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Old 05-29-2008, 06:23 PM
John Poelstra
 
Default Fedora Org Clarity Attempt

Watching the FESCo meeting today a lot of things were not clear, but one
thing that stood out too me is that that we really don't have is a clear
picture or agreement on what the "Fedora Org" looks like and and how it
is supposed to work.


I'm sure some out there will think I'm getting to "corporate", however
I've often found that creating picture of things helps to simplify
things in ways that thousands of words can't.


Attached is starting template. Fill out the rest with your ideal
version of what it should all look like and I'd be glad to help refactor
into different proposals. If you won't want to mess with open office...
explain it in text and I'll draw it for you.


John
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Old 05-29-2008, 07:52 PM
"Jeff Spaleta"
 
Default Fedora Org Clarity Attempt

2008/5/29 John Poelstra <poelstra@redhat.com>:
> I'm sure some out there will think I'm getting to "corporate", however I've
> often found that creating picture of things helps to simplify things in ways
> that thousands of words can't.

Yeah, I've tried to suggest a new meme via my Role based SIG proposal.
Which by the way is infinitely better than yours because I used
inkscape and generated
an SVG...with rainbow colors and gradients.

More seriously....
let me suggest that if we are going to think in terms of an
organizational chart as you have proposed...that we do it in a way
that stresses three key factors with regard to relationships among
Fedora subproject units. For this discussion I'm still assuming that
SIGs will be using the role-based concept and thus have a more
complicated structure best illustrated with my super awesome rainbow
svg. And as such they sit somewhat outside a standard organizational
chart because of their highly collaborative nature.

Factor 1: Dispute Resolution
Who do you go to when a subproject can't reach agreement and needs arbitration?

Factor 2: Intra-Project Communication
Which group do you expect a subproject to receive important information from and
to send important information to, to insure communication to other sub-projects.

Factor 3: Oversight
Which other group sets and updates policy boundaries which a
subproject is explicitly constrained by.


In a corporate entity, all of this would be thought of as
accountability... who do you report to.. and the answer would usually
be the same entity for all 3 factors. I'm not sure that is the case
for Fedora, as a volunteer staffed organization.

-jef

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Old 05-29-2008, 10:02 PM
John Poelstra
 
Default Fedora Org Clarity Attempt

Jeff Spaleta said the following on 05/29/2008 12:52 PM Pacific Time:

2008/5/29 John Poelstra <poelstra@redhat.com>:

I'm sure some out there will think I'm getting to "corporate", however I've
often found that creating picture of things helps to simplify things in ways
that thousands of words can't.


Yeah, I've tried to suggest a new meme via my Role based SIG proposal.
Which by the way is infinitely better than yours because I used
inkscape and generated
an SVG...with rainbow colors and gradients.

More seriously....
let me suggest that if we are going to think in terms of an
organizational chart as you have proposed...that we do it in a way
that stresses three key factors with regard to relationships among
Fedora subproject units. For this discussion I'm still assuming that
SIGs will be using the role-based concept and thus have a more
complicated structure best illustrated with my super awesome rainbow
svg. And as such they sit somewhat outside a standard organizational
chart because of their highly collaborative nature.

Factor 1: Dispute Resolution
Who do you go to when a subproject can't reach agreement and needs arbitration?

Factor 2: Intra-Project Communication
Which group do you expect a subproject to receive important information from and
to send important information to, to insure communication to other sub-projects.

Factor 3: Oversight
Which other group sets and updates policy boundaries which a
subproject is explicitly constrained by.


In a corporate entity, all of this would be thought of as
accountability... who do you report to.. and the answer would usually
be the same entity for all 3 factors. I'm not sure that is the case
for Fedora, as a volunteer staffed organization.


I think your three factors are great! With the flattening of many
organizations reporting lines are not as linear as they used to be so I
would disagree that all three factors would be met by one entity.


I think accountability definitely applies to Fedora. Aren't we
accountable to each other as a project to do what we say we will do on a
given task? And if we don't do what we've committed to, the project
suffers?


I don't think accountability only applies to situations where you can be
fired. In my experience, when accountability is crafted well it leads
to be better results, not more bureaucracy.


John

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Old 05-29-2008, 10:18 PM
"Jeff Spaleta"
 
Default Fedora Org Clarity Attempt

On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 2:02 PM, John Poelstra <poelstra@redhat.com> wrote:
> I think accountability definitely applies to Fedora. Aren't we accountable
> to each other as a project to do what we say we will do on a given task?
> And if we don't do what we've committed to, the project suffers?

If I were going to depict accountability as a relationship on the org
chart for us how do i draw a relationship between one person and
everyone in an organizational chart and still have the chart make
sense? If it ends up looking like a graph of the Fedora repository
wide packaging depedancies... its not going to be particularly
helpful.

Yes accountability is there, but I don't think we can easily draw a
group to group relationship for it for our organization.

-jef"we need a 3D org chart that can only be navigated as a layer in
compiz-fusion"spaleta

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Old 05-30-2008, 04:54 PM
Thorsten Leemhuis
 
Default Fedora Org Clarity Attempt

On 29.05.2008 20:23, John Poelstra wrote:
Watching the FESCo meeting today a lot of things were not clear, but one
thing that stood out too me is that that we really don't have is a clear
picture or agreement on what the "Fedora Org" looks like and and how it
is supposed to work. [...]


FYI, during the Core and Extras merge there was a longer discussion
about this topic and there were even some pictures ;-) See for example:


https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2007-January/msg00129.html

Maybe that stuff is a bit of a help for you work now.

Cu
knurd

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