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Old 05-07-2011, 01:18 PM
"Jason D. Clinton"
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On May 7, 2011 5:00 AM, "Frank Murphy" <frankly3d@gmail.com> wrote:

>

> On 06/05/11 23:51, Jason D. Clinton wrote:

> > On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 09:03, Frank Murphy <frankly3d@gmail.com

> > <mailto:frankly3d@gmail.com>> wrote:

> >

> > * * Any plans for a gui replacement for gnome-schedule?

> >

> >

> > It doesn't appear to be abandoned:

> > http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-schedule/log/

> >

>

> It's obsoleted by gnome-panel in F15.


File a bug.



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Old 05-07-2011, 01:42 PM
Frank Murphy
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On 07/05/11 14:18, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> On May 7, 2011 5:00 AM, "Frank Murphy" <frankly3d@gmail.com
> <mailto:frankly3d@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > On 06/05/11 23:51, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> > > On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 09:03, Frank Murphy <frankly3d@gmail.com
> <mailto:frankly3d@gmail.com>
> > > <mailto:frankly3d@gmail.com <mailto:frankly3d@gmail.com>>> wrote:
> > >
> > > Any plans for a gui replacement for gnome-schedule?
> > >
> > >
> > > It doesn't appear to be abandoned:
> > > http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-schedule/log/
> > >
> >
> > It's obsoleted by gnome-panel in F15.
>
> File a bug.
>

I was beaten to it:
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=701091


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Old 05-07-2011, 02:02 PM
Mike Chambers
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On Fri, 2011-05-06 at 17:48 -0500, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 08:58, Denys Vlasenko <dvlasenk@redhat.com>
> wrote:
> Gnome 3 is a usability disaster. It added some useful things,
> yes,
> but it also REMOVED some useful things - what a hell!?
> Since when is that a valid development practice?
> Do we hate our users or what?
>
> If you have some constructive feedback to offer, I would be willing to
> help you understand why GNOME 3 is an improvement.
>
>

What and/or how are the extensions to install to help configure/run
gnome-3 better? I have been using KDE but might try gnome-3 again if
have access or know where to find them

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Old 05-07-2011, 02:51 PM
"Richard W.M. Jones"
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On Fri, May 06, 2011 at 03:58:51PM +0200, Denys Vlasenko wrote:
> On Sat, 2011-04-16 at 11:05 +0100, Camilo Mesias wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I made some noises on IRC about people upgrading to F15 (like myself)
> > who would all come across the same surprises and would have to find a
> > way to work around them. I suggested it might help to publish
> > something like release notes but more user oriented, to help to ease
> > the pain (and to defuse the many questions that will undoubtedly find
> > their way to the various support forums). At the time no-one seemed to
> > pick up on the idea.
> >
> > I wrote a blog post about it, maybe not the best way to help Fedora
> > users so feel free to take the idea and the content and repackage it
> > as appropriate.
> >
> > http://littlethorpe.net/wordpress/?p=334 "Fedora 15 Gnome 3 gotchas"
> >
> > If nothing else maybe I have included the right words so that users
> > can Google for 'what the heck happened to my minimise button' or
> > whatever and find some help.
>
> Gnome 3 is a usability disaster. It added some useful things, yes,
> but it also REMOVED some useful things - what a hell!?
> Since when is that a valid development practice?
> Do we hate our users or what?

# yum install @XFCE

Then, log out and at the log in window select "XFCE 4" as the session.

Rich.

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Old 05-07-2011, 02:53 PM
"Richard W.M. Jones"
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On Fri, May 06, 2011 at 05:48:46PM -0500, Jason D. Clinton wrote:
> On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 08:58, Denys Vlasenko <dvlasenk@redhat.com> wrote:
>
> > Gnome 3 is a usability disaster. It added some useful things, yes,
> > but it also REMOVED some useful things - what a hell!?
> > Since when is that a valid development practice?
> > Do we hate our users or what?
> >
>
> If you have some constructive feedback to offer, I would be willing to help
> you understand why GNOME 3 is an improvement.

I think it's this attitude which *is* the problem.

Question: are usability tests done on a regular basis using
real people?

Rich.

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Old 05-07-2011, 04:46 PM
Camilo Mesias
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On Sat, May 7, 2011 at 3:02 PM, Mike Chambers <mike@miketc.net> wrote:
> What and/or how are the extensions to install to help configure/run
> gnome-3 better? *I have been using KDE but might try gnome-3 again if
> have access or know where to find them
>

Hi,

I have:

gnome-shell-extensions-drive-menu-3.0.1-1.f016b9git.fc15.noarch
gnome-tweak-tool-3.0.3-1.fc15.noarch

The only way to find these so far has been to complain bitterly about
stuff and wait for someone to say "you can do that with..."

I honestly can't see any real problems with Gnome3 now, and it is
tidier than the old shell. Nevertheless I expect there will be an
entrenched minority that steadfastly refuse to accept it. OSs move on
and the desktop look and feel should not be underestimated as a
marketing tool. Compared to Windows and Mac the old Gnome looks dated.

That said, I use an XFCE desktop on a VM for most of my stuff at work
and it's fine, I will be pleased if it picks up more users as a result
of this.

-Cam
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Old 05-07-2011, 04:50 PM
Mario Blättermann
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

Am 07.05.2011 16:51, schrieb Richard W.M. Jones:
> On Fri, May 06, 2011 at 03:58:51PM +0200, Denys Vlasenko wrote:
>> On Sat, 2011-04-16 at 11:05 +0100, Camilo Mesias wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I made some noises on IRC about people upgrading to F15 (like myself)
>>> who would all come across the same surprises and would have to find a
>>> way to work around them. I suggested it might help to publish
>>> something like release notes but more user oriented, to help to ease
>>> the pain (and to defuse the many questions that will undoubtedly find
>>> their way to the various support forums). At the time no-one seemed to
>>> pick up on the idea.
>>>
>>> I wrote a blog post about it, maybe not the best way to help Fedora
>>> users so feel free to take the idea and the content and repackage it
>>> as appropriate.
>>>
>>> http://littlethorpe.net/wordpress/?p=334 "Fedora 15 Gnome 3 gotchas"
>>>
>>> If nothing else maybe I have included the right words so that users
>>> can Google for 'what the heck happened to my minimise button' or
>>> whatever and find some help.
>>
>> Gnome 3 is a usability disaster. It added some useful things, yes,
>> but it also REMOVED some useful things - what a hell!?
>> Since when is that a valid development practice?
>> Do we hate our users or what?
>
> # yum install @XFCE
>
> Then, log out and at the log in window select "XFCE 4" as the session.
>
> Rich.
>
That's no solution. We don't want to switch to Xfce, we want to have
back a usable GNOME. I appreciated GNOME for its modularity all the
years. If there's a painless way to get this back and to get my favorite
window manager Fluxbox back into GNOME 3, there's no need to switch the
desktop.

In fact, it was always a task for distributors to make a DE really
usable. Remember the introduction of the Nautilus spatial view in GNOME
2.14. Due to massive user protests, we had our old behavior (as default)
back after some time. The same should happen with the "fallback mode" in
GNOME 3. We need a new GNOME as close as possible to the old one, to
keep the current users. Well, it would be fine to get new GNOME lovers,
but not by kicking the old farts out.

Best Regards,
Mario
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Old 05-07-2011, 05:15 PM
"Clyde E. Kunkel"
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On 05/07/2011 12:50 PM, Mario Blättermann wrote:
> Am 07.05.2011 16:51, schrieb Richard W.M. Jones:
>> On Fri, May 06, 2011 at 03:58:51PM +0200, Denys Vlasenko wrote:
>>> On Sat, 2011-04-16 at 11:05 +0100, Camilo Mesias wrote:

>>>> <snip>

> GNOME 3. We need a new GNOME as close as possible to the old one, to
> keep the current users. Well, it would be fine to get new GNOME lovers,
> but not by kicking the old farts out.

Hey, I resemble that crack. Gnome 3 has not kicked me out and the more
I use it, the more I like it. Just shows that you can teach an old dog
new tricks!!


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Old 05-07-2011, 05:23 PM
Michael Schwendt
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On Sat, 07 May 2011 13:15:11 -0400, CEK wrote:

> On 05/07/2011 12:50 PM, Mario Blättermann wrote:
> > Am 07.05.2011 16:51, schrieb Richard W.M. Jones:
> >> On Fri, May 06, 2011 at 03:58:51PM +0200, Denys Vlasenko wrote:
> >>> On Sat, 2011-04-16 at 11:05 +0100, Camilo Mesias wrote:
>
> >>>> <snip>
>
> > GNOME 3. We need a new GNOME as close as possible to the old one, to
> > keep the current users. Well, it would be fine to get new GNOME lovers,
> > but not by kicking the old farts out.
>
> Hey, I resemble that crack. Gnome 3 has not kicked me out and the more
> I use it, the more I like it. Just shows that you can teach an old dog
> new tricks!!

It's entertaining already to see how people [try to] leave Ubuntu because
of Unity, and to hear that they like Fedora 15's GNOME 3 better.
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Old 05-07-2011, 06:15 PM
"Clyde E. Kunkel"
 
Default Fedora 15 / Gnome 3 gotchas

On 05/07/2011 01:23 PM, Michael Schwendt wrote:
> On Sat, 07 May 2011 13:15:11 -0400, CEK wrote:
>
>>
>>>>>> <snip>
>>
>>>
>
> It's entertaining already to see how people [try to] leave Ubuntu because
> of Unity, and to hear that they like Fedora 15's GNOME 3 better.

(sorry, going way off topic, but then it seems Gnome 3 has invaded many
lists)

Yeah...I tried Ubuntu/Unity and didn't care for it at all. Of course
that was after experiencing Gnome 3.

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