remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

I'd like to remove:

ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates

command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
very small minority of Fedora users.

Comments?

Karel

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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

On Monday, August 29, 2011, 7:54:10 AM, Karel Zak wrote:
> I'd like to remove:
> ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates

> command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
> very small minority of Fedora users.
> Comments?

Why does it matter to you? Why make this change, which will
at best inconvenience that very small minority of Feedora users.?

If it is maintained, and works then it should stay.

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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

> On Monday, August 29, 2011, 7:54:10 AM, Karel Zak wrote:
>> I'd like to remove:
>> ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
>
>> command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
>> very small minority of Fedora users.
>> Comments?
>
> Why does it matter to you? Why make this change, which will
> at best inconvenience that very small minority of Feedora users.?
>
> If it is maintained, and works then it should stay.

+1. I don't use vim or rythmbox or play tremulous, and their presence
doesn't hurt me or my mirror. :)

-J

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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 07:25:18 -0500, JC (Jon) wrote:

>
> > On Monday, August 29, 2011, 7:54:10 AM, Karel Zak wrote:
> >> I'd like to remove:
> >> ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
> >
> >> command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
> >> very small minority of Fedora users.
> >> Comments?
> >
> > Why does it matter to you? Why make this change, which will
> > at best inconvenience that very small minority of Feedora users.?
> >
> > If it is maintained, and works then it should stay.
>
> +1. I don't use vim or rythmbox or play tremulous, and their presence
> doesn't hurt me or my mirror. :)

$ rpm -qf /usr/bin/ddate
util-linux-2.19.1-1.4.fc15.x86_64

As such it is part of every installation. It could be optional instead.

$ man ddate
[...]
|NOTE
| After `X-Day' passed without incident, the Church of the SubGenius
| declared that it had got the year upside down - X-Day is actually in
| 8661 AD rather than 1998 AD. Thus, the True X-Day is Cfn 40, 9827.
[...]

Strange humor to install something like that in a util-linux package.
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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

On 08/29/2011 02:54 PM, Karel Zak wrote:
>
> I'd like to remove:
>
> ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
>
> command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
> very small minority of Fedora users.
>
> Comments?

Please do. This isn't really something that should be dragged in for
every single Fedora installation as part of the util-linux package. If
someone actually misses the command, it can always be resurrected later
in a subpackage.

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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 15:42:18 +0300, KL (Kalev) wrote:

> On 08/29/2011 02:54 PM, Karel Zak wrote:
> >
> > I'd like to remove:
> >
> > ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
> >
> > command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
> > very small minority of Fedora users.
> >
> > Comments?
>
> Please do. This isn't really something that should be dragged in for
> every single Fedora installation as part of the util-linux package. If
> someone actually misses the command, it can always be resurrected later
> in a subpackage.

Someone? A single Discordian follower already, for example? Perhaps that
person will volunteers as the maintainer of a separate package then?
Or wait, if it's just one, why include it in the distribution?

Based on

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism#Discordian_calendar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_the_SubGenius

the ddate command and its manual's level of relationship to a religion (or
a joke religion) enters a grey area with regard to the packaging policies:

| Some examples of content which are not permissable:
|
| Comic book art files
| Religious texts
| ...

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:Guidelines#Code_Vs_Content
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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

> On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 15:42:18 +0300, KL (Kalev) wrote:
>
>> On 08/29/2011 02:54 PM, Karel Zak wrote:
>> >
>> > I'd like to remove:
>> >
>> > ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
>> >
>> > command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
>> > very small minority of Fedora users.
>> >
>> > Comments?
>>
>> Please do. This isn't really something that should be dragged in for
>> every single Fedora installation as part of the util-linux package. If
>> someone actually misses the command, it can always be resurrected later
>> in a subpackage.
>
> Someone? A single Discordian follower already, for example? Perhaps that
> person will volunteers as the maintainer of a separate package then?
> Or wait, if it's just one, why include it in the distribution?
>
> Based on
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism#Discordian_calendar
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_the_SubGenius
>
> the ddate command and its manual's level of relationship to a religion (or
> a joke religion) enters a grey area with regard to the packaging policies:
>
> | Some examples of content which are not permissable:
> |
> | Comic book art files
> | Religious texts
> | ...
>
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:Guidelines#Code_Vs_Content

The Julian and Gregorian calendars are also of religious origin.

-J

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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 08:32:01 -0500, JC (Jon) wrote:

>
> > On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 15:42:18 +0300, KL (Kalev) wrote:
> >
> >> On 08/29/2011 02:54 PM, Karel Zak wrote:
> >> >
> >> > I'd like to remove:
> >> >
> >> > ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
> >> >
> >> > command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
> >> > very small minority of Fedora users.
> >> >
> >> > Comments?
> >>
> >> Please do. This isn't really something that should be dragged in for
> >> every single Fedora installation as part of the util-linux package. If
> >> someone actually misses the command, it can always be resurrected later
> >> in a subpackage.
> >
> > Someone? A single Discordian follower already, for example? Perhaps that
> > person will volunteers as the maintainer of a separate package then?
> > Or wait, if it's just one, why include it in the distribution?
> >
> > Based on
> >
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism#Discordian_calendar
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_the_SubGenius
> >
> > the ddate command and its manual's level of relationship to a religion (or
> > a joke religion) enters a grey area with regard to the packaging policies:
> >
> > | Some examples of content which are not permissable:
> > |
> > | Comic book art files
> > | Religious texts
> > | ...
> >
> > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:Guidelines#Code_Vs_Content
>
> The Julian and Gregorian calendars are also of religious origin.

Apples and oranges.

Do you find anything like in the "SEE ALSO" section of "man ddate" also
in "man date"?
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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

> On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 08:32:01 -0500, JC (Jon) wrote:
>
>>
>> > On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 15:42:18 +0300, KL (Kalev) wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 08/29/2011 02:54 PM, Karel Zak wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > I'd like to remove:
>> >> >
>> >> > ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
>> >> >
>> >> > command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by
>> very
>> >> > very small minority of Fedora users.
>> >> >
>> >> > Comments?
>> >>
>> >> Please do. This isn't really something that should be dragged in for
>> >> every single Fedora installation as part of the util-linux package.
>> If
>> >> someone actually misses the command, it can always be resurrected
>> later
>> >> in a subpackage.
>> >
>> > Someone? A single Discordian follower already, for example? Perhaps
>> that
>> > person will volunteers as the maintainer of a separate package then?
>> > Or wait, if it's just one, why include it in the distribution?
>> >
>> > Based on
>> >
>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism
>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism#Discordian_calendar
>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_the_SubGenius
>> >
>> > the ddate command and its manual's level of relationship to a religion
>> (or
>> > a joke religion) enters a grey area with regard to the packaging
>> policies:
>> >
>> > | Some examples of content which are not permissable:
>> > |
>> > | Comic book art files
>> > | Religious texts
>> > | ...
>> >
>> > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:Guidelines#Code_Vs_Content
>>
>> The Julian and Gregorian calendars are also of religious origin.
>
> Apples and oranges.
>
> Do you find anything like in the "SEE ALSO" section of "man ddate" also
> in "man date"?
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That may be (both are human constructs, it's like say "hey, that's made up
word!", but no, I don't. My point is simply that while it is extremely
silly code, it is in fact code provided by upstream. It's still
maintained, is of a valid license, and I don't see a valid reason to break
with upstream here. If you can convince upstream to split it out or drop
it, great. If not, and there isn't a compelling disk space or security
argument, I really don't see why this should be dropped. I'm looking for
a clear example of demonstrable harm. It's 14k of silliness, not a
rootkit.

-J

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remove ddate(1) command from rawhide
 

On 08/29/2011 05:24 PM, Karel Zak wrote:
> I'd like to remove:
>
> ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
>
> command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
> very small minority of Fedora users.
>
> Comments?

IIRC, you are upstream for this and could do this change upstream and
then, there wouldn't be a debate about this here. Otherwise, make
ddate a sub package and don't install it by default. Solved?

Rahul
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