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"Eric H. Christensen" 10-09-2012 04:30 PM

Use of a package?
 
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Is there any way to determine if anyone is using a particular package in Fedora or EPEL?

- -Eric
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Kevin Fenzi 10-09-2012 04:36 PM

Use of a package?
 
On Tue, 9 Oct 2012 12:30:30 -0400
"Eric H. Christensen" <sparks@fedoraproject.org> wrote:

> Is there any way to determine if anyone is using a particular package
> in Fedora or EPEL?

Ask them? ;)

If you mean any kind of automated way, then no, not really.

kevin
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Bruno Wolff III 10-09-2012 04:36 PM

Use of a package?
 
On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 12:30:30 -0400,
"Eric H. Christensen" <sparks@fedoraproject.org> wrote:

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Hash: SHA1

Is there any way to determine if anyone is using a particular package in Fedora or EPEL?


As a first shot, you might see if there are been bugs filed or updated by
end users recently for the package.

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Matthew Miller 10-09-2012 04:51 PM

Use of a package?
 
On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 12:30:30PM -0400, Eric H. Christensen wrote:
> Is there any way to determine if anyone is using a particular package in
> Fedora or EPEL?

Yes, for certain values of "using". You can set up the audit subsystem to
log whenever a command is executed, and then follow back from that to
packages.

Or, for a more limited use, just turn on process accounting. (Less useful,
because the data format is silly, and for example does not store full
pathnames.)

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"Eric H. Christensen" 10-09-2012 05:29 PM

Use of a package?
 
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On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 10:36:16AM -0600, Kevin Fenzi wrote:
> On Tue, 9 Oct 2012 12:30:30 -0400
> "Eric H. Christensen" <sparks@fedoraproject.org> wrote:
>
> > Is there any way to determine if anyone is using a particular package
> > in Fedora or EPEL?
>
> Ask them? ;)
>
> If you mean any kind of automated way, then no, not really.
>
> kevin

Well, if I don't know *if* it's being used I certainly can't ask the unknown masses. :) I was just looking at some of the packages I recently adopted and noted that many of them seem to have dead or dying upstream. That isn't to say the software isn't still useful but if folks aren't using them... You get what I'm saying.

I'd be nice if there was a way for the client to report what packages they have installed (voluntarily, opt-in of course) or a way for the mirrors to report what updates are being pushed. Perhaps a thought for another day.

Thanks,
Eric
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"Eric H. Christensen" 10-09-2012 05:31 PM

Use of a package?
 
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On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 12:51:26PM -0400, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 12:30:30PM -0400, Eric H. Christensen wrote:
> > Is there any way to determine if anyone is using a particular package in
> > Fedora or EPEL?
>
> Yes, for certain values of "using". You can set up the audit subsystem to

I was thinking of 'using' meaning 'have installed'.

- -Eric
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"Richard W.M. Jones" 10-09-2012 06:02 PM

Use of a package?
 
On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 01:29:04PM -0400, Eric H. Christensen wrote:
> I'd be nice if there was a way for the client to report what
> packages they have installed (voluntarily, opt-in of course)

Debian have a nice system called popcon which essentially does this.
You voluntarily install the package ("popularity-content"). The
results are available here:

http://popcon.debian.org/

It's a bit different from (my understanding of) smolt, because it
tracks packages that are installed and uninstalled over the life of
the operating system.

Rich.

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Matthew Miller 10-09-2012 06:07 PM

Use of a package?
 
On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 01:29:04PM -0400, Eric H. Christensen wrote:
> Well, if I don't know *if* it's being used I certainly can't ask the
> unknown masses. :) I was just looking at some of the packages I recently
> adopted and noted that many of them seem to have dead or dying upstream.
> That isn't to say the software isn't still useful but if folks aren't
> using them... You get what I'm saying.

Oooh that. Yes, this would be good -- I understand there's work on a new
"census" program to replace smolt, but I don't know the details.

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Jesse Keating 10-09-2012 06:51 PM

Use of a package?
 
On 10/09/2012 11:07 AM, Matthew Miller wrote:

On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 01:29:04PM -0400, Eric H. Christensen wrote:

Well, if I don't know *if* it's being used I certainly can't ask the
unknown masses. :) I was just looking at some of the packages I recently
adopted and noted that many of them seem to have dead or dying upstream.
That isn't to say the software isn't still useful but if folks aren't
using them... You get what I'm saying.


Oooh that. Yes, this would be good -- I understand there's work on a new
"census" program to replace smolt, but I don't know the details.



Each time this is brought up, the arguments are made that it's flawed
data. Just because a package is installed does not mean that the
package is /used/. Generally this leads to suggestions about tracking
actual launches or access of files of a package, then privacy arguments,
and then nothing happens.


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"Richard W.M. Jones" 10-09-2012 07:05 PM

Use of a package?
 
On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 11:51:56AM -0700, Jesse Keating wrote:
> On 10/09/2012 11:07 AM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> >On Tue, Oct 09, 2012 at 01:29:04PM -0400, Eric H. Christensen wrote:
> >>Well, if I don't know *if* it's being used I certainly can't ask the
> >>unknown masses. :) I was just looking at some of the packages I recently
> >>adopted and noted that many of them seem to have dead or dying upstream.
> >>That isn't to say the software isn't still useful but if folks aren't
> >>using them... You get what I'm saying.
> >
> >Oooh that. Yes, this would be good -- I understand there's work on a new
> >"census" program to replace smolt, but I don't know the details.
> >
>
> Each time this is brought up, the arguments are made that it's
> flawed data. Just because a package is installed does not mean that
> the package is /used/. Generally this leads to suggestions about
> tracking actual launches or access of files of a package, then
> privacy arguments, and then nothing happens.

FWIW popcon sends the atime of package files [all files or just
binaries?] to determine whether a program has been run. I don't know
if this works with relatime or not, but I assume Debian have thought
of this.

Rich.

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