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Old 08-30-2010, 02:42 AM
Mike McGrath
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

FYI everyone, I've now changed all the sysadmin groups to be invite only.
Lots of users would apply and kind of just sit there for months, and
that's not good. So by invite only, one of us has to add users to the
groups and sponsor them at that time.

-Mike

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Old 08-30-2010, 08:21 AM
Oliver Falk
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

Hi Mike!

On 08/30/2010 04:42 AM, Mike McGrath wrote:
> FYI everyone, I've now changed all the sysadmin groups to be invite only.
> Lots of users would apply and kind of just sit there for months, and
> that's not good. So by invite only, one of us has to add users to the
> groups and sponsor them at that time.

I believe I'm still in this group. So feel free to remove me.

Best,
Oliver
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Old 08-30-2010, 01:25 PM
Tajidin Abd
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 4:42 AM, Mike McGrath <mmcgrath@redhat.com> wrote:


FYI everyone, I've now changed all the sysadmin groups to be invite only.

Lots of users would apply and kind of just sit there for months, and

that's not good. *So by invite only, one of us has to add users to the

groups and sponsor them at that time.



* * * *-Mike



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infrastructure mailing list

infrastructure@lists.fedoraproject.org

https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/infrastructure



So i am curious how do you actually contribute with the Infrastructure team. Seems like a caveat here. The wiki page and this email seems to be in conflict please make it consistent across the board. I am new contributor to the Project. So i can give a perspective which is often not voiced. Also i read this link http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_be_a_successful_contributor. However i was met with crickets meaning i got no reply. I understand this Team is one the more important in the Projects. I guess however im a new guy so what i say will be met with some critique. Also i like to give solutions if possible. How about mentoring some new contributors in the Infrastructure Team. So they are monitored what they do. They can learn but still they dont bork things. Just my 2 cents cause we all here to contribute in our little part to the Project. I have find my niche what i do for the Project and I am satisfied. I just speak for the next new contributor that sends a Intro email.





Tajidiin

"You want for your brother what you want for yourself"
--Prophet Muhammad (SAW)




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Old 08-30-2010, 01:36 PM
Mike McGrath
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

On Mon, 30 Aug 2010, Tajidin Abd wrote:

>
>
> On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 4:42 AM, Mike McGrath <mmcgrath@redhat.com> wrote:
> FYI everyone, I've now changed all the sysadmin groups to be invite only.
> Lots of users would apply and kind of just sit there for months, and
> that's not good. *So by invite only, one of us has to add users to the
> groups and sponsor them at that time.
>
> * * * *-Mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> infrastructure mailing list
> infrastructure@lists.fedoraproject.org
> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/infrastructure
>
>
>
> So i am curious how do you actually contribute with the Infrastructure team. Seems like a caveat here. The wiki page and this email seems to be in conflict please make it
> consistent across the board. I am new contributor to the Project. So i can give a perspective which is often not voiced. Also i read this link
> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_be_a_successful_contributor. However i was met with crickets meaning i got no reply. I understand this Team is one the more important in
> the Projects. I guess however im a new guy so what i say will be met with some critique. Also i like to give solutions if possible. How about mentoring some new contributors
> in the Infrastructure Team. So they are monitored what they do. They can learn but still they dont bork things. Just my 2 cents cause we all here to contribute in our little
> part to the Project. I have find my niche what i do for the Project and I am satisfied. I just speak for the next new contributor that sends a Intro email.
>
>

I just re-read the wiki and I don't see any conflicts, can you tell me the
exact text you're concerned with. Also, you say you got no reply after
reading a wiki link, I assume you contacted this list? I try hard to
reply to everyone, sorry I missed your introduction. Couldy ou re-send
it?

More generally, if you're looking to contribute to this team and haven't
already, this is a good link:

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/GettingStarted

-Mike______________________________________________ _
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Old 08-30-2010, 01:52 PM
"Matt Micene"
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

> -----Original Message-----
> From: infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org
> [mailto:infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org] On Behalf Of
> Mike McGrath
> Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 10:42 PM
> To: Infrastructure
> Subject: Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts
>
> FYI everyone, I've now changed all the sysadmin groups to be invite
> only.
> Lots of users would apply and kind of just sit there for months, and
> that's not good. So by invite only, one of us has to add users to the
> groups and sponsor them at that time.
>
> -Mike

Mike,

Does this dovetail with the "promotion paths" we talked about for some
of the more critical groups? Getting invited in, being mentored for a
while and then a combination of the mentee wanting to move up and the
mentor sponsoring them for a group like -main or -dba.

So a new user has to show some interest and initiative in the list and
IRC to get an invite to the main group. And the same to move up to some
of the higher responsibility groups. It makes sense to judge skill and
availability, IMHO.

Course, we run the risk of sounding like Masons ... "The Supreme Council
of the Infrastructures General of the Project Fedora of the
Twenty-second degree of the Ancient and Accepted Linux Distributions"

-Matt
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Old 08-30-2010, 02:11 PM
Mike McGrath
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

On Mon, 30 Aug 2010, Matt Micene wrote:

> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org
> > [mailto:infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org] On Behalf Of
> > Mike McGrath
> > Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 10:42 PM
> > To: Infrastructure
> > Subject: Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts
> >
> > FYI everyone, I've now changed all the sysadmin groups to be invite
> > only.
> > Lots of users would apply and kind of just sit there for months, and
> > that's not good. So by invite only, one of us has to add users to the
> > groups and sponsor them at that time.
> >
> > -Mike
>
> Mike,
>
> Does this dovetail with the "promotion paths" we talked about for some
> of the more critical groups? Getting invited in, being mentored for a
> while and then a combination of the mentee wanting to move up and the
> mentor sponsoring them for a group like -main or -dba.
>
> So a new user has to show some interest and initiative in the list and
> IRC to get an invite to the main group. And the same to move up to some
> of the higher responsibility groups. It makes sense to judge skill and
> availability, IMHO.
>
> Course, we run the risk of sounding like Masons ... "The Supreme Council
> of the Infrastructures General of the Project Fedora of the
> Twenty-second degree of the Ancient and Accepted Linux Distributions"
>

It's certainly like that for -main or -dba. But even for the easier
groups to get into, application for those groups isn't the right way to go.
No one's going to sponsor someone they don't know and haven't worked with
in infrastructure. This just further forces a new user to get to know the
group, look at the tickets, etc while making sure new users don't just
apply and think they're now in the team, or then wait for someone to
sponsor them.

I think the application -> then sponsor method would be idea but it
doesn't work in practice.

-Mike
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Old 08-30-2010, 02:29 PM
"Matt Micene"
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

> -----Original Message-----
> From: infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org
> [mailto:infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org] On Behalf Of
> Mike McGrath
> Sent: Monday, August 30, 2010 10:12 AM
> To: Fedora Infrastructure
> Subject: RE: Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts
>
> It's certainly like that for -main or -dba. But even for the easier
> groups to get into, application for those groups isn't the right way
to
> go.
> No one's going to sponsor someone they don't know and haven't worked
> with
> in infrastructure. This just further forces a new user to get to know
> the
> group, look at the tickets, etc while making sure new users don't just
> apply and think they're now in the team, or then wait for someone to
> sponsor them.

I think that's a key point to get across and may be some of the concern
Tajidiin may have had. How do you contribute and gain that exposure
without being part of the sysadmin group in the first place? Starting
discussions about bugs on the list / in the IRC channel? Responding to
list / IRC questions on tools? Offering to help document the skills and
experience for each FIG ? How do we get that message out and what
sorts of activities are appropriate / expected?

-Matt
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Old 08-30-2010, 02:33 PM
Mike McGrath
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

On Mon, 30 Aug 2010, Matt Micene wrote:

> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org
> > [mailto:infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org] On Behalf Of
> > Mike McGrath
> > Sent: Monday, August 30, 2010 10:12 AM
> > To: Fedora Infrastructure
> > Subject: RE: Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts
> >
> > It's certainly like that for -main or -dba. But even for the easier
> > groups to get into, application for those groups isn't the right way
> to
> > go.
> > No one's going to sponsor someone they don't know and haven't worked
> > with
> > in infrastructure. This just further forces a new user to get to know
> > the
> > group, look at the tickets, etc while making sure new users don't just
> > apply and think they're now in the team, or then wait for someone to
> > sponsor them.
>
> I think that's a key point to get across and may be some of the concern
> Tajidiin may have had. How do you contribute and gain that exposure
> without being part of the sysadmin group in the first place? Starting
> discussions about bugs on the list / in the IRC channel? Responding to
> list / IRC questions on tools? Offering to help document the skills and
> experience for each FIG ? How do we get that message out and what
> sorts of activities are appropriate / expected?
>

We link to the
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_be_a_successful_contributor document
on the getting started page that mentions some techniques you can use. I
still have a lot of people come in looking for "access to things" instead
of work to do which is kind of backwards. But the docs we have in place
are relatively new so we'll see how it goes.

-Mike
_______________________________________________
infrastructure mailing list
infrastructure@lists.fedoraproject.org
https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/infrastructure
 
Old 08-30-2010, 08:25 PM
"Matt Micene"
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

> -----Original Message-----
> From: infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org
> [mailto:infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org] On Behalf Of
> Mike McGrath
> Sent: Monday, August 30, 2010 10:34 AM
> To: Fedora Infrastructure
> Subject: RE: Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts
>
> We link to the
> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_be_a_successful_contributor
> document
> on the getting started page that mentions some techniques you can use.
> I
> still have a lot of people come in looking for "access to things"
> instead
> of work to do which is kind of backwards. But the docs we have in
> place
> are relatively new so we'll see how it goes.
>
> -Mike

Good points. I've done my intro, looked at work that needs to be done,
and volunteered services. So, since I am ungrouped and unsponsored, is
my next step still soliciting for an invite on the list / IRC?

-Matt
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Old 08-30-2010, 08:34 PM
Mike McGrath
 
Default Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts

On Mon, 30 Aug 2010, Matt Micene wrote:

> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org
> > [mailto:infrastructure-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org] On Behalf Of
> > Mike McGrath
> > Sent: Monday, August 30, 2010 10:34 AM
> > To: Fedora Infrastructure
> > Subject: RE: Change with FAS sysadmin-* accounts
> >
> > We link to the
> > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_be_a_successful_contributor
> > document
> > on the getting started page that mentions some techniques you can use.
> > I
> > still have a lot of people come in looking for "access to things"
> > instead
> > of work to do which is kind of backwards. But the docs we have in
> > place
> > are relatively new so we'll see how it goes.
> >
> > -Mike
>
> Good points. I've done my intro, looked at work that needs to be done,
> and volunteered services. So, since I am ungrouped and unsponsored, is
> my next step still soliciting for an invite on the list / IRC?
>

You're still not looking at it the right way. The way you've worded it it
sounds like you're end goal is to be in a sysadmin-* group. You're end
goal should be finding some work to do then finding someone willing to
sponsor you to do that work.

-Mike
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