?


A bit of a odd thing going on here. I just suggested a very similar idea very
recently in the list and two people quoted you to show why I shouldn't do
this. Apparently now that you are for it, I guess it is ok.


Heh.

Times change. People do too.

But I want to dig deeper into Joerg's objections -- at least, the ones
that don't involve quoting me.


--g

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...from him much shall be asked"

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On Mon, 31 Mar 2008, Jesse Keating wrote:


On Mon, 2008-03-31 at 17:26 -0400, Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote:


If, in splash screens for Fedora, we put a tasteful "sponsored by Red Hat"
with the Shadowman logo somewhere small... how would you all feel about
that?


I think I'm OK in principle, but can or should we leave the door open to
list other folks here that also sponsor the Fedora project? Dell, IBM
to name a couple, HP/Intel in the ia64 space, Sun in the sparc space,
Marvell in the ARM space, etc... I'm all for having a little more
shadowman in the branding, but I don't want to make it seem like Red Hat
is the only one throwing resources behind the project. Then again, I
also don't want our artwork to start looking like a NASCAR car.


Right. This is the difficulty. In theory, I want to allow space for
other sponsors as well, but you're exactly right: we don't want it to look
like NASCAR.


--g

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...from him much shall be asked"

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