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Old 08-29-2011, 04:25 PM
"Jon Ciesla"
 
Default remove ddate(1) command from rawhide

> On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 10:27:40 -0500, JC (Jon) wrote:
>
>> I'm not suggesting ddate is mission-critical, I just want reasons for
>> it's
>> removal or re-packaging to be well thought-out, not simply "gosh, I
>> don't
>> sue that, so. . .". Otherwise we'll start dropping games.
>
> Sure (and not limited to games, which are in optional packages, however).
>
> We do that all the time, if a package maintainer no longer considers
> a game (or package in general) worthwhile, and if nobody else volunteers
> to take over a package. Of course, you're free to adapt as many orphans
> as you like, whether actively maintained upstream or ancient.
>
> Eventually, you'll be in the same situation, where you would like to
> drop something, be it a completely optional package or a plugin[*] you
> consider useless, close to useless, or just broken.[*] or a program
> with alternative user-interfaces

Absolutely! I've been there. It's not the retirement of software I
object to in this case, though I prefer to avoid that, it's the arbitrary
deviation from upstream. If the deviation isn't arbitrary, I generally
support it.

All that aside, I'd be sad to see ddate go, but that's totally beside the
point.

-J

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Old 08-29-2011, 04:35 PM
Rahul Sundaram
 
Default remove ddate(1) command from rawhide

On 08/29/2011 07:46 PM, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 9:55 AM, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
>> Otherwise, make
>> ddate a sub package and don't install it by default. Solved?
> As an upstream the willingness of distributions to strip out commands
> which I wanted to provide and don't offer a build option to disable
> via sub-packaging will simply encourage me to pack more functionality
> into single binaries that the distributions won't strip.

That argument totally doesn't apply since the thread was started by the
upstream maintainer. Besides, upstream cannot and should not try to
control how packaging is done. Playing dirty tricks isn't the way to
yield cooperation.

Rahul
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Old 08-29-2011, 05:06 PM
"Richard W.M. Jones"
 
Default remove ddate(1) command from rawhide

On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 08:32:01AM -0500, Jon Ciesla wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 15:42:18 +0300, KL (Kalev) wrote:
> >
> >> On 08/29/2011 02:54 PM, Karel Zak wrote:
> >> >
> >> > I'd like to remove:
> >> >
> >> > ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
> >> >
> >> > command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
> >> > very small minority of Fedora users.
> >> >
> >> > Comments?
> >>
> >> Please do. This isn't really something that should be dragged in for
> >> every single Fedora installation as part of the util-linux package. If
> >> someone actually misses the command, it can always be resurrected later
> >> in a subpackage.
> >
> > Someone? A single Discordian follower already, for example? Perhaps that
> > person will volunteers as the maintainer of a separate package then?
> > Or wait, if it's just one, why include it in the distribution?
> >
> > Based on
> >
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism#Discordian_calendar
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_the_SubGenius
> >
> > the ddate command and its manual's level of relationship to a religion (or
> > a joke religion) enters a grey area with regard to the packaging policies:
> >
> > | Some examples of content which are not permissable:
> > |
> > | Comic book art files
> > | Religious texts
> > | ...
> >
> > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:Guidelines#Code_Vs_Content
>
> The Julian and Gregorian calendars are also of religious origin.

OTOH including tiny programs that remind people that real religious
belief is nonsense has to be a good thing.

Rich.

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Old 08-29-2011, 05:29 PM
inode0
 
Default remove ddate(1) command from rawhide

On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 6:54 AM, Karel Zak <kzak@redhat.com> wrote:
> *I'd like to remove:
>
> * *ddate - converts Gregorian dates to Discordian dates
>
> *command from rawhide (F17). IMHO this crazy command is used by very
> *very small minority of Fedora users.
>
> *Comments?

That would make me very sad. Instead please consider adding
robotfindskitten to util-linux which would make me very happy.

John
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Old 08-31-2011, 02:32 PM
Jerry James
 
Default remove ddate(1) command from rawhide

On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 11:06 AM, Richard W.M. Jones <rjones@redhat.com> wrote:
> OTOH including tiny programs that remind people that real religious
> belief is nonsense has to be a good thing.

On the contrary, biting one's tongue instead of offering off-topic
gratuitous insults to fellow Fedorans has to b a good thing.
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Old 08-31-2011, 03:48 PM
"Richard W.M. Jones"
 
Default remove ddate(1) command from rawhide

Yes, it was a joke and off-topic for this list. (Not on my blog though ..)

Rich.

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Old 08-31-2011, 04:40 PM
Zoltan Boszormenyi
 
Default remove ddate(1) command from rawhide

2011-08-31 16:32 keltezéssel, Jerry James írta:
> On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 11:06 AM, Richard W.M. Jones <rjones@redhat.com> wrote:
>> OTOH including tiny programs that remind people that real religious
>> belief is nonsense has to be a good thing.
> On the contrary, biting one's tongue instead of offering off-topic
> gratuitous insults to fellow Fedorans has to b a good thing.

<sarcarm_mode>
How about removing fortune-mod as well in one go?
A lot of its quotes can be offending to some people.
</sarcasm_mode>

Best regards,
Zoltán Böszörményi

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